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I know that it's not really something that can be changed on a whim, but I feel like Blender's UI is deeply strange and often quite dreadful.

melling 10y ago
Andrew Price would complain about the UI in his podcast. I guess the community eventually wore him down. Here's one of the episodes: https://www.blenderguru.com/podcasts/podcast-jonathan-williamson-on-blenders-interface/ https://www.blenderguru.com/podcasts/podcast-jonathan-willia...
- greenknight 10y ago
  https://www.blenderguru.com/podcasts/podcast-interview-with-ux-software-designer-duncan-macneil/ https://www.blenderguru.com/podcasts/podcast-interview-with-... He followed up with a actual UX designer, who pretty much told him that his proposal was the wrong way to think about it (objectively, not subjectively). He admitted that his proposal at the blender conference was more of a discussion about the way of the future -- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6aIA2LaB2Iw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6aIA2LaB2Iw After that, he stopped pushing so hard on the UI/UX problems of blender. I believe he is still part of the UI committee, but isnt pushing it as hard in his podcasts as he realises he doesn't have the answers.
  - melling 10y ago
    Don't think he thought that he had the answers. Simply that the UI was bad and it needed to be fixed. He wanted to have a discussion.
    - greenknight 10y ago
      This was his suggestion to how to fix blender -- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWacQrEcMHk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWacQrEcMHk
      - melling 10y ago
        So, people just told him he was wrong? End of story. When someone throws out their ideas, people get to shoot them down then the status quo continues. I listened to all his podcasts. It was meant to be a conversation.
        thomastjeffery 10y ago
        Not at all true. He was wrong, but he wasn't shot down in the slightest. One of the main focuses in development right now is the workflow/UI. https://code.blender.org/2015/07/blender-2-8-the-workflow-release/ https://code.blender.org/2015/07/blender-2-8-the-workflow-re... https://wiki.blender.org/index.php/Dev:2.8/ https://wiki.blender.org/index.php/Dev:2.8/
foxfired 10y ago
it's true, but when you figure it out, you wouldn't have it any other way. I remember how much I hated the UI, but like with any tool the more you use the better you get at it. For example, I find the left/right mouse buttons completely natural now.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- mungoid 10y ago
  Totally agree. I use 3ds Max a lot for work and I have modified as much as possible in those settings to work like blender. It baffles everyone else I work with.
  - geoka9 10y ago
    Exactly, it's like most of my programmer co-workers getting baffled when they see somebody using a keyboard/command-line-oriented linux setup instead of a mouse-oriented mac.
parenthephobia 10y ago
How does one define deeply strange? It's right to say it's not what we're used to. But I think if there was some fundamental wrongness with it, I'd have problems switching between Blender and other software with similar uses. e.g. I often use Blender and Unity in tandem and I don't find myself trying to use each the wrong way when I switch between. OTOH, I disable the left-click to set the cursor because I find it distracting and very rarely want it - only when I want an arbitrary pivot for transforms, or to align vertices from different meshes. It irritates me deeply that there's no way to hide the cursor without also hiding e.g. the selection outline and the grid.
- dispose13432 10y ago
  Good UX means to make simple thing simple, but permit complicated workflows. What I want is to make simple things (basic modeling, materials, colors) to be a simple one click away.
  - geoka9 10y ago
    Honestly I haven't seen a 3d tool like that. Perhaps it's just the nature of the beast and I should be glad that in Blender at least the complicated workflows are smooth once you get past the "bootcamp" stage.
    - semi-extrinsic 10y ago
      > Honestly I haven't seen a 3d tool like that. Perhaps SketchUp comes close?
    - stan_rogers 10y ago
      It's been a while, but the trueSpace UI (the "classic" version that went back to Caligari on the Amiga) would be a pretty good match for that. It got a bit hairy with deformations (which is why a different UI mode was added to later editions), but basic geometry, extrusions, lathing, booleans and bones were a breeze either numerically or by click-and-drag. Simple things really were simple.
    - 10y ago
dispose13432 10y ago
It's something everyone knows about, and nothing can be done. As I heard, it's almost a full rewrite.
semi-extrinsic 10y ago
At least the Python API is deeply strange. Stuff is undocumented to out here, uses different units for input from the UI even though function name is the same, and API actions in a script depend on mouse focus... But despite it's flaws, I love Blender.
mungoid 10y ago
Before 2.5 I hated the UI. But after 2.5, I realized I could work so much faster once I learned the keys and layout. I have used 3ds Max for years and even knowing a lot about that software, I still find myself exporting to blender so I can do something. Usually I can do something in blender with only a couple key presses where in other software I have to click a few different buttons in various popup windows, etc. I do think some of the UI needs to be a little more logical, but aside from that I honestly want to see their UI in more.
- zem 10y ago
  it's basically the vi of 3d modellers (:
  - dispose13432 10y ago
    I wouldn't call it vi. I'd call it the Windows API of 3d modelers. vi is easy. Type vi file.txt 1. To delete, type x. 2. To insert, type a. 3. To save and quit, type ZZ. 4. To move up, down, right left (in "classic" vi), use "KJLH" There. You can be productive. Not fully, but enough to get basics done. To use blender's relatively basic tools, say to draw a glass wall, you need a step by step guide, using quite obscure commands. Reminds me of Windows API (or GIMP, by the way)
    - Tarean 10y ago
      It is very close to vi/vim's philosophy - different modes for different task, key bindings are mnemonics, you combine basic commands to more complex tasks. Even window manipulation is the same with the hierarchy of content->splits as viewports->layouts. It is harder to do work without understanding these concepts in blender because editing text is simpler, though.
    - notheguyouthink 10y ago
      > To save and quit, type ZZ I've been a 100% Vim user for ... man, 6 years? Including partial vim usage for another few years before that? And `ZZ` is entirely new to me haha. This is a weird problem for me with Vim. I love it, but it's an issue of "i don't know what i don't know". I really need to setup a Vim "key combo of the day" or something. Preferably something that has a JSON API so that i can pipe it into my vim-startify.
AWildDHHAppears 10y ago
It's not that bad.
njharman 10y ago
I haven't used blender in years, so don't know about recent UI. But I totally loved the interface of the first opened version. It seemed optimized for power users, not casual users. So, steep learning curve but very rewarding/powerful if you invested time to learn it. Reminds me of vim.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
thomastjeffery 10y ago
It seems like no one commenting here knows anything, so I'll just leave these here: https://code.blender.org/2015/07/blender-2-8-the-workflow-release/ https://code.blender.org/2015/07/blender-2-8-the-workflow-re... https://wiki.blender.org/index.php/Dev:2.8/ https://wiki.blender.org/index.php/Dev:2.8/ Right now, the main focus is in the (already fantastic IMHO) UI.

