> I surely did not like when that hapenned to Object Pascal, Mac Common Lisp or Dylan. The difference here being that Objective-C is unsafe, and its relatively

> I surely did not like when that hapenned to Object Pascal, Mac Common Lisp or Dylan. The difference here being that Objective-C is unsafe, and its relatively low level of abstraction in comparison to the aforementioned languages, make it less than ideal as an applications language, especially compared to those languages. As you say, "the C part is still there". I'm with you. I want to be using safer languages, both because there is inherent value in safety, and because safety tends to come with more and better tools for building abstractions. While I lament the loss of Obj-Pas, MCL, and Dylan, I whole-heartedly welcome the arrival of Swift. Even if it means nothing to me directly anymore as an apostate of the Apple platform, I hope that it will fuel a push for better, safer languages across the board. In many ways, I think technologies like MCL and Dylan were victims of being ahead of their time. These are exciting times to live in as a programming language geek/snob, as the lessons of the past are finally rediscovered, absorbed, and made practical, popular, and cool :)