5 ms·

But someone has to pay for the health care, so they're losing some freedom (money in this case). That person gives up freedom also on the pricing of your health

But someone has to pay for the health care, so they're losing some freedom (money in this case). That person gives up freedom also on the pricing of your healthcare. Note: that person may be you, depending on taxation

jdub 10y ago
The value of the better society I live in is greater than the value of what I pay in tax.
omginternets 10y ago
You're equating money with freedom where the question is philosophical: can you be 'free' in any meaningful way if your life is burdened by a lack of education, the financial ruin of having been seriously ill, or the handicap of having been poorly treated for a disease? So yes, that's precisely the trade-off. We accept to lose a little bit of money in exchange for the ability to flourish.
- witty_username 10y ago
  But you can buy health insurance instead of public healthcare. But you lose the freedom to decide.
  - omginternets 10y ago
    >So yes, that's precisely the trade-off. We accept to lose a little bit of s/money/freedom-of-decision in exchange for the ability to flourish.
    - deleted 10y ago
      [deleted]
- zo1 10y ago
  This is a fundamental difference in view point on the concept of "Freedom". That's also why it's important to call taxation for what it truly is. Until people can be born free without automatic obligation to the state to provide for "your freedom", then they're not really free. That is the only freedom that matters and is definable outside of feel-good politics. So lets be honest: I'm losing the "Freedom" to spend all my money how I choose, so you can be free of the worry that certain "bad" things may happen to you.
cpncrunch 10y ago
People in France pay less than half what people in the USA pay for healthcare, and they also get much better quality of healthcare as well. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_total_health_expenditure_per_capita https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_total_hea... How are you "free" when you're being scammed by your insurance companies and hospitals into paying more than twice what you should be for your inferior healthcare?
- witty_username 10y ago
  If insurance companies and hospitals are scamming people, then why aren't people investing in those companies? Or why aren't people starting a insurance company or hospital? If there's really a scam, people could make good money from it.
  - cpncrunch 10y ago
    Actually, inefficiency would probably be a better term than "scam". Here is an article that goes into some of the reasons: http://insights.som.yale.edu/insights/why-is-healthcare-so-expensive http://insights.som.yale.edu/insights/why-is-healthcare-so-e...
  - tmnvix 10y ago
    > If insurance companies and hospitals are scamming people, then why aren't people investing in those companies? People do. Generally wealthy people. That there is so much money being made in the healthcare industry is a large part of the problem.

jdub 10y ago

The value of the better society I live in is greater than the value of what I pay in tax.

omginternets 10y ago

You're equating money with freedom where the question is philosophical: can you be 'free' in any meaningful way if your life is burdened by a lack of education, the financial ruin of having been seriously ill, or the handicap of having been poorly treated for a disease? So yes, that's precisely the trade-off. We accept to lose a little bit of money in exchange for the ability to flourish.

witty_username 10y ago
But you can buy health insurance instead of public healthcare. But you lose the freedom to decide.
- omginternets 10y ago
  >So yes, that's precisely the trade-off. We accept to lose a little bit of s/money/freedom-of-decision in exchange for the ability to flourish.
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]
zo1 10y ago
This is a fundamental difference in view point on the concept of "Freedom". That's also why it's important to call taxation for what it truly is. Until people can be born free without automatic obligation to the state to provide for "your freedom", then they're not really free. That is the only freedom that matters and is definable outside of feel-good politics. So lets be honest: I'm losing the "Freedom" to spend all my money how I choose, so you can be free of the worry that certain "bad" things may happen to you.

cpncrunch 10y ago

People in France pay less than half what people in the USA pay for healthcare, and they also get much better quality of healthcare as well. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_total_health_expenditure_per_capita https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_total_hea... How are you "free" when you're being scammed by your insurance companies and hospitals into paying more than twice what you should be for your inferior healthcare?

witty_username 10y ago
If insurance companies and hospitals are scamming people, then why aren't people investing in those companies? Or why aren't people starting a insurance company or hospital? If there's really a scam, people could make good money from it.
- cpncrunch 10y ago
  Actually, inefficiency would probably be a better term than "scam". Here is an article that goes into some of the reasons: http://insights.som.yale.edu/insights/why-is-healthcare-so-expensive http://insights.som.yale.edu/insights/why-is-healthcare-so-e...
- tmnvix 10y ago
  > If insurance companies and hospitals are scamming people, then why aren't people investing in those companies? People do. Generally wealthy people. That there is so much money being made in the healthcare industry is a large part of the problem.