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Older stuff does just fine w/ 3pt hitch & PTO. You can hook up new implements to a 50 year old tractor. The biggest issue is finding parts for some of the less

Older stuff does just fine w/ 3pt hitch & PTO. You can hook up new implements to a 50 year old tractor. The biggest issue is finding parts for some of the less common makes/brands. Modern stuff is partially complex due to new emissions standards(things like DPF, regeneration and UREA). An open source ECU that solves those problems would be a good step. Clutch based tractors aren't that complex, there's just a large amount of capital investment in building them and very little incentives to make them open.

colechristensen 10y ago
This is the key, somebody needs to make a minimal-electronics tractor new with even a moderate amount of openness.
- burfog 10y ago
  Ideally yes, but drop-in replacement electronics for a popular model would be almost as good.
- randomdata 10y ago
  What's the market? I can't imagine ever wanting to trade my modern electronics-filled tractors for the stuff we have run in the past, even if it was in brand new condition. I look forward to the day that I can upgrade my tractors to ones with even more electronics in them. Yeah, the electronics can break. But even on the equipment I own where the electronics are not critical to the operation, you still end up fixing it ASAP because you quickly miss not having it. Electronics have become heavily used because they add a lot of value. Perhaps not in the case of the aforementioned DEF, but that's a legal requirement, and even the most basic tractor you could imagine would still require it.
  - colechristensen 10y ago
    The market is small farmers (lets say 500 acres) who want an economical machine they can own for decades and maintain themselves. There are plenty of electronics which are useful which don't need to be integrated into the tractor. I would want anything I'd buy to not have a magical black box which costs thousands of dollars every time it has a problem.
    - randomdata 10y ago
      You've pretty much described my operation, but I still don't see your vision. In fact, there's nothing inherently unapproachable about electronics. I often have an easier time understanding the electrical faults than I do the mechanical ones. There are still some fairly bare bones new tractors on the market, particularly those that come from the old Eastern Bloc, but I don't know anyone who wants to own one. There is a dealer around, so someone must (perhaps in the compact market?), but they are definitely few and far between. I'm not sure I have ever seen one in person. Besides, if you're comfortable with maintaining a decades old tractor, why wouldn't you buy an existing one? There are plenty of a good old used tractors on the market that are tried and true. They last a long time and will be far cheaper than anyone could ever make a new one for. I'm left wondering if you are out of touch with the realities of farming, or are farming in a completely different way to what I am? If the latter, I'd love to know more about your operation.
      - colechristensen 10y ago
        The vision is simple hackable machines designed to be maintained. You'll spend quite a bit less on engineering costs if you dump most of the electronics and turn a tractor into an attachment bus for all of the electronic features you might want (crowdsourced or commercial). The mechanical design could be more or less static with only minor refinements and you might just end up with a machine that costs a fraction of the latest John Deere. Cheaper machinery (and not having to hunt at farm auctions for good deals) lowers the bar so you can get more and smaller farmers which I believe is a big step to improving our food economy (and not just the money part, the whole (what|where|why) of growing food could be much improved if there was less focus on industrial concerns) I only go home to farm for fun a few times a year – after a while it might not be only for fun.
        vvanders 10y ago
        You know that the cost of a JD/Kubota/New Holland has to do more with the abuse they can take than the electronics right? Kubota basically targets that market(Compact Utility Tractor) and geared ones still cost more than a new car before you factor in maintence.

colechristensen 10y ago

This is the key, somebody needs to make a minimal-electronics tractor new with even a moderate amount of openness.

burfog 10y ago
Ideally yes, but drop-in replacement electronics for a popular model would be almost as good.
randomdata 10y ago
What's the market? I can't imagine ever wanting to trade my modern electronics-filled tractors for the stuff we have run in the past, even if it was in brand new condition. I look forward to the day that I can upgrade my tractors to ones with even more electronics in them. Yeah, the electronics can break. But even on the equipment I own where the electronics are not critical to the operation, you still end up fixing it ASAP because you quickly miss not having it. Electronics have become heavily used because they add a lot of value. Perhaps not in the case of the aforementioned DEF, but that's a legal requirement, and even the most basic tractor you could imagine would still require it.
- colechristensen 10y ago
  The market is small farmers (lets say 500 acres) who want an economical machine they can own for decades and maintain themselves. There are plenty of electronics which are useful which don't need to be integrated into the tractor. I would want anything I'd buy to not have a magical black box which costs thousands of dollars every time it has a problem.
  - randomdata 10y ago
    You've pretty much described my operation, but I still don't see your vision. In fact, there's nothing inherently unapproachable about electronics. I often have an easier time understanding the electrical faults than I do the mechanical ones. There are still some fairly bare bones new tractors on the market, particularly those that come from the old Eastern Bloc, but I don't know anyone who wants to own one. There is a dealer around, so someone must (perhaps in the compact market?), but they are definitely few and far between. I'm not sure I have ever seen one in person. Besides, if you're comfortable with maintaining a decades old tractor, why wouldn't you buy an existing one? There are plenty of a good old used tractors on the market that are tried and true. They last a long time and will be far cheaper than anyone could ever make a new one for. I'm left wondering if you are out of touch with the realities of farming, or are farming in a completely different way to what I am? If the latter, I'd love to know more about your operation.
    - colechristensen 10y ago
      The vision is simple hackable machines designed to be maintained. You'll spend quite a bit less on engineering costs if you dump most of the electronics and turn a tractor into an attachment bus for all of the electronic features you might want (crowdsourced or commercial). The mechanical design could be more or less static with only minor refinements and you might just end up with a machine that costs a fraction of the latest John Deere. Cheaper machinery (and not having to hunt at farm auctions for good deals) lowers the bar so you can get more and smaller farmers which I believe is a big step to improving our food economy (and not just the money part, the whole (what|where|why) of growing food could be much improved if there was less focus on industrial concerns) I only go home to farm for fun a few times a year – after a while it might not be only for fun.
      - vvanders 10y ago
        You know that the cost of a JD/Kubota/New Holland has to do more with the abuse they can take than the electronics right? Kubota basically targets that market(Compact Utility Tractor) and geared ones still cost more than a new car before you factor in maintence.