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Either they don't want to release it or they can't (a third-party contract/NDA), at least right now. Open sourcing is often seen by big-businesses as potentiall

Either they don't want to release it or they can't (a third-party contract/NDA), at least right now. Open sourcing is often seen by big-businesses as potentially "helping" competitors undermine, replicate, sue, make interoperable wares which may threaten the "Golden Goose." It sucks, but that's the situation... lawyers can't force them to release other code unless they're caught TiVoizing some GPL 3 code or something similar. You'd think Apple would want to invent the next cool kids bandwagon, maybe invite some community goodwill and crowdsource maybe some new features like fixing time synchronization to have a high-precision ability or working on another actual replacement for HFS+, or adding Windows compatibility. Maybe developer pressure could sway them, and wouldn't it be a good PR move to eventually relent after a long, drawn-out public debate which buys some time for the Apple Car or whatever else is cooking next to be readied? Ive and Cook have massive shoes to fill, which they and the Apple team helped fill, but many people don't think that right now, at least not yet.

0x0 10y ago
They are working on APFS to replace HFS+ and sierra ships a beta already, at least :)
ta12345 10y ago
I can't believe this is a serious comment. The majority of open source is crap, like 80% of it. People build what they need and forget about it. Often the code has no cohesion to the rest of the project and often it is of poor quality. Not to mention the ego's and lack of sociability of most projects. Apple didn't become the most valuable company by following that principle. Instead it took the approach of an egotistical maniac who demanded perfection and required that all the pieces fit together as part of an elegant puzzle. No small feat and not really replicated today -- except for Tesla and SpaceX. If I'm missing something, please name one other company today has has a "hit" product that unanimously loved (aka has insane sales and really high ratings) to the extent of the iPod, iPhone, Model S, etc.. Furthermore, I'd challenge you to name one open source project that can be shipped AS-IS as a product. Don't even say the Linux kernel, that has like what 2% market share? No doubt the majority of HN folks are sharp but there is a huge lack of emotional intelligence. I've found this at many tech companies except Apple. Even when talking with Apple engineers I find myself talking to another HUMAN who happens to appreciate technology and understands it isn't the be all end all. Its sad to see such a company lose it soul but it was inevitable. Disclaimer: I'm a kernel developer and contributor.
- throwaway123dse 10y ago
  > Instead it took the approach of an egotistical maniac who demanded perfection and required that all the pieces fit together as part of an elegant puzzle. No small feat and not really replicated today -- except for Tesla and SpaceX. Off topic, but Tesla and SpaceX are definitely not "egotistical maniac who demanded perfection and required that all the pieces fit together as part of an elegant puzzle"
- MaxfordAndSons 10y ago
  > Furthermore, I'd challenge you to name one open source project that can be shipped AS-IS as a product. Don't even say the Linux kernel, that has like what 2% market share? GitLab. Postgres. Atom. Docker (debatable). I could go on, but to be fair I am a bit of a hoarder of interesting oss. Re the Linux kernel: isn't it way higher than 2% if you count commercial and industrial usage? Also Android devices.
  - LaSombra 10y ago
    WildFly, Apache httpd and Tomcat, git, Mercurial, LibreOffice for most cases, Darktable, Hexchat, Pidgin and the list goes on and on :)
  - BoorishBears 10y ago
    Calling Android devices Linux is not productive.
    - ovao 10y ago
      He was referring specifically to Android's use of the Linux kernel. He was not calling Android "Linux", though I think doing so would be fair in a general sense.
  - pjmlp 10y ago
    I could have an Android device using another kernel and the majority of PlayStore apps wouldn't notice. For the NDK ones, using the set of official APIs would be also enough. The only ones that would fail, would be the ones that try to bend the rules of official APIs.
toyg 10y ago
> You'd think Apple would want to invent the next cool kids bandwagon They don't care. Objective #1 is selling more iDevices. Objective #2 is selling more iDevices. Objective #3 is selling more iDevices. Everything else is a mean to that end. Take Swift: it only exists to make it easier to build iOS apps, so that they can sell more iDevices. APFS is being introduced so that flash-based systems can work better, so that they can sell more iDevices. And so on and so forth. That's an admirable level of focus, mind; just don't expect they do anything because it sounds cool to geeks - Apple just doesn't work like that.
- pjmlp 10y ago
  Outside of the UNIX loving geeks, there are many of us that find lots of macOS architecture stack cool.

