3 ms·

The Culture themselves aren't terribly interesting. What really makes the books shine (for me) are their interactions with lower-tech societies.

by pkinsky 10y ago

HCIdivision17 10y ago
This is lampshaded pretty hard in Consider Phlebas, I think, where Horza basically hates the Culture for that reason (among others). I also consider Star Trek's Federation boring as well, but worse: at least The Culture meddles in the affairs of other groups (for better or worse!).
- throwanem 10y ago
  So does the Federation. It just lies to itself and everyone else about so doing.
  - david-given 10y ago
    There's an SF fan theory which tends to show up around the late-night bars in conventions that the Star Trek Federation and the Blake's Seven Federation are, in fact, the same Federation --- it's just we're seeing the propaganda films released by both sides. Naturally, the anti- side doesn't have nearly as much money as the pro- side, which is why the special effects in Blake's Seven are so bad.
    - throwanem 10y ago
      The things I miss out on by not going to sf conventions. It makes a lot of sense, too. I mean, TNG started out with political commissars, even - take a look at Troi's character in Season One, especially e.g. Conspiracy, and tell me that's not exactly the role she's playing.
    - throwaway-hn123 10y ago
      Hah,. that's brilliant. I always did like Servalan.
    - thro32 10y ago
      There is even parody film, how Federation is totalitarian state. It is filmed in Finland, Federation are Russians: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Wreck:_In_the_Pirkinning https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Wreck:_In_the_Pirkinning
  - Tloewald 10y ago
    The Federation has the problem of being completely undefined; it has a president but no elections, politics, news? Does it have money or not? If not how does that work? We haven't really seen how normal people live inside the Federation. The Culture is a benevolent Matrix where machines make decisions taking the desires and opinions of humans into account to whatever extent they choose to. The amorphous nature of the society is actually part of its explicit nature (whether a ship or population is part of The Culture is kind of up for debate and reassessment at any given time) The difference between the Federation and the Culture is that Banks actually considered the societal impacts of matter compilers, godlike AI, etc. and tried to describe the results as he imagined them. THe Federation is "kind of like the modern US" with a bunch of tech that would make the modern US make no sense at all.

The Culture themselves aren't terribly interesting. What really makes the books shine (for me) are their interactions with lower-tech societies.

by pkinsky 10y ago

The Culture themselves aren't terribly interesting. What really makes the books shine (for me) are their interactions with lower-tech societies.

HCIdivision17 10y ago

This is lampshaded pretty hard in Consider Phlebas, I think, where Horza basically hates the Culture for that reason (among others). I also consider Star Trek's Federation boring as well, but worse: at least The Culture meddles in the affairs of other groups (for better or worse!).

throwanem 10y ago
So does the Federation. It just lies to itself and everyone else about so doing.
- david-given 10y ago
  There's an SF fan theory which tends to show up around the late-night bars in conventions that the Star Trek Federation and the Blake's Seven Federation are, in fact, the same Federation --- it's just we're seeing the propaganda films released by both sides. Naturally, the anti- side doesn't have nearly as much money as the pro- side, which is why the special effects in Blake's Seven are so bad.
  - throwanem 10y ago
    The things I miss out on by not going to sf conventions. It makes a lot of sense, too. I mean, TNG started out with political commissars, even - take a look at Troi's character in Season One, especially e.g. Conspiracy, and tell me that's not exactly the role she's playing.
  - throwaway-hn123 10y ago
    Hah,. that's brilliant. I always did like Servalan.
  - thro32 10y ago
    There is even parody film, how Federation is totalitarian state. It is filmed in Finland, Federation are Russians: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Wreck:_In_the_Pirkinning https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Wreck:_In_the_Pirkinning
- Tloewald 10y ago
  The Federation has the problem of being completely undefined; it has a president but no elections, politics, news? Does it have money or not? If not how does that work? We haven't really seen how normal people live inside the Federation. The Culture is a benevolent Matrix where machines make decisions taking the desires and opinions of humans into account to whatever extent they choose to. The amorphous nature of the society is actually part of its explicit nature (whether a ship or population is part of The Culture is kind of up for debate and reassessment at any given time) The difference between the Federation and the Culture is that Banks actually considered the societal impacts of matter compilers, godlike AI, etc. and tried to describe the results as he imagined them. THe Federation is "kind of like the modern US" with a bunch of tech that would make the modern US make no sense at all.