4 ms·

Having just been through the process myself, here's my advice. 1) If you are moving from the US, you want to move to Europe not for better jobs, but for better

by andr 10y ago

Having just been through the process myself, here's my advice. 1) If you are moving from the US, you want to move to Europe not for better jobs, but for better quality of life overall. Europeans work less hours, have more vacation, and many more places to go to with a $50 plane ticket. Unless you live in NYC, your future European capital will likely be more diverse when it comes to culture and food. 2) Start by picking the city where you want to live. Scout it, see what is around, see what the people are like. Look for a job after you find that place. 3) Meeting people face to face will make your job search much easier. If you can AirBnB your US apartment, that might even be enough to pay for a trip to cheaper cities like Berlin or Barcelona. 4) Yes, you'll need a work visa, and while each country is a little different when it comes to those, generally being sponsored by a company is all you need. 5) In most cases, don't worry about the native language. I have found jobs, and know people that have done the same, in Zurich, Paris, Amsterdam, Berlin, and Barcelona, knowing only English. Once you settle, you might want to learn the local language for social reasons, of course, but there are plenty of English-only jobs.

geff82 10y ago
There are some English-Only jobs of course, but the competition for it is higher. If you know the local language, you have a lot of offerings to choose from (at least it is like this in Germany outside Berlin and banking-Frankfurt). Not knowing German reduces your chance to find a new job in case you need it.
tom_mellior 10y ago
> In most cases, don't worry about the native language. [...] Paris [...] I know a bunch of fellow expats in Paris. The ones that came here with the intention of learning/improving French are usually happy. The ones that came expecting to get by with only English are absolutely miserable and hate it here. The French (rightly) regard you as an arrogant prick if you don't show that you are willing to make the effort, and they treat you accordingly. Yes, the other places you mentioned are probably easier in this regard.
- cstejerean 10y ago
  This is what I always heard about visiting Paris and it honestly put me off visiting for a long time. But what I found when I actually went to Paris was the exact opposite. Everyone I interacted with loved the opportunity to practice their English and everyone was incredibly nice and accommodating. Now it's probably very different when you are visiting as a tourist compared to living there as an expat.
  - Xylakant 10y ago
    > Now it's probably very different when you are visiting as a tourist compared to living there as an expat. It is - rightfully so. Expectations towards a tourist are very different and the matters a tourist needs to settle are much simpler than the matters a resident needs to settle. Interactions with the local administration, your landlord, ... A lot of that will be very hard if you're not speaking the language. Getting a grasp for the local culture is easier if you speak the language. Also, if you're still stuck with not speaking a single word of your host countries language, a lot of people will consider that impolite. Nobody expects perfection, but at least show a little effort :)
- _rl8k 10y ago
  I've been to Paris recently for a 3 days tech event. I would say that in my experience it is the French people that are often arrogant in that they get pissed / make fun of people who can't speak their language. A friend of mine that was with me and can speak French to a decent level had troubles even ordering stuff in a bar because the girls working there didn't make the effort to understand beyond his foreign accent... and he is half Belgian. Of course my experience is limited and of course you would expect someone living in France for a long time to learn the language, but it's also a matter of good manners. I, too, would hate to live there if my experience is the norm. EDIT: It seems that other people had the opposite experience so take anything with a grain of salt.
  - bobwaycott 10y ago
    Even as a tourist knowing only English, the best ways to ingratiate yourself with everyone is to at least start with a French greeting—especially when walking into shops, cafes, etc. Americans are far too accustomed to employees greeting them. If you walk into a place, some quick, intentional eye contact and a friendly sounding "Bonjour!" go a long way. French shop owners/workers in Paris don't make a point of saying, "Welcome to my shop, may I take your order?" I speak French, but whenever I would get lost in a conversation, I'd simply apologize, explain I'm American, and am having trouble understanding or following (all in French, of course; its worth learning how to say it), then ask if they spoke English or if they could slow down. At that point, they'd express being delighted to speak in English, and I'd keep trying to speak in French. Made for some very fun times with all the people I met. It's also worth learning how to say a few key phrases in the correct rhythm and tone. French isn't spoken with an English-like cadence.
rancar2 10y ago
With my team in Lisbon, we have multiple people who do not speak the native language, Portuguese. Since I do not look like I am Portuguese, everyone defaults to speaking English with me in public and are happy to. The quality in life in Portugal is very good especially with a developer's salary.
- 77pt77 10y ago
  > The quality in life in Portugal is very good especially with a developer's salary. What's the ballpark value? From what I understand wages are very low there.
  - munchor 10y ago
    Developers will rarely make more than 1500-2000€ per month, but this is, unfortunately, considered a lot of money there. So while in San Francisco one expects to make 100-120K, expect to make 20-24K in Portugal. The good news is that you can live comfortably with 2000€ per month, as food and housing are very cheap. (I'm a Portuguese guy working in SF)
    - 77pt77 10y ago
      Thank you for the data point.

