5 ms·

But Nvidia's proprietary driver is a download right? Why is AMD trying to merge theirs into the kernel?

by pcr0 10y ago

theparanoid 10y ago
It's already part of the kernel, this was a re-architecture of the display portion of the driver.
ajdlinux 10y ago
The amdgpu driver is open source, not proprietary.
- gonmf 10y ago
  Open source != free software.
  - wolfgke 10y ago
    The difference between open source and free software is mostly in the political camp the word comes from. Read the OSI definition of open source if you don't believe: > https://opensource.org/osd-annotated https://opensource.org/osd-annotated The reasons why "free software" people don't like the word "open source" are indeed political: > https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/open-source-misses-the-point.html https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/open-source-misses-the-point.... For software for which the source code is available, but does not give the four freedoms: > https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html#content https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html#content it is common to use the word "shared source" (originally devised by Microsoft): > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shared_source https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shared_source
  - SXX 10y ago
    Kernel driver of proprietary AMDGPU-PRO are licensed exactly same way as modules in mainline kernel. Most of them dual-licensed under MIT and GPL so BSD and other projects can use them.
  - majewsky 10y ago
    But it is free software. It resides in the kernel tree: https://git.kernel.org/cgit/linux/kernel/git/stable/linux-stable.git/tree/drivers/gpu/drm/amd/amdgpu?id=refs/tags/v4.8.13 https://git.kernel.org/cgit/linux/kernel/git/stable/linux-st...
wtallis 10y ago
AMD's recent strategy has been to try to confine the proprietary stuff to userspace, and to implement an open-source kernel driver that can be used by either the proprietary userspace driver or open-source userspace stack.
Qwertious 10y ago
Nvidia's proprietary driver breaks upon every new kernel release, which is why they have a shim. Furthermore, Nvidia can't ship their driver in the official Linux kernel due to copyright issues, and they're forced to handle all the maintenance burden of their driver (whereas AMD reaps the benefits of Intel's GPU driver bugfixing, and vice versa, thus lowering both Intel's and AMD's driver costs on Linux). Besides, Nvidia's been having trouble with their Tegra GPUs on Android, and as a result have been forced to pitch in a bit on Nouveau (the reverse-engineered open-source Nvidia driver). They're still having trouble with their driver situation on mobile, as a result of their unwillingness to play ball with the kernel. Actually, that last sentence above - I'm really not too confident on that, I've heard various hearsay but the only source I concretely remember is the "other drivers" section of http://richg42.blogspot.com.au/2014/05/the-truth-on-opengl-driver-quality.html http://richg42.blogspot.com.au/2014/05/the-truth-on-opengl-d...
- Nullabillity 10y ago
  > Furthermore, Nvidia can't ship their driver in the official Linux kernel Nvidia has every ability to ship it, they just refuse to open it.
  - valdiorn 10y ago
    probably rightfully so, if this is the sort of welcome they'd get.
    - Kubuxu 10y ago
      There is huge difference between opening code and merging it to the Linux kernel.
    - pif 10y ago
      Opening their driver's code is different from merging it into the kernel source.
- alkonaut 10y ago
  > Nvidia's proprietary driver breaks upon every new kernel release, which is why they have a shim. ELI5: why does each Linux kernel release break driver code? It can't be THAT hard to just have a stable interface and leave it for long periods of time, e.g. only bumping it on major version bumps in the Kernel?
topkekz 10y ago
https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=amd_catalyst_kernel&num=1 https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=amd_cata... Note that both the amd and the nvidia kernel modules always have been FOSS because of the GPL license. It's just that nvidia provides it by its own ways, not through the official linux branch, and thus doesn't have to respect linux rules nor to document the driver.
- SXX 10y ago
  Note that both the amd and the nvidia kernel modules always have been FOSS because of the GPL license. Only open source part of their modules was shim while 99% of driver is contained in blob. That's true for both Nvidia or ATI/AMD fglrx.

