7 ms·

Curious, why don't you compare with known "non-cloud" hosting companies too, that provide vps services, like ovh, hetzner, leaseweb, etc.? EDIT: Anyone cares t

by zzzcpan 10y ago

Curious, why don't you compare with known "non-cloud" hosting companies too, that provide vps services, like ovh, hetzner, leaseweb, etc.? EDIT: Anyone cares to explain his reasons behind a downvote?

rickyc091 10y ago
It's probably since the ones listed above are the typical VPS to go to when it comes to cheap hosting. The ones you mentioned are lesser known.
idm 10y ago
Does anybody care about the answer to your question? In all likelihood, the answer is: because that information is even more work to collect. Your post reminds me of the burden of proof fallacy, in which you create work for other people by asking questions you could easily answer yourself. If you or anybody posts the comparison you requested, it will surely be upvoted.
- kuschku 10y ago
  I did, over here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13074325 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13074325
  - idm 10y ago
    Thanks for posting a note in this thread - I would have missed it otherwise!
- Whitestrake 10y ago
  I don't believe he directly requested a comparison. What he asked was why the commenter above him chose not to. You seem to acknowledge that in your second sentence, but then go on to state that his comment is reminiscent of asking questions one could answer themselves - asking a commenter why they chose (not) to do something doesn't strike me as answerable by a second or third party.
Veratyr 10y ago
Possibly because (except for Leaseweb), they're all European and of limited usefulness as a result. Linode, Vultr, DO and AWS all have numerous regions around the world. They're also typically leased for at least a full month and can't be spun up/down on demand like you can with these services. Plus they focus on large (>16GB) dedicated servers.
- chrisper 10y ago
  Leaseweb is in Amsterdam.
  - Veratyr 10y ago
    It's also in the US, Germany, Hong Kong and Singapore: https://www.leaseweb.com/platform/data-centers https://www.leaseweb.com/platform/data-centers
    - chrisper 10y ago
      Oh wow. They must have expanded over the years then.
dispose13432 10y ago
My question is why does no one talk about prgmr?
- edgartaor 10y ago
  Do you have experience with prgmr? It's reliable enough for a small project?
  - mjn 10y ago
    I've used it and am happy with it. It's reasonably reliable, but has more downtime than the big providers. I wouldn't run mission-critical software that needs 5 9's uptime on it, but for anything else it's fine, certainly for personal projects. They're transparent with any outages, so you can check up on the outage history on their blog: https://prgmr.com/blog/ https://prgmr.com/blog/ It's a small business run by a few people (though it's been around for 10 years, so a pretty stable one), which has the pros and cons that go along with that. The tech staff is good, techies who know what they're doing and generally assume that you do also. So if you send a request or problem report, you aren't going to get a form reply that asks if you tried turning it off and back on again. But it's just a handful of people, so if there's a major issue, fixing things is pretty manual and slower than at places that have armies of 24/7 devops staff. One specific thing I really like about it: it gives you SSH access to a proper text console, in case you want to install a custom OS, recover a broken install, etc. Most VPS providers give you console access, but most do it via VNC in the browser, which is not my favorite way to do sysadmin work.
    - dispose13432 10y ago
      > in case you want to install a custom OS Do they let you do that? They don't say that in the purchases page. Also, how is uptime relative to vultr?
      - mjn 10y ago
        Yeah, you have a choice of using their prebuilt disk images, running one of the officially supported OS installers from the console menu, or downloading your own installer. The list of prebuilt images and supported installers is here: http://wiki.prgmr.com/mediawiki/index.php/Distributions http://wiki.prgmr.com/mediawiki/index.php/Distributions I haven't used vultr so can't comment on that.
olegkikin 10y ago
There are also many less known VPS providers with truly great deals. I've been using these two: NodeServ: $1.25/month = 50GB HDD, 512MB RAM, 1 core, 1TB bandwidth, location in Jacksonville. Host.us: $6/month = 150GB HDD, 6GB RAM, 4 cores, 5.12TB bandwidth, location in Dallas. Both deals found on LowEndBox.
- diegorbaquero 10y ago
  LowEndBox and LowEndTalk are awesome, been following for years. CyberMonday got me KVM with 8GB RAM for $10.
- shiftpgdn 10y ago
  Your lesser known VPS providers probably have lower tier bandwith, more crowded hypervisors, old virtualization tech or old hardware. That's not to say getting a 8GB openVZ vps for $4 a month isn't an amazing deal, but just that there are caveats.
  - Karunamon 10y ago
