5 ms·

While I do think the guy should be prosecuted, I don't like how TC is turning the ordeal into another way to make money. It reminds me of public hangings.

by ihodes 17y ago

lionhearted 17y ago
> While I do think the guy should be prosecuted, I don't like how TC is turning the ordeal into another way to make money. I had almost the opposite reaction - I also think the guy should be prosecuted, but I think it's smart how they're turning it into an ordeal. They got messed up by the guy, but instead of being all serious and sober and lawyery, they're having a good time with it.
- dandelany 17y ago
  They're also probably more than a little worried that a headline like "TechCrunch files charges against hacker" might alienate some of their audience, many of which are 'hackers', albeit in a very different sense. I think it's smart of them to ask their readers what they should do.
  - philh 17y ago
    I suspect that sort of hacker knows about the dual meanings of the word.
metamemetics 17y ago
This guy is probably already scared shitless and crapped several pairs of pants when he realized he was under FBI investigation. I can't see how the minimal damages are worth dragging him through a lengthy trial and bankrupting him with legal fees and a felony conviction on his permenant record.
- Tichy 17y ago
  Hacking web sites is not a game. I suspect most criminals crap their pants when they get caught - should they all be let go?
  - metamemetics 17y ago
    Definitely yes if the punishment for their respective crimes is not in correspondence with damage actually done. If crack cocaine carries a mandatory sentencing of 5 years in jail for less than a gram (it used to), the only moral thing to do is to let the offender go. Even if you think they deserve to be punished to some degree, you have to examine if the expected punishment is proportional to the desired punishment. He inconvenienced TC for one hour. A felony conviction would be screwing him over for the rest of his life, possibly 70+ years. I don't see any positive outcomes from that which would offset resources wasted prosecuting.
    - Tichy 17y ago
      That is just how the system works, though, you commit a crime, you get convicted. Then you could argue that the laws should change. But I can't understand these kids(?): smart enough to hack a server, but not smart enough to understand the consequences? Presumably he is feeling invincible? There seem to be a lot of people who might be willing to give him a second change even with a felony conviction. It sounds like you would? If he really is just a stupid kid, there might be extra laws for kids, and the punishment less severe? Cocaine is an entirely different matter, because it only damages the user, not other people. Hacking a public server damages other people. How is that excusable? And he didn't just put up a powned message, either, he tried to make money. What's next, selling accounts to the russian mafia? I mean I would agree with you that if you personally feel that the crime is not really a crime (as you might feel about possession of drugs), you wouldn't press charges. But I don't see how hacking a server with the purpose of making money could not be considered a crime.
    - CWuestefeld 17y ago
      Prosecute, without a doubt. In the chat transcripts, they explicitly discuss the possibility of getting caught. The perp knew the risks, and made a conscious decision to proceed. The Friend's discussion about getting paid for links reveals a pattern (albeit not in this case) of doing this for personal gain. And they also show clearly that they understand the effects of their behavior on the victims, and just don't care about it. If you want to prevent these hackers from mischief, there must be a credible threat of repercussions. Letting them go will not discourage all this guy's friends. But maybe in a similar conversation next year, when they're talking about getting caught, someone will mention "you remember last year when Xyz got caught, and he's still in jail!".
- keefe 17y ago
  This is seriously right. A website was directed somewhere else for short period so we should... fuck this guy's whole life for it? I can't believe 3X as many people voted to convict this guys, it just confirms my opinion of human nature. We should show this guy some compassion and redirect our resources to the thousands of rapes and murders that get cold cased after a week due to lack of funds to continue. Our whole system is basically fucked, it's time for a rewrite.
WiseWeasel 17y ago
I know... it all feels a bit empty without some rotten vegetables or something to throw at the guy.
_delirium 17y ago
It might manage to help the guy's case, though. If it looks like TechCrunch is pressing charges as part of some kind of publicity stunt, their testimony becomes not very credible. No idea if the guy would be able to manage to get it brought to the jury's attention, but if they found out about it, I can't imagine it winning points with the jury.

