5 ms·

> Microsoft’s dominance in PCs means it’s the only company likely to pull it off at scale. Try they might, but it's not going to work of you don't have another

> Microsoft’s dominance in PCs means it’s the only company likely to pull it off at scale. Try they might, but it's not going to work of you don't have another piece of the puzzle i.e. Mobile. Microsoft is so much out of the mobile game, no matter what it's gonna do on PC, it'll not work. The windows phone is dead as a dodo, and they've nothing to show on mobile. It'll take extraordinary efforts to get their continuum working on Apple/Google walled gardens. This will fizzle out soon, not because of the technical merits, but due to App Store politics.

ianai 10y ago
I don't think you can count Microsoft out of entering a market. They have the capital to startup and launch in probably any industry, including big pharma. I also think it'd be dangerous for Apple or google to count Microsoft out. Furthermore the economist in me wants to see many more options in the IT industry than just 2-3 so adding one more is welcome.
- tluyben2 10y ago
  > They have the capital to startup and launch in probably any industry, They tried that more than a few times and failed. X-box worked, but portable music players, mobile and search would be things they pumped massive amounts of money into and didn't get very far with. But yes, I would like choice above all. I am not a big Windows fan, but Android is really starting to annoy me and iOS (or at least the rules around iOS) is too limited for what I do with computers/phones/tablets.
  - encoderer 10y ago
    Fairly sure Bing makes them heaps of money now.
  - UK-AL 10y ago
    Bing has 30-40% of the market for search. Remember lots of search engines are just rebranded bing.
    - bitmapbrother 10y ago
      40% in the US seems way too high. And a large part of that percentage probably comes from Yahoo - whose future seems uncertain. Also, a lot of those rebranding efforts aren't exactly free so any money they do make is usually shared.
    - euyyn 10y ago
      This https://www.searchenginejournal.com/august-2016-search-market-share/172078/ https://www.searchenginejournal.com/august-2016-search-marke... says Google is 80% on desktop, higher if you count mobile too (for which it is 95%). Oh, if you mean US only then these other people https://www.statista.com/statistics/267161/market-share-of-search-engines-in-the-united-states/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/267161/market-share-of-s... say Google is 64%, yeah.
    - PudgePacket 10y ago
      That's a pretty big claim.. Hate to be that person but do you have any sources on that?
  - nailer 10y ago
    They pumped massive amounts of money into mobile and won it. Windows Mobile destroyed the previous incumbent Palm. Sure, they subsequently lost it, but let's not be too quick to forget.
- FlyingSnake 10y ago
  Apple/Google aren't discounting MS, they just need to control their walled garden and contunuum will be DOA. MS had time and again failed miserably to gain foothold in mobile, and failed miserably. MS is like IBM in the 90s, it's past its prime.
- bitmapbrother 10y ago
  What market are they entering? Mobile? Didn't they just quietly step away from it from it after losing more than 10 Billion and achieving a less than 1% market share?
  - ianai 10y ago
    Leaving a market doesn't mean Microsoft can't re enter.
gr3yh47 10y ago
yeah their total lack of market share in mobile is going to be much more of a limiting factor than their dominance in PC OS will help them
scholia 10y ago
Microsoft is in mobile: it already has dozens of apps on both iOS and Android. It really doesn't care whose phone you use, it just wants you to use its apps to access your data on Azure. If your data is in OneDrive, you can access it using anything that has a browser, including a Chromebook.
- angryteabag 10y ago
  I think they need to focus more on encouraging developers to get into making Apps for their platform. In my opinion, we don't need another platform to learn - you can see how many people agree with me when you look at how prevalent web > native technologies are right now. PhoneGap, ReactNative, NativeScript. If Microsoft decided to focus on Edge, not as a token "we still make browsers" gesture, but with a genuine interest to innovate. They focused on web technologies, providing native support for web within their operating systems. Support in ways other manufacturers haven't. Imagine if their app store was a place where you could publish a progressive web app (along side their current apps). How low would the barrier of entry be then?
  - int_19h 10y ago
    > Imagine if their app store was a place where you could publish a progressive web app (along side their current apps). How low would the barrier of entry be then? Win10 (UWP) apps can be written entirely in HTML5/JS: https://msdn.microsoft.com/windows/uwp/get-started/create-a-hello-world-app-js-universal https://msdn.microsoft.com/windows/uwp/get-started/create-a-... Insofar as the HTML and JS standards specify APIs, it uses them - e.g. you get IndexedDB, websockets, canvas, WebGL etc. For OS-specific things that aren't covered by the standards, you invoke WinRT APIs directly, but they're exposed as JS objects (and in a way that maps naturally to idiomatic JS - e.g. callbacks for async). All this has been there since Win8. What more, Microsoft is also investing into PhoneGap, e.g. by adding direct support for it in its tooling: https://www.visualstudio.com/vs/cordova/ https://www.visualstudio.com/vs/cordova/ so as to encourage people developing HTML-based apps for other platforms, which would, coincidentally, then be easier to port to UWP. So if you're right, then this is already actively being pursued. But so far it doesn't seem to be having a big effect.

