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Because they're obvious points to make. Apple's competitors have been clamoring to put Flash on their mobile devices because it's one more bullet point they ca

Because they're obvious points to make. Apple's competitors have been clamoring to put Flash on their mobile devices because it's one more bullet point they can use in their marketing against the iPhone. Yet it's 2010 and mobile Flash is still nowhere to be found. How is that not Adobe's fault?

tjogin 17y ago
I agree, but a hell of a lot of people are missing these obvious points, though. Most people with an opinion on Apple are.
barrkel 17y ago
Don't lose sight of the issue. 3.3.1 is the issue, not "Flash on the iPhone". By reframing the argument as "Flash on the iPhone", you are succumbing to misdirection.
- pyre 17y ago
  True enough. And Cocoa Touch is not an 'open standard.'
  - davidedicillo 17y ago
    Jobs never said that Cocoa is an open standard. He just state that Flash is as proprietary as Cocoa Touch. Market share =! Open. His point is that on the mobile web, HTML5 is open, not Flash.
    - pyre 17y ago
      So "Flash on the Web == Bad" because it's not open, but "Flash cross-compiled apps on iPhone == Bad" because it's not... open... ? The logic doesn't match up. As has been stated, it's a misdirection. Steve Jobs is setting fire to a house on the west side of town so that no one will notice that he's robbing the bank on the east side. He's trying to come off as an 'open crusader for the web against Adobe' because 'Adobe is not open,' but on the other hand shoving Adobe (and others) off of the i{Phone,Pad} platform because it's not part of Apple's own 'not open' environment. I hate Adobe as much as the next person, but let's not dress Steve Jobs up as a knight in shining armour just because he also doesn't like Adobe.
      - GHFigs 17y ago
        "Flash cross-compiled apps on iPhone == Bad" because it's not... open... Neither stated nor implied. The logic doesn't "match up" because it's a separate issue, addressed with different arguments: "We have discussed the downsides of using Flash to play video and interactive content from websites, but Adobe also wants developers to adopt Flash to create apps that run on our mobile devices." He then goes on about third-party middleware, e.g.: "We cannot be at the mercy of a third party deciding if and when they will make our enhancements available to our developers." Jobs does not make the openness argument in reference to Apple's proprietary platform at all. It seems to me that you have to ignore the last third of the article to think that he was. He's trying to come off as an 'open crusader for the web against Adobe' Is Jobs lying when he says Apple supports open web standards?
    - Qz 17y ago
      This has nothing to do with what's open and what isn't, it's about who controls what. Apple controls iPhoneOS, Adobe controls Flash. It's a prizefight. Don't get caught in a sucker punch just because you were paying attention to the fancy footwork.
- sumeeta 17y ago
  3.3.1 is an issue for developers. No Flash is actually a super huge deal for users. I think one of the main reasons they published this was so they could respond to “iPhone doesn’t even have Flash.”

tjogin 17y ago

I agree, but a hell of a lot of people are missing these obvious points, though. Most people with an opinion on Apple are.

barrkel 17y ago

Don't lose sight of the issue. 3.3.1 is the issue, not "Flash on the iPhone". By reframing the argument as "Flash on the iPhone", you are succumbing to misdirection.

pyre 17y ago
True enough. And Cocoa Touch is not an 'open standard.'
- davidedicillo 17y ago
  Jobs never said that Cocoa is an open standard. He just state that Flash is as proprietary as Cocoa Touch. Market share =! Open. His point is that on the mobile web, HTML5 is open, not Flash.
  - pyre 17y ago
    So "Flash on the Web == Bad" because it's not open, but "Flash cross-compiled apps on iPhone == Bad" because it's not... open... ? The logic doesn't match up. As has been stated, it's a misdirection. Steve Jobs is setting fire to a house on the west side of town so that no one will notice that he's robbing the bank on the east side. He's trying to come off as an 'open crusader for the web against Adobe' because 'Adobe is not open,' but on the other hand shoving Adobe (and others) off of the i{Phone,Pad} platform because it's not part of Apple's own 'not open' environment. I hate Adobe as much as the next person, but let's not dress Steve Jobs up as a knight in shining armour just because he also doesn't like Adobe.
    - GHFigs 17y ago
      "Flash cross-compiled apps on iPhone == Bad" because it's not... open... Neither stated nor implied. The logic doesn't "match up" because it's a separate issue, addressed with different arguments: "We have discussed the downsides of using Flash to play video and interactive content from websites, but Adobe also wants developers to adopt Flash to create apps that run on our mobile devices." He then goes on about third-party middleware, e.g.: "We cannot be at the mercy of a third party deciding if and when they will make our enhancements available to our developers." Jobs does not make the openness argument in reference to Apple's proprietary platform at all. It seems to me that you have to ignore the last third of the article to think that he was. He's trying to come off as an 'open crusader for the web against Adobe' Is Jobs lying when he says Apple supports open web standards?
  - Qz 17y ago
    This has nothing to do with what's open and what isn't, it's about who controls what. Apple controls iPhoneOS, Adobe controls Flash. It's a prizefight. Don't get caught in a sucker punch just because you were paying attention to the fancy footwork.
sumeeta 17y ago
3.3.1 is an issue for developers. No Flash is actually a super huge deal for users. I think one of the main reasons they published this was so they could respond to “iPhone doesn’t even have Flash.”