While I do think the guy should be prosecuted, I don't like how TC is turning the ordeal into another way to make money. It reminds me of public hangings.

by ihodes 17y ago

While I do think the guy should be prosecuted, I don't like how TC is turning the ordeal into another way to make money. It reminds me of public hangings.

lionhearted 17y ago

> While I do think the guy should be prosecuted, I don't like how TC is turning the ordeal into another way to make money. I had almost the opposite reaction - I also think the guy should be prosecuted, but I think it's smart how they're turning it into an ordeal. They got messed up by the guy, but instead of being all serious and sober and lawyery, they're having a good time with it.

dandelany 17y ago
They're also probably more than a little worried that a headline like "TechCrunch files charges against hacker" might alienate some of their audience, many of which are 'hackers', albeit in a very different sense. I think it's smart of them to ask their readers what they should do.
- philh 17y ago
  I suspect that sort of hacker knows about the dual meanings of the word.

metamemetics 17y ago

This guy is probably already scared shitless and crapped several pairs of pants when he realized he was under FBI investigation. I can't see how the minimal damages are worth dragging him through a lengthy trial and bankrupting him with legal fees and a felony conviction on his permenant record.

Tichy 17y ago
Hacking web sites is not a game. I suspect most criminals crap their pants when they get caught - should they all be let go?
- metamemetics 17y ago
  Definitely yes if the punishment for their respective crimes is not in correspondence with damage actually done. If crack cocaine carries a mandatory sentencing of 5 years in jail for less than a gram (it used to), the only moral thing to do is to let the offender go. Even if you think they deserve to be punished to some degree, you have to examine if the expected punishment is proportional to the desired punishment. He inconvenienced TC for one hour. A felony conviction would be screwing him over for the rest of his life, possibly 70+ years. I don't see any positive outcomes from that which would offset resources wasted prosecuting.
  - Tichy 17y ago
    That is just how the system works, though, you commit a crime, you get convicted. Then you could argue that the laws should change. But I can't understand these kids(?): smart enough to hack a server, but not smart enough to understand the consequences? Presumably he is feeling invincible? There seem to be a lot of people who might be willing to give him a second change even with a felony conviction. It sounds like you would? If he really is just a stupid kid, there might be extra laws for kids, and the punishment less severe? Cocaine is an entirely different matter, because it only damages the user, not other people. Hacking a public server damages other people. How is that excusable? And he didn't just put up a powned message, either, he tried to make money. What's next, selling accounts to the russian mafia? I mean I would agree with you that if you personally feel that the crime is not really a crime (as you might feel about possession of drugs), you wouldn't press charges. But I don't see how hacking a server with the purpose of making money could not be considered a crime.
  - CWuestefeld 17y ago
    Prosecute, without a doubt. In the chat transcripts, they explicitly discuss the possibility of getting caught. The perp knew the risks, and made a conscious decision to proceed. The Friend's discussion about getting paid for links reveals a pattern (albeit not in this case) of doing this for personal gain. And they also show clearly that they understand the effects of their behavior on the victims, and just don't care about it. If you want to prevent these hackers from mischief, there must be a credible threat of repercussions. Letting them go will not discourage all this guy's friends. But maybe in a similar conversation next year, when they're talking about getting caught, someone will mention "you remember last year when Xyz got caught, and he's still in jail!".
keefe 17y ago
This is seriously right. A website was directed somewhere else for short period so we should... fuck this guy's whole life for it? I can't believe 3X as many people voted to convict this guys, it just confirms my opinion of human nature. We should show this guy some compassion and redirect our resources to the thousands of rapes and murders that get cold cased after a week due to lack of funds to continue. Our whole system is basically fucked, it's time for a rewrite.

WiseWeasel 17y ago

I know... it all feels a bit empty without some rotten vegetables or something to throw at the guy.

_delirium 17y ago

It might manage to help the guy's case, though. If it looks like TechCrunch is pressing charges as part of some kind of publicity stunt, their testimony becomes not very credible. No idea if the guy would be able to manage to get it brought to the jury's attention, but if they found out about it, I can't imagine it winning points with the jury.