4 ms·

> but they make money along the way Only killing a few people in the process, but hey who am I to judge?

AlgorithmicTime 10y ago
But fewer than the number who would be killed in Tesla cars if the cars lacked the self-driving features.
photogrammetry 10y ago
Are you implying that Tesla killed the (1 person, not people) who decided to let his car slam into a tractor-trailer on cruise control? It's not a problem to you that, say, Apple has "financed the suicides of dozens of Foxconn workers," or that GM killed 140 people by suppressing information on a defective ignition switch, or that Lockheed Martin and Halliburton buoy their stock by selling weapons to kill hundreds of thousands of people? Evidently, you must find totally acceptable the gun-running, terrorist-sponsoring activities of HSBC in the last few years. I bet Google's permabanning of people from their own Google Apps accounts (because they were reselling a couple Pixel phones) is ethically fine with you, as well. Never mind the tens of thousands of preventable automobile deaths yearly because car manufacturers refuse to implement even the most rudimentary of Autopilot functions. Yeah, totally reasonable to pick on the electric car / solar battery company with $3b in revenue since one dope decided to drive into a truck and behead himself. There's nobody else deserving of criticism whatsoever. Let's not even get started with how cocky their CEO has been with his fancy sustainable business plans! p.s. I won't even attempt an ad hominem at the guy selling homeopathics and 'nutritional supplements' in this thread.
- legolas2412 10y ago
  I'm going to ignore the whataboutism you spew. Also, Elon musk has done amazing work with electric cars, sustainable energy and space travel. No doubt about that. But this is about Autopilot, a collection of driver assistance program. Not sure about OP, but my spite with Tesla is that they are pushing the above-mentioned driver assistance programs as self-driving features. This over-selling is going to kill people. And for your information, lane keeping assist, lane driving assist, automated cruise control (which is pretty much AP1.0) have been present in several cars. Even self parking has been demoed by several cars. Add in automatic lane changing (which doesn't sound difficult to me), it wraps up Enhanced AP1.0. Does that sound like a completely autonomous self driving car? Because that's what the public perception is like.
  - MicroBerto 10y ago
    > This over-selling is going to kill people. Yes, this is what I meant in my comment. I know there are going to be massive hurdles here, but Tesla seems to be shooting from the hip wayyyy too much for my comfort level. I'm not a full believer that this can only be solved by OTA software updates. If that Tesla had a LIDAR on top of the car like Google's vehicles do, a man would still be alive. > whataboutism That was a very nice way of putting that pile of rubbish of a comment. You must have made it further than I did, I stopped reading at the word "decided". You are too kind.
  - dang 10y ago
    Please don't call names ('you spew') in arguments. If someone is wrong, explain so civilly. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html
    - MicroBerto 10y ago
      How is "you spew" namecalling? I was the one personally attacked in this thread, not the other way around. Just because my comment doesn't fit the Musk Worship narrative doesn't make me wrong. Was someone not killed by a malfunctioning / underprepared Tesla? What am I missing here????
      - dang 10y ago
        "You spew" is a pejorative. Examples: https://twitter.com/search?q="you%20spew" https://twitter.com/search?q="you%20spew" https://www.google.com/webhp#q=site%3Atwitter.com%20%22you%20spew%22 https://www.google.com/webhp#q=site%3Atwitter.com%20%22you%2... What you're missing is that even though someone was uncivil to you on HN, you needed to remain civil in return. That's the social contract here, and we need it to prevent discourse from degenerating even further.
        MicroBerto 10y ago
        Given that there is no report button or ability to downvote someone that replies to you (at least not on mobile for me), it is only reasonable to defend myself in that situation. The ensuing attacker went to my profile, researched me and my business, and personally attacked me because they disagreed with my sentiment. What is my recourse for action in such a case? Take it on the chin like a wimp? I don't think so. If you don't provide appropriate tools to stop a tit attack, then you are fostering an unfair and "unsafe" environment by banning tit-for-tat response. You are turning this community into a one-way echo chamber.
- dang 10y ago
  This is uncivil and stoops to personal attack. It's just the ante-upping, signal-noise-lowering sort of comment we ask people to abstain from here. Please don't post like this to HN. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html
dang 10y ago
Please don't toss off inflammatory, unsubstantive comments on HN. If you're going to comment here, make it substantive, and if the topic is divisive, please make it less inflammatory, not more. Edit: you also became uncivil downthread. We ban accounts that do that. Please (re-)read the site guidelines and follow them: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html

But fewer than the number who would be killed in Tesla cars if the cars lacked the self-driving features.