    I just had a look through their ToS for the catch. For the most part it's reasonable, but there's a freaking litany of reasonable things you're not allowed to run, including IRC, audio/video streaming, game servers, and so on. Why on earth do you sell me X block of resources for Y$/month if you're going to tell me what I can and can't do with them? Surely unreasonable use would be covered by resource limits already in place?
    - smarx007 10y ago
      There are mainly 2 reasons: * they oversell, so they assume that only small fraction of web servers will consume 100% of resources, while almost every torrent client will consume 100% of the bandwidth. There is nothing wrong with overselling hosting within a reasonable margin, but most of the people here want to run more than a LAMP stack on the server. * they get too much admin overhead replying to Tor "abuse" letters etc., so they just decided to deal with it in the simplest way possible. I guess both factors contribute equally.
kuschku 10y ago
I expanded it with those companies: Price breakdown vs DigitalOcean, Vultr, Linode, OVH, and Online.net / Scaleway: $5/mo | Provider | RAM | Cores | Storage | Transfer | | ---------------------- | ----- | ----- | ---------- | -------- | | LightSail | 512MB | 1 | 20GB SSD | 1TB | | DO | 512MB | 1 | 20GB SSD | 1TB | | VULTR | 768MB | 1 | 15GB SSD | 1TB | | Hetzner (virtual) | 1GB | 1 | 25GB SSD | 2TB | | OVH | 2GB | 1 | 10GB SSD | ∞TB | | Scaleway (virtual) | 2GB | 2 | 50GB SSD | ∞TB | $10/mo | Provider | RAM | Cores | Storage | Transfer | | ---------------------- | ----- | ----- | ---------- | -------- | | LightSail | 1GB | 1 | 30GB SSD | 2TB | | DO | 1GB | 1 | 30GB SSD | 2TB | | VULTR | 1GB | 1 | 20GB SSD | 2TB | | Linode | 2GB | 1 | 24GB SSD | 2TB | | Hetzner (virtual) | 2GB | 2 | 50GB SSD | 5TB | | OVH | 4GB | 1 | 20GB SSD | ∞TB | | Scaleway (virtual) | 8GB | 8 | 200GB SSD | ∞TB | | Online.net (dedicated) | 4GB | 2 | 120GB SSD | ∞TB | $20/mo | Provider | RAM | Cores | Storage | Transfer | | ---------------------- | ----- | ----- | ---------- | -------- | | LightSail | 2GB | 1 | 40GB SSD | 3TB | | DO | 2GB | 2 | 40GB SSD | 3TB | | VULTR | 2GB | 2 | 45GB SSD | 3TB | | Linode | 4GB | 2 | 48GB SSD | 3TB | | Hetzner (virtual) | 4GB | 2 | 100GB SSD | 8TB | | OVH | 8GB | 2 | 40GB SSD | ∞TB | | Scaleway (dedicated) | 16GB | 8 | 50GB SSD | ∞TB | | Online.net (dedicated) | 16GB | 8 | 250GB SSD | ∞TB | $40/mo | Provider | RAM | Cores | Storage | Transfer | | ---------------------- | ----- | ----- | ---------- | -------- | | LightSail | 4GB | 2 | 60GB SSD | 4TB | | DO | 4GB | 2 | 60GB SSD | 4TB | | VULTR | 4GB | 4 | 45GB SSD | 4TB | | Linode | 8GB | 4 | 96GB SSD | 4TB | | Hetzner (virtual) | 16GB | 4 | 400GB SSD | 20TB | | OVH | 8GB | 2 | 40GB SSD | ∞TB | | Scaleway (dedicated) | 32GB | 8 | 50GB SSD | ∞TB | | Online.net (dedicated) | 32GB | 8 | 750GB SSD | ∞TB | $80/mo | Provider | RAM | Cores | Storage | Transfer | | ---------------------- | ----- | ----- | ---------- | -------- | | LightSail | 8GB | 2 | 80GB SSD | 5TB | | DO | 8GB | 4 | 80GB SSD | 5TB | | VULTR | 8GB | 6 | 150GB SSD | 5TB | | Linode | 12GB | 6 | 192GB SSD | 8TB | | Hetzner (virtual) | 32GB | 8 | 600GB SSD | 30TB | | Hetzner (dedicated) | 64GB | 8 | 1024GB SSD | 30TB | | OVH | 8GB | 2 | 40GB SSD | ∞TB | | Scaleway (dedicated) | 32GB | 8 | 50GB SSD | ∞TB | | Online.net (dedicated) | 64GB | 8 | 1500GB SSD | ∞TB | Gist available here: https://gist.github.com/justjanne/205cc548148829078d4bf2fd394f50ae https://gist.github.com/justjanne/205cc548148829078d4bf2fd39...
rsync 10y ago
"EDIT: Anyone cares to explain his reasons behind a downvote?" I downvoted you because you talked about your downvotes. Don't interrupt the discussion to meta-discuss the scoring system. Write your post and live with the results.
r5sec5cyl 10y ago
That's simple. When DO came on the scene it was the only one of its kind. Now there are 4 almost identical services: DO, Linode, Vultr, and Lightsail. On the surface those seem the same because of the near linear pricing and similar allocation of resources. The ones you listed aren't even close. Each of those may have some but they don't have all of what makes the DO model so useful to some of us: 1. Mission-critical/Production ready reliability and communication (all maintenance and issues) 2. No unexpected termination of instances / Reasonable warning & mediation 3. Not overprovisioned / little concern of noisy neighbors 4. Tier 3/4 redundancies 5. Strong American coverage (each DC with Tier 3/4 level services) 6. No setup fee on new instances 7. 1-minute provisioning (simple creation of instances / no ticket needed for deleting resource) 8. Programmatic IaaS management including provisioning, DNS, and images 9. Quality resources - mostly Xeons not ARMs, local SSD not Ceph 10. Huge backing - they're not closing tomorrow & I wanted a #10 While OVH, Hetzner, Leaseweb seem like nice services, particularly for needs in Europe, I can't build an American-centric service on those, set it and forget it nearly as easily or worry-free as with DO/Linode/Vultr/Lightsail.