by andr 10y ago

geff82 10y ago

There are some English-Only jobs of course, but the competition for it is higher. If you know the local language, you have a lot of offerings to choose from (at least it is like this in Germany outside Berlin and banking-Frankfurt). Not knowing German reduces your chance to find a new job in case you need it.

tom_mellior 10y ago

> In most cases, don't worry about the native language. [...] Paris [...] I know a bunch of fellow expats in Paris. The ones that came here with the intention of learning/improving French are usually happy. The ones that came expecting to get by with only English are absolutely miserable and hate it here. The French (rightly) regard you as an arrogant prick if you don't show that you are willing to make the effort, and they treat you accordingly. Yes, the other places you mentioned are probably easier in this regard.

cstejerean 10y ago
This is what I always heard about visiting Paris and it honestly put me off visiting for a long time. But what I found when I actually went to Paris was the exact opposite. Everyone I interacted with loved the opportunity to practice their English and everyone was incredibly nice and accommodating. Now it's probably very different when you are visiting as a tourist compared to living there as an expat.
- Xylakant 10y ago
  > Now it's probably very different when you are visiting as a tourist compared to living there as an expat. It is - rightfully so. Expectations towards a tourist are very different and the matters a tourist needs to settle are much simpler than the matters a resident needs to settle. Interactions with the local administration, your landlord, ... A lot of that will be very hard if you're not speaking the language. Getting a grasp for the local culture is easier if you speak the language. Also, if you're still stuck with not speaking a single word of your host countries language, a lot of people will consider that impolite. Nobody expects perfection, but at least show a little effort :)
_rl8k 10y ago
I've been to Paris recently for a 3 days tech event. I would say that in my experience it is the French people that are often arrogant in that they get pissed / make fun of people who can't speak their language. A friend of mine that was with me and can speak French to a decent level had troubles even ordering stuff in a bar because the girls working there didn't make the effort to understand beyond his foreign accent... and he is half Belgian. Of course my experience is limited and of course you would expect someone living in France for a long time to learn the language, but it's also a matter of good manners. I, too, would hate to live there if my experience is the norm. EDIT: It seems that other people had the opposite experience so take anything with a grain of salt.
- bobwaycott 10y ago
  Even as a tourist knowing only English, the best ways to ingratiate yourself with everyone is to at least start with a French greeting—especially when walking into shops, cafes, etc. Americans are far too accustomed to employees greeting them. If you walk into a place, some quick, intentional eye contact and a friendly sounding "Bonjour!" go a long way. French shop owners/workers in Paris don't make a point of saying, "Welcome to my shop, may I take your order?" I speak French, but whenever I would get lost in a conversation, I'd simply apologize, explain I'm American, and am having trouble understanding or following (all in French, of course; its worth learning how to say it), then ask if they spoke English or if they could slow down. At that point, they'd express being delighted to speak in English, and I'd keep trying to speak in French. Made for some very fun times with all the people I met. It's also worth learning how to say a few key phrases in the correct rhythm and tone. French isn't spoken with an English-like cadence.

rancar2 10y ago

With my team in Lisbon, we have multiple people who do not speak the native language, Portuguese. Since I do not look like I am Portuguese, everyone defaults to speaking English with me in public and are happy to. The quality in life in Portugal is very good especially with a developer's salary.

77pt77 10y ago
> The quality in life in Portugal is very good especially with a developer's salary. What's the ballpark value? From what I understand wages are very low there.
- munchor 10y ago
  Developers will rarely make more than 1500-2000€ per month, but this is, unfortunately, considered a lot of money there. So while in San Francisco one expects to make 100-120K, expect to make 20-24K in Portugal. The good news is that you can live comfortably with 2000€ per month, as food and housing are very cheap. (I'm a Portuguese guy working in SF)
  - 77pt77 10y ago
    Thank you for the data point.