But Nvidia's proprietary driver is a download right? Why is AMD trying to merge theirs into the kernel?

by pcr0 10y ago

But Nvidia's proprietary driver is a download right? Why is AMD trying to merge theirs into the kernel?

theparanoid 10y ago

It's already part of the kernel, this was a re-architecture of the display portion of the driver.

ajdlinux 10y ago

The amdgpu driver is open source, not proprietary.

gonmf 10y ago
Open source != free software.
- wolfgke 10y ago
  The difference between open source and free software is mostly in the political camp the word comes from. Read the OSI definition of open source if you don't believe: > https://opensource.org/osd-annotated https://opensource.org/osd-annotated The reasons why "free software" people don't like the word "open source" are indeed political: > https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/open-source-misses-the-point.html https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/open-source-misses-the-point.... For software for which the source code is available, but does not give the four freedoms: > https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html#content https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html#content it is common to use the word "shared source" (originally devised by Microsoft): > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shared_source https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shared_source
- SXX 10y ago
  Kernel driver of proprietary AMDGPU-PRO are licensed exactly same way as modules in mainline kernel. Most of them dual-licensed under MIT and GPL so BSD and other projects can use them.
- majewsky 10y ago
  But it is free software. It resides in the kernel tree: https://git.kernel.org/cgit/linux/kernel/git/stable/linux-stable.git/tree/drivers/gpu/drm/amd/amdgpu?id=refs/tags/v4.8.13 https://git.kernel.org/cgit/linux/kernel/git/stable/linux-st...

wtallis 10y ago

AMD's recent strategy has been to try to confine the proprietary stuff to userspace, and to implement an open-source kernel driver that can be used by either the proprietary userspace driver or open-source userspace stack.

Qwertious 10y ago

Nvidia's proprietary driver breaks upon every new kernel release, which is why they have a shim. Furthermore, Nvidia can't ship their driver in the official Linux kernel due to copyright issues, and they're forced to handle all the maintenance burden of their driver (whereas AMD reaps the benefits of Intel's GPU driver bugfixing, and vice versa, thus lowering both Intel's and AMD's driver costs on Linux). Besides, Nvidia's been having trouble with their Tegra GPUs on Android, and as a result have been forced to pitch in a bit on Nouveau (the reverse-engineered open-source Nvidia driver). They're still having trouble with their driver situation on mobile, as a result of their unwillingness to play ball with the kernel. Actually, that last sentence above - I'm really not too confident on that, I've heard various hearsay but the only source I concretely remember is the "other drivers" section of http://richg42.blogspot.com.au/2014/05/the-truth-on-opengl-driver-quality.html http://richg42.blogspot.com.au/2014/05/the-truth-on-opengl-d...

Nullabillity 10y ago
> Furthermore, Nvidia can't ship their driver in the official Linux kernel Nvidia has every ability to ship it, they just refuse to open it.
- valdiorn 10y ago
  probably rightfully so, if this is the sort of welcome they'd get.
  - Kubuxu 10y ago
    There is huge difference between opening code and merging it to the Linux kernel.
  - pif 10y ago
    Opening their driver's code is different from merging it into the kernel source.
alkonaut 10y ago
> Nvidia's proprietary driver breaks upon every new kernel release, which is why they have a shim. ELI5: why does each Linux kernel release break driver code? It can't be THAT hard to just have a stable interface and leave it for long periods of time, e.g. only bumping it on major version bumps in the Kernel?

topkekz 10y ago

https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=amd_catalyst_kernel&num=1 https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=article&item=amd_cata... Note that both the amd and the nvidia kernel modules always have been FOSS because of the GPL license. It's just that nvidia provides it by its own ways, not through the official linux branch, and thus doesn't have to respect linux rules nor to document the driver.

SXX 10y ago
Note that both the amd and the nvidia kernel modules always have been FOSS because of the GPL license. Only open source part of their modules was shim while 99% of driver is contained in blob. That's true for both Nvidia or ATI/AMD fglrx.