by zzzcpan 10y ago

Curious, why don't you compare with known "non-cloud" hosting companies too, that provide vps services, like ovh, hetzner, leaseweb, etc.? EDIT: Anyone cares to explain his reasons behind a downvote?

rickyc091 10y ago

It's probably since the ones listed above are the typical VPS to go to when it comes to cheap hosting. The ones you mentioned are lesser known.

idm 10y ago

Does anybody care about the answer to your question? In all likelihood, the answer is: because that information is even more work to collect. Your post reminds me of the burden of proof fallacy, in which you create work for other people by asking questions you could easily answer yourself. If you or anybody posts the comparison you requested, it will surely be upvoted.

kuschku 10y ago
I did, over here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13074325 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13074325
- idm 10y ago
  Thanks for posting a note in this thread - I would have missed it otherwise!
Whitestrake 10y ago
I don't believe he directly requested a comparison. What he asked was why the commenter above him chose not to. You seem to acknowledge that in your second sentence, but then go on to state that his comment is reminiscent of asking questions one could answer themselves - asking a commenter why they chose (not) to do something doesn't strike me as answerable by a second or third party.

Veratyr 10y ago

Possibly because (except for Leaseweb), they're all European and of limited usefulness as a result. Linode, Vultr, DO and AWS all have numerous regions around the world. They're also typically leased for at least a full month and can't be spun up/down on demand like you can with these services. Plus they focus on large (>16GB) dedicated servers.

chrisper 10y ago
Leaseweb is in Amsterdam.
- Veratyr 10y ago
  It's also in the US, Germany, Hong Kong and Singapore: https://www.leaseweb.com/platform/data-centers https://www.leaseweb.com/platform/data-centers
  - chrisper 10y ago
    Oh wow. They must have expanded over the years then.

dispose13432 10y ago

My question is why does no one talk about prgmr?