ianai 10y ago

I don't think you can count Microsoft out of entering a market. They have the capital to startup and launch in probably any industry, including big pharma. I also think it'd be dangerous for Apple or google to count Microsoft out. Furthermore the economist in me wants to see many more options in the IT industry than just 2-3 so adding one more is welcome.

tluyben2 10y ago
> They have the capital to startup and launch in probably any industry, They tried that more than a few times and failed. X-box worked, but portable music players, mobile and search would be things they pumped massive amounts of money into and didn't get very far with. But yes, I would like choice above all. I am not a big Windows fan, but Android is really starting to annoy me and iOS (or at least the rules around iOS) is too limited for what I do with computers/phones/tablets.
- encoderer 10y ago
  Fairly sure Bing makes them heaps of money now.
- UK-AL 10y ago
  Bing has 30-40% of the market for search. Remember lots of search engines are just rebranded bing.
  - bitmapbrother 10y ago
    40% in the US seems way too high. And a large part of that percentage probably comes from Yahoo - whose future seems uncertain. Also, a lot of those rebranding efforts aren't exactly free so any money they do make is usually shared.
  - euyyn 10y ago
    This https://www.searchenginejournal.com/august-2016-search-market-share/172078/ https://www.searchenginejournal.com/august-2016-search-marke... says Google is 80% on desktop, higher if you count mobile too (for which it is 95%). Oh, if you mean US only then these other people https://www.statista.com/statistics/267161/market-share-of-search-engines-in-the-united-states/ https://www.statista.com/statistics/267161/market-share-of-s... say Google is 64%, yeah.
  - PudgePacket 10y ago
    That's a pretty big claim.. Hate to be that person but do you have any sources on that?
- nailer 10y ago
  They pumped massive amounts of money into mobile and won it. Windows Mobile destroyed the previous incumbent Palm. Sure, they subsequently lost it, but let's not be too quick to forget.
FlyingSnake 10y ago
Apple/Google aren't discounting MS, they just need to control their walled garden and contunuum will be DOA. MS had time and again failed miserably to gain foothold in mobile, and failed miserably. MS is like IBM in the 90s, it's past its prime.
bitmapbrother 10y ago
What market are they entering? Mobile? Didn't they just quietly step away from it from it after losing more than 10 Billion and achieving a less than 1% market share?
- ianai 10y ago
  Leaving a market doesn't mean Microsoft can't re enter.

gr3yh47 10y ago

yeah their total lack of market share in mobile is going to be much more of a limiting factor than their dominance in PC OS will help them

scholia 10y ago

Microsoft is in mobile: it already has dozens of apps on both iOS and Android. It really doesn't care whose phone you use, it just wants you to use its apps to access your data on Azure. If your data is in OneDrive, you can access it using anything that has a browser, including a Chromebook.

angryteabag 10y ago
I think they need to focus more on encouraging developers to get into making Apps for their platform. In my opinion, we don't need another platform to learn - you can see how many people agree with me when you look at how prevalent web > native technologies are right now. PhoneGap, ReactNative, NativeScript. If Microsoft decided to focus on Edge, not as a token "we still make browsers" gesture, but with a genuine interest to innovate. They focused on web technologies, providing native support for web within their operating systems. Support in ways other manufacturers haven't. Imagine if their app store was a place where you could publish a progressive web app (along side their current apps). How low would the barrier of entry be then?
- int_19h 10y ago
  > Imagine if their app store was a place where you could publish a progressive web app (along side their current apps). How low would the barrier of entry be then? Win10 (UWP) apps can be written entirely in HTML5/JS: https://msdn.microsoft.com/windows/uwp/get-started/create-a-hello-world-app-js-universal https://msdn.microsoft.com/windows/uwp/get-started/create-a-... Insofar as the HTML and JS standards specify APIs, it uses them - e.g. you get IndexedDB, websockets, canvas, WebGL etc. For OS-specific things that aren't covered by the standards, you invoke WinRT APIs directly, but they're exposed as JS objects (and in a way that maps naturally to idiomatic JS - e.g. callbacks for async). All this has been there since Win8. What more, Microsoft is also investing into PhoneGap, e.g. by adding direct support for it in its tooling: https://www.visualstudio.com/vs/cordova/ https://www.visualstudio.com/vs/cordova/ so as to encourage people developing HTML-based apps for other platforms, which would, coincidentally, then be easier to port to UWP. So if you're right, then this is already actively being pursued. But so far it doesn't seem to be having a big effect.