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It's unlikely to happen as the vast majority of the public simply does not care. There is a deep technological disconnect. The only way to de-google-ify is to

It's unlikely to happen as the vast majority of the public simply does not care. There is a deep technological disconnect. The only way to de-google-ify is to bring about mesh network that runs on our mobile devices or volunteer run nodes. Maybe you need to take the Skytrain to a remote part of the city to access specific information because there are no nodes there yet. The centralized infrastructure created between telecom companies which inevitably under the control of you know who makes it very difficult to be truly decentralized and free ourselves from corporations that provide a better user experience. It's tougher to do on a decentralized platform but I fear that it will do little to sway herd behavior-vast majority of the population are clueless about the underlying technology and can't be bothered. That might change in the future but for now, it's the people who are unwilling to make a change, especially outside of HN and tech circles that is the big challenge. A bigger campaign that really sells the value of de-google-ify is going to take lot of resources and earn the ire of Google who is unlikely to support their own demise.

superkuh 10y ago
As more and more ISP implement data caps and prioritize only some traffic mesh nets and other p2p software will soon become infeasible for most users. Already with Comcast putting a 1 TB cap on my data (up+down) I'm feeling the pressure to shut down my Bitcoin full node and I've stopped contributing bandwidth to I2P.
cortesoft 10y ago
I think the public doesn't care for a good reason; no one has articulated a realistic, tangible cost to quality of life caused by letting Google track you. Lots of people talk about it being 'creepy' and dreaming up possible scenarios where it WOUDLD be costly, but for most people, the costs simply aren't actually felt. I am trying to think about it for me personally, and I can't come up with a single time that Google tracking me has had a negative impact on my life. I know people have examples for themselves, but none resonate with me as being something I am at risk for. Seriously, though; how is my life negatively impacted (in actuality, not hypothetically), in a way that I can notice the difference, by letting Google track me?
- bad_user 10y ago
  They can change your perception of anything, leading you to buying stupid shit you don't need, or to voting for somebody that doesn't protect your interests. And any piece of knowledge is dangerous in the right context. This is usually felt more strongly by minorities. You're actually privileged if you're a straight, white, middle class male, but even so you can end up being harassed and hurt for who you are. Have you ever cheated on your wife? Have you ever spoken against powerful men? Do you walk funny? I was born in 1982, so I caught a couple of years of communist in Romania. And let me tell you, the atmosphere, the paranoia, the secret service of a police state managing to change the fabric of society by using a huge network of informants and fear was far, far more interesting than the 1984 novel. And if you think it can't happen to you, then think again, because at least your parents were alive when such things happened for real.
  - estel 10y ago
    These all feel like hypothetical examples of potential problems to me. Yes, I have a heap of privilege, and I can understand why people might be concerned about these things, but deep down I don't believe (still!) that Adwords is something that puts these minorities at risk.
    - tajen 10y ago
      > but deep down I don't believe that AdWords is something that puts these minorities at risk Case in point example! On Twitter Ads, I select the gender "male" for my projects. It's because my software sells twice better to males, but if everyone notices the same, it'll also mean women aren't properly informed of software options on the market. Having the gender on the ad platform provokes a discrimination by minorities.
  - cortesoft 10y ago
    A network of informants that feed information to a police state that harasses you based on that information is objectively horrible. I think the connection of that police state to Google tracking your search and browsing history is a bit tenuous, however. Sure, if that police state existed and I lived in it, then Google's trove of information would certainly be useful to it. If I begin to believe the state that I live in is becoming that police state, I will certainly curtail my Google searching. Of course, you might say, "But wait! You might not live in a police state now, but if your current state changes to become one, they might use your historical search history from before the rise of the police state to persecute you!" Yes, this is true. However, they could also use my many public things I have said against me. I have said and written many things that a police state might find dangerous, and persecute me for. I can't possibly live my life trying to avoid creating any record of my life that a possible future police state could use against me. That would be impractical and possibly unfeasible. If I live my life like that, I would be living as if I already lived in a police state by my own choice. That seems counter productive.
seppin 10y ago
> It's unlikely to happen as the vast majority of the public simply does not care. There is a deep technological disconnect. Same thing in the music industry, most people just want sound on in the background.
thebaer 10y ago
You're right they don't care, but that doesn't mean it's hopeless. It's up to developers and companies to actually create the pure utilities the free software movement advocates, and sell it not on "freedom and decentralization," but on "our products give you more value than Google's do." We'll never get the public to care about these things unless we silently provide them behind actually-useful products. We consumers build our lives off readily-available utilities, generally not caring about what they're doing behind the scenes, because we want a blackbox we can trust. We all want to save time and get on with our lives. So we need more companies that exist as utilities, grow their network / market share, and don't sell out at the end of the day. Of course, creating the conditions to make that happen is a whole 'nother thing :)