0x0 10y ago

They are working on APFS to replace HFS+ and sierra ships a beta already, at least :)

ta12345 10y ago

I can't believe this is a serious comment. The majority of open source is crap, like 80% of it. People build what they need and forget about it. Often the code has no cohesion to the rest of the project and often it is of poor quality. Not to mention the ego's and lack of sociability of most projects. Apple didn't become the most valuable company by following that principle. Instead it took the approach of an egotistical maniac who demanded perfection and required that all the pieces fit together as part of an elegant puzzle. No small feat and not really replicated today -- except for Tesla and SpaceX. If I'm missing something, please name one other company today has has a "hit" product that unanimously loved (aka has insane sales and really high ratings) to the extent of the iPod, iPhone, Model S, etc.. Furthermore, I'd challenge you to name one open source project that can be shipped AS-IS as a product. Don't even say the Linux kernel, that has like what 2% market share? No doubt the majority of HN folks are sharp but there is a huge lack of emotional intelligence. I've found this at many tech companies except Apple. Even when talking with Apple engineers I find myself talking to another HUMAN who happens to appreciate technology and understands it isn't the be all end all. Its sad to see such a company lose it soul but it was inevitable. Disclaimer: I'm a kernel developer and contributor.

throwaway123dse 10y ago
> Instead it took the approach of an egotistical maniac who demanded perfection and required that all the pieces fit together as part of an elegant puzzle. No small feat and not really replicated today -- except for Tesla and SpaceX. Off topic, but Tesla and SpaceX are definitely not "egotistical maniac who demanded perfection and required that all the pieces fit together as part of an elegant puzzle"
MaxfordAndSons 10y ago
> Furthermore, I'd challenge you to name one open source project that can be shipped AS-IS as a product. Don't even say the Linux kernel, that has like what 2% market share? GitLab. Postgres. Atom. Docker (debatable). I could go on, but to be fair I am a bit of a hoarder of interesting oss. Re the Linux kernel: isn't it way higher than 2% if you count commercial and industrial usage? Also Android devices.
- LaSombra 10y ago
  WildFly, Apache httpd and Tomcat, git, Mercurial, LibreOffice for most cases, Darktable, Hexchat, Pidgin and the list goes on and on :)
- BoorishBears 10y ago
  Calling Android devices Linux is not productive.
  - ovao 10y ago
    He was referring specifically to Android's use of the Linux kernel. He was not calling Android "Linux", though I think doing so would be fair in a general sense.
- pjmlp 10y ago
  I could have an Android device using another kernel and the majority of PlayStore apps wouldn't notice. For the NDK ones, using the set of official APIs would be also enough. The only ones that would fail, would be the ones that try to bend the rules of official APIs.

toyg 10y ago

> You'd think Apple would want to invent the next cool kids bandwagon They don't care. Objective #1 is selling more iDevices. Objective #2 is selling more iDevices. Objective #3 is selling more iDevices. Everything else is a mean to that end. Take Swift: it only exists to make it easier to build iOS apps, so that they can sell more iDevices. APFS is being introduced so that flash-based systems can work better, so that they can sell more iDevices. And so on and so forth. That's an admirable level of focus, mind; just don't expect they do anything because it sounds cool to geeks - Apple just doesn't work like that.

pjmlp 10y ago
Outside of the UNIX loving geeks, there are many of us that find lots of macOS architecture stack cool.