edgartaor 10y ago
Do you have experience with prgmr? It's reliable enough for a small project?
- mjn 10y ago
  I've used it and am happy with it. It's reasonably reliable, but has more downtime than the big providers. I wouldn't run mission-critical software that needs 5 9's uptime on it, but for anything else it's fine, certainly for personal projects. They're transparent with any outages, so you can check up on the outage history on their blog: https://prgmr.com/blog/ https://prgmr.com/blog/ It's a small business run by a few people (though it's been around for 10 years, so a pretty stable one), which has the pros and cons that go along with that. The tech staff is good, techies who know what they're doing and generally assume that you do also. So if you send a request or problem report, you aren't going to get a form reply that asks if you tried turning it off and back on again. But it's just a handful of people, so if there's a major issue, fixing things is pretty manual and slower than at places that have armies of 24/7 devops staff. One specific thing I really like about it: it gives you SSH access to a proper text console, in case you want to install a custom OS, recover a broken install, etc. Most VPS providers give you console access, but most do it via VNC in the browser, which is not my favorite way to do sysadmin work.
  - dispose13432 10y ago
    > in case you want to install a custom OS Do they let you do that? They don't say that in the purchases page. Also, how is uptime relative to vultr?
    - mjn 10y ago
      Yeah, you have a choice of using their prebuilt disk images, running one of the officially supported OS installers from the console menu, or downloading your own installer. The list of prebuilt images and supported installers is here: http://wiki.prgmr.com/mediawiki/index.php/Distributions http://wiki.prgmr.com/mediawiki/index.php/Distributions I haven't used vultr so can't comment on that.

olegkikin 10y ago

There are also many less known VPS providers with truly great deals. I've been using these two: NodeServ: $1.25/month = 50GB HDD, 512MB RAM, 1 core, 1TB bandwidth, location in Jacksonville. Host.us: $6/month = 150GB HDD, 6GB RAM, 4 cores, 5.12TB bandwidth, location in Dallas. Both deals found on LowEndBox.

diegorbaquero 10y ago
LowEndBox and LowEndTalk are awesome, been following for years. CyberMonday got me KVM with 8GB RAM for $10.
shiftpgdn 10y ago
Your lesser known VPS providers probably have lower tier bandwith, more crowded hypervisors, old virtualization tech or old hardware. That's not to say getting a 8GB openVZ vps for $4 a month isn't an amazing deal, but just that there are caveats.
- Karunamon 10y ago
  I just had a look through their ToS for the catch. For the most part it's reasonable, but there's a freaking litany of reasonable things you're not allowed to run, including IRC, audio/video streaming, game servers, and so on. Why on earth do you sell me X block of resources for Y$/month if you're going to tell me what I can and can't do with them? Surely unreasonable use would be covered by resource limits already in place?
  - smarx007 10y ago
    There are mainly 2 reasons: * they oversell, so they assume that only small fraction of web servers will consume 100% of resources, while almost every torrent client will consume 100% of the bandwidth. There is nothing wrong with overselling hosting within a reasonable margin, but most of the people here want to run more than a LAMP stack on the server. * they get too much admin overhead replying to Tor "abuse" letters etc., so they just decided to deal with it in the simplest way possible. I guess both factors contribute equally.