Are you implying that Tesla killed the (1 person, not people) who decided to let his car slam into a tractor-trailer on cruise control? It's not a problem to you that, say, Apple has "financed the suicides of dozens of Foxconn workers," or that GM killed 140 people by suppressing information on a defective ignition switch, or that Lockheed Martin and Halliburton buoy their stock by selling weapons to kill hundreds of thousands of people? Evidently, you must find totally acceptable the gun-running, terrorist-sponsoring activities of HSBC in the last few years. I bet Google's permabanning of people from their own Google Apps accounts (because they were reselling a couple Pixel phones) is ethically fine with you, as well. Never mind the tens of thousands of preventable automobile deaths yearly because car manufacturers refuse to implement even the most rudimentary of Autopilot functions. Yeah, totally reasonable to pick on the electric car / solar battery company with $3b in revenue since one dope decided to drive into a truck and behead himself. There's nobody else deserving of criticism whatsoever. Let's not even get started with how cocky their CEO has been with his fancy sustainable business plans! p.s. I won't even attempt an ad hominem at the guy selling homeopathics and 'nutritional supplements' in this thread.

legolas2412 10y ago
I'm going to ignore the whataboutism you spew. Also, Elon musk has done amazing work with electric cars, sustainable energy and space travel. No doubt about that. But this is about Autopilot, a collection of driver assistance program. Not sure about OP, but my spite with Tesla is that they are pushing the above-mentioned driver assistance programs as self-driving features. This over-selling is going to kill people. And for your information, lane keeping assist, lane driving assist, automated cruise control (which is pretty much AP1.0) have been present in several cars. Even self parking has been demoed by several cars. Add in automatic lane changing (which doesn't sound difficult to me), it wraps up Enhanced AP1.0. Does that sound like a completely autonomous self driving car? Because that's what the public perception is like.
- MicroBerto 10y ago
  > This over-selling is going to kill people. Yes, this is what I meant in my comment. I know there are going to be massive hurdles here, but Tesla seems to be shooting from the hip wayyyy too much for my comfort level. I'm not a full believer that this can only be solved by OTA software updates. If that Tesla had a LIDAR on top of the car like Google's vehicles do, a man would still be alive. > whataboutism That was a very nice way of putting that pile of rubbish of a comment. You must have made it further than I did, I stopped reading at the word "decided". You are too kind.
- dang 10y ago
  Please don't call names ('you spew') in arguments. If someone is wrong, explain so civilly. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html
  - MicroBerto 10y ago
    How is "you spew" namecalling? I was the one personally attacked in this thread, not the other way around. Just because my comment doesn't fit the Musk Worship narrative doesn't make me wrong. Was someone not killed by a malfunctioning / underprepared Tesla? What am I missing here????
    - dang 10y ago
      "You spew" is a pejorative. Examples: https://twitter.com/search?q="you%20spew" https://twitter.com/search?q="you%20spew" https://www.google.com/webhp#q=site%3Atwitter.com%20%22you%20spew%22 https://www.google.com/webhp#q=site%3Atwitter.com%20%22you%2... What you're missing is that even though someone was uncivil to you on HN, you needed to remain civil in return. That's the social contract here, and we need it to prevent discourse from degenerating even further.
      - MicroBerto 10y ago
        Given that there is no report button or ability to downvote someone that replies to you (at least not on mobile for me), it is only reasonable to defend myself in that situation. The ensuing attacker went to my profile, researched me and my business, and personally attacked me because they disagreed with my sentiment. What is my recourse for action in such a case? Take it on the chin like a wimp? I don't think so. If you don't provide appropriate tools to stop a tit attack, then you are fostering an unfair and "unsafe" environment by banning tit-for-tat response. You are turning this community into a one-way echo chamber.
dang 10y ago
This is uncivil and stoops to personal attack. It's just the ante-upping, signal-noise-lowering sort of comment we ask people to abstain from here. Please don't post like this to HN. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html

dang 10y ago

Please don't toss off inflammatory, unsubstantive comments on HN. If you're going to comment here, make it substantive, and if the topic is divisive, please make it less inflammatory, not more. Edit: you also became uncivil downthread. We ban accounts that do that. Please (re-)read the site guidelines and follow them: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newswelcome.html