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I don't think it's fair to blame people for thinking they could edit simple text files under that folder, well-hidden as it is. How many people already knew the

by mcbits 10y ago

I don't think it's fair to blame people for thinking they could edit simple text files under that folder, well-hidden as it is. How many people already knew there would be any issues beyond line endings (not counting those who learned by breaking things)? I sure didn't. It's pure luck that I hadn't tried it yet.

ocdtrekkie 10y ago
It's absolutely fair. To even SEE these files, there's a warning you must click through that notifies you that you can cause significant harm to your system if you modify them. So when one does so, and then one modifies them... one should definitely expect to cause significant harm. People who enable visibility on protected system files and then act upset that messing with protected system files breaks things, are the sort of reason we don't give out admin rights where I come from.
- mcbits 10y ago
  I don't think it's fair to be upset when editing those files breaks things, either. To be surprised? Yes, definitely. It is fair to expect software labeled "beta" to break in surprising ways, so I hope they're not giving permission to use WSL in production where you come from.
- SwellJoe 10y ago
  Hmm...none of that matches my experience. I opened them from Powershell or git bash and from Atom, maybe vim was involved. I don't remember the process of getting there, but I do remember it being tricky to find the directory where the Linux environment lived, but, maybe, a grep or find was involved. Windows Explorer was not involved. I'm a 20+ year Linux user. I use Linux tools to find things and to navigate places. I guess if I were a Windows user, who does things in the usual Windows way, I might have received a warning of some sort. I'm just saying it'd be cool if there were a warning somewhere in the docs about this issue. It wasn't something I expected. I mean, I don't have to worry about editing "Windows" files on my Linux system with WINE. And, I'm able to mount my Windows partition from Linux and edit files without fear of harming things. I assumed things worked the same way for WSL. It was a wrong assumption, but I don't feel like it means I'm stupid to have made it, based on the knowledge I had at the time.
  - wvenable 10y ago
    > I'm just saying it'd be cool if there were a warning somewhere in the docs about this issue. If you find any docs about this folder from Microsoft, you will find that they do warn you about exactly this. "Interoperability between Windows applications and files in VolFs is not supported." -- Microsoft
    