superkuh 10y ago

As more and more ISP implement data caps and prioritize only some traffic mesh nets and other p2p software will soon become infeasible for most users. Already with Comcast putting a 1 TB cap on my data (up+down) I'm feeling the pressure to shut down my Bitcoin full node and I've stopped contributing bandwidth to I2P.

cortesoft 10y ago

I think the public doesn't care for a good reason; no one has articulated a realistic, tangible cost to quality of life caused by letting Google track you. Lots of people talk about it being 'creepy' and dreaming up possible scenarios where it WOUDLD be costly, but for most people, the costs simply aren't actually felt. I am trying to think about it for me personally, and I can't come up with a single time that Google tracking me has had a negative impact on my life. I know people have examples for themselves, but none resonate with me as being something I am at risk for. Seriously, though; how is my life negatively impacted (in actuality, not hypothetically), in a way that I can notice the difference, by letting Google track me?

bad_user 10y ago
They can change your perception of anything, leading you to buying stupid shit you don't need, or to voting for somebody that doesn't protect your interests. And any piece of knowledge is dangerous in the right context. This is usually felt more strongly by minorities. You're actually privileged if you're a straight, white, middle class male, but even so you can end up being harassed and hurt for who you are. Have you ever cheated on your wife? Have you ever spoken against powerful men? Do you walk funny? I was born in 1982, so I caught a couple of years of communist in Romania. And let me tell you, the atmosphere, the paranoia, the secret service of a police state managing to change the fabric of society by using a huge network of informants and fear was far, far more interesting than the 1984 novel. And if you think it can't happen to you, then think again, because at least your parents were alive when such things happened for real.
- estel 10y ago
  These all feel like hypothetical examples of potential problems to me. Yes, I have a heap of privilege, and I can understand why people might be concerned about these things, but deep down I don't believe (still!) that Adwords is something that puts these minorities at risk.
  - tajen 10y ago
    > but deep down I don't believe that AdWords is something that puts these minorities at risk Case in point example! On Twitter Ads, I select the gender "male" for my projects. It's because my software sells twice better to males, but if everyone notices the same, it'll also mean women aren't properly informed of software options on the market. Having the gender on the ad platform provokes a discrimination by minorities.
- cortesoft 10y ago
  A network of informants that feed information to a police state that harasses you based on that information is objectively horrible. I think the connection of that police state to Google tracking your search and browsing history is a bit tenuous, however. Sure, if that police state existed and I lived in it, then Google's trove of information would certainly be useful to it. If I begin to believe the state that I live in is becoming that police state, I will certainly curtail my Google searching. Of course, you might say, "But wait! You might not live in a police state now, but if your current state changes to become one, they might use your historical search history from before the rise of the police state to persecute you!" Yes, this is true. However, they could also use my many public things I have said against me. I have said and written many things that a police state might find dangerous, and persecute me for. I can't possibly live my life trying to avoid creating any record of my life that a possible future police state could use against me. That would be impractical and possibly unfeasible. If I live my life like that, I would be living as if I already lived in a police state by my own choice. That seems counter productive.

seppin 10y ago

> It's unlikely to happen as the vast majority of the public simply does not care. There is a deep technological disconnect. Same thing in the music industry, most people just want sound on in the background.

thebaer 10y ago

You're right they don't care, but that doesn't mean it's hopeless. It's up to developers and companies to actually create the pure utilities the free software movement advocates, and sell it not on "freedom and decentralization," but on "our products give you more value than Google's do." We'll never get the public to care about these things unless we silently provide them behind actually-useful products. We consumers build our lives off readily-available utilities, generally not caring about what they're doing behind the scenes, because we want a blackbox we can trust. We all want to save time and get on with our lives. So we need more companies that exist as utilities, grow their network / market share, and don't sell out at the end of the day. Of course, creating the conditions to make that happen is a whole 'nother thing :)