melling 10y ago

Andrew Price would complain about the UI in his podcast. I guess the community eventually wore him down. Here's one of the episodes: https://www.blenderguru.com/podcasts/podcast-jonathan-williamson-on-blenders-interface/ https://www.blenderguru.com/podcasts/podcast-jonathan-willia...

greenknight 10y ago
https://www.blenderguru.com/podcasts/podcast-interview-with-ux-software-designer-duncan-macneil/ https://www.blenderguru.com/podcasts/podcast-interview-with-... He followed up with a actual UX designer, who pretty much told him that his proposal was the wrong way to think about it (objectively, not subjectively). He admitted that his proposal at the blender conference was more of a discussion about the way of the future -- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6aIA2LaB2Iw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6aIA2LaB2Iw After that, he stopped pushing so hard on the UI/UX problems of blender. I believe he is still part of the UI committee, but isnt pushing it as hard in his podcasts as he realises he doesn't have the answers.
- melling 10y ago
  Don't think he thought that he had the answers. Simply that the UI was bad and it needed to be fixed. He wanted to have a discussion.
  - greenknight 10y ago
    This was his suggestion to how to fix blender -- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWacQrEcMHk https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWacQrEcMHk
    - melling 10y ago
      So, people just told him he was wrong? End of story. When someone throws out their ideas, people get to shoot them down then the status quo continues. I listened to all his podcasts. It was meant to be a conversation.
      - thomastjeffery 10y ago
        Not at all true. He was wrong, but he wasn't shot down in the slightest. One of the main focuses in development right now is the workflow/UI. https://code.blender.org/2015/07/blender-2-8-the-workflow-release/ https://code.blender.org/2015/07/blender-2-8-the-workflow-re... https://wiki.blender.org/index.php/Dev:2.8/ https://wiki.blender.org/index.php/Dev:2.8/

foxfired 10y ago

it's true, but when you figure it out, you wouldn't have it any other way. I remember how much I hated the UI, but like with any tool the more you use the better you get at it. For example, I find the left/right mouse buttons completely natural now.

deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
mungoid 10y ago
Totally agree. I use 3ds Max a lot for work and I have modified as much as possible in those settings to work like blender. It baffles everyone else I work with.
- geoka9 10y ago
  Exactly, it's like most of my programmer co-workers getting baffled when they see somebody using a keyboard/command-line-oriented linux setup instead of a mouse-oriented mac.

parenthephobia 10y ago

How does one define deeply strange? It's right to say it's not what we're used to. But I think if there was some fundamental wrongness with it, I'd have problems switching between Blender and other software with similar uses. e.g. I often use Blender and Unity in tandem and I don't find myself trying to use each the wrong way when I switch between. OTOH, I disable the left-click to set the cursor because I find it distracting and very rarely want it - only when I want an arbitrary pivot for transforms, or to align vertices from different meshes. It irritates me deeply that there's no way to hide the cursor without also hiding e.g. the selection outline and the grid.

dispose13432 10y ago
Good UX means to make simple thing simple, but permit complicated workflows. What I want is to make simple things (basic modeling, materials, colors) to be a simple one click away.
- geoka9 10y ago
  Honestly I haven't seen a 3d tool like that. Perhaps it's just the nature of the beast and I should be glad that in Blender at least the complicated workflows are smooth once you get past the "bootcamp" stage.
  - semi-extrinsic 10y ago
    > Honestly I haven't seen a 3d tool like that. Perhaps SketchUp comes close?
  - stan_rogers 10y ago
    It's been a while, but the trueSpace UI (the "classic" version that went back to Caligari on the Amiga) would be a pretty good match for that. It got a bit hairy with deformations (which is why a different UI mode was added to later editions), but basic geometry, extrusions, lathing, booleans and bones were a breeze either numerically or by click-and-drag. Simple things really were simple.
  - 10y ago

dispose13432 10y ago

It's something everyone knows about, and nothing can be done. As I heard, it's almost a full rewrite.

semi-extrinsic 10y ago

At least the Python API is deeply strange. Stuff is undocumented to out here, uses different units for input from the UI even though function name is the same, and API actions in a script depend on mouse focus... But despite it's flaws, I love Blender.

mungoid 10y ago

Before 2.5 I hated the UI. But after 2.5, I realized I could work so much faster once I learned the keys and layout. I have used 3ds Max for years and even knowing a lot about that software, I still find myself exporting to blender so I can do something. Usually I can do something in blender with only a couple key presses where in other software I have to click a few different buttons in various popup windows, etc. I do think some of the UI needs to be a little more logical, but aside from that I honestly want to see their UI in more.

zem 10y ago
it's basically the vi of 3d modellers (:
- dispose13432 10y ago
  I wouldn't call it vi. I'd call it the Windows API of 3d modelers. vi is easy. Type vi file.txt 1. To delete, type x. 2. To insert, type a. 3. To save and quit, type ZZ. 4. To move up, down, right left (in "classic" vi), use "KJLH" There. You can be productive. Not fully, but enough to get basics done. To use blender's relatively basic tools, say to draw a glass wall, you need a step by step guide, using quite obscure commands. Reminds me of Windows API (or GIMP, by the way)
  - Tarean 10y ago
    It is very close to vi/vim's philosophy - different modes for different task, key bindings are mnemonics, you combine basic commands to more complex tasks. Even window manipulation is the same with the hierarchy of content->splits as viewports->layouts. It is harder to do work without understanding these concepts in blender because editing text is simpler, though.
  - notheguyouthink 10y ago
    > To save and quit, type ZZ I've been a 100% Vim user for ... man, 6 years? Including partial vim usage for another few years before that? And `ZZ` is entirely new to me haha. This is a weird problem for me with Vim. I love it, but it's an issue of "i don't know what i don't know". I really need to setup a Vim "key combo of the day" or something. Preferably something that has a JSON API so that i can pipe it into my vim-startify.

AWildDHHAppears 10y ago

It's not that bad.

njharman 10y ago

I haven't used blender in years, so don't know about recent UI. But I totally loved the interface of the first opened version. It seemed optimized for power users, not casual users. So, steep learning curve but very rewarding/powerful if you invested time to learn it. Reminds me of vim.

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

thomastjeffery 10y ago

It seems like no one commenting here knows anything, so I'll just leave these here: https://code.blender.org/2015/07/blender-2-8-the-workflow-release/ https://code.blender.org/2015/07/blender-2-8-the-workflow-re... https://wiki.blender.org/index.php/Dev:2.8/ https://wiki.blender.org/index.php/Dev:2.8/ Right now, the main focus is in the (already fantastic IMHO) UI.