kuschku 10y ago

I expanded it with those companies: Price breakdown vs DigitalOcean, Vultr, Linode, OVH, and Online.net / Scaleway: $5/mo | Provider | RAM | Cores | Storage | Transfer | | ---------------------- | ----- | ----- | ---------- | -------- | | LightSail | 512MB | 1 | 20GB SSD | 1TB | | DO | 512MB | 1 | 20GB SSD | 1TB | | VULTR | 768MB | 1 | 15GB SSD | 1TB | | Hetzner (virtual) | 1GB | 1 | 25GB SSD | 2TB | | OVH | 2GB | 1 | 10GB SSD | ∞TB | | Scaleway (virtual) | 2GB | 2 | 50GB SSD | ∞TB | $10/mo | Provider | RAM | Cores | Storage | Transfer | | ---------------------- | ----- | ----- | ---------- | -------- | | LightSail | 1GB | 1 | 30GB SSD | 2TB | | DO | 1GB | 1 | 30GB SSD | 2TB | | VULTR | 1GB | 1 | 20GB SSD | 2TB | | Linode | 2GB | 1 | 24GB SSD | 2TB | | Hetzner (virtual) | 2GB | 2 | 50GB SSD | 5TB | | OVH | 4GB | 1 | 20GB SSD | ∞TB | | Scaleway (virtual) | 8GB | 8 | 200GB SSD | ∞TB | | Online.net (dedicated) | 4GB | 2 | 120GB SSD | ∞TB | $20/mo | Provider | RAM | Cores | Storage | Transfer | | ---------------------- | ----- | ----- | ---------- | -------- | | LightSail | 2GB | 1 | 40GB SSD | 3TB | | DO | 2GB | 2 | 40GB SSD | 3TB | | VULTR | 2GB | 2 | 45GB SSD | 3TB | | Linode | 4GB | 2 | 48GB SSD | 3TB | | Hetzner (virtual) | 4GB | 2 | 100GB SSD | 8TB | | OVH | 8GB | 2 | 40GB SSD | ∞TB | | Scaleway (dedicated) | 16GB | 8 | 50GB SSD | ∞TB | | Online.net (dedicated) | 16GB | 8 | 250GB SSD | ∞TB | $40/mo | Provider | RAM | Cores | Storage | Transfer | | ---------------------- | ----- | ----- | ---------- | -------- | | LightSail | 4GB | 2 | 60GB SSD | 4TB | | DO | 4GB | 2 | 60GB SSD | 4TB | | VULTR | 4GB | 4 | 45GB SSD | 4TB | | Linode | 8GB | 4 | 96GB SSD | 4TB | | Hetzner (virtual) | 16GB | 4 | 400GB SSD | 20TB | | OVH | 8GB | 2 | 40GB SSD | ∞TB | | Scaleway (dedicated) | 32GB | 8 | 50GB SSD | ∞TB | | Online.net (dedicated) | 32GB | 8 | 750GB SSD | ∞TB | $80/mo | Provider | RAM | Cores | Storage | Transfer | | ---------------------- | ----- | ----- | ---------- | -------- | | LightSail | 8GB | 2 | 80GB SSD | 5TB | | DO | 8GB | 4 | 80GB SSD | 5TB | | VULTR | 8GB | 6 | 150GB SSD | 5TB | | Linode | 12GB | 6 | 192GB SSD | 8TB | | Hetzner (virtual) | 32GB | 8 | 600GB SSD | 30TB | | Hetzner (dedicated) | 64GB | 8 | 1024GB SSD | 30TB | | OVH | 8GB | 2 | 40GB SSD | ∞TB | | Scaleway (dedicated) | 32GB | 8 | 50GB SSD | ∞TB | | Online.net (dedicated) | 64GB | 8 | 1500GB SSD | ∞TB | Gist available here: https://gist.github.com/justjanne/205cc548148829078d4bf2fd394f50ae https://gist.github.com/justjanne/205cc548148829078d4bf2fd39...

rsync 10y ago

"EDIT: Anyone cares to explain his reasons behind a downvote?" I downvoted you because you talked about your downvotes. Don't interrupt the discussion to meta-discuss the scoring system. Write your post and live with the results.

r5sec5cyl 10y ago

That's simple. When DO came on the scene it was the only one of its kind. Now there are 4 almost identical services: DO, Linode, Vultr, and Lightsail. On the surface those seem the same because of the near linear pricing and similar allocation of resources. The ones you listed aren't even close. Each of those may have some but they don't have all of what makes the DO model so useful to some of us: 1. Mission-critical/Production ready reliability and communication (all maintenance and issues) 2. No unexpected termination of instances / Reasonable warning & mediation 3. Not overprovisioned / little concern of noisy neighbors 4. Tier 3/4 redundancies 5. Strong American coverage (each DC with Tier 3/4 level services) 6. No setup fee on new instances 7. 1-minute provisioning (simple creation of instances / no ticket needed for deleting resource) 8. Programmatic IaaS management including provisioning, DNS, and images 9. Quality resources - mostly Xeons not ARMs, local SSD not Ceph 10. Huge backing - they're not closing tomorrow & I wanted a #10 While OVH, Hetzner, Leaseweb seem like nice services, particularly for needs in Europe, I can't build an American-centric service on those, set it and forget it nearly as easily or worry-free as with DO/Linode/Vultr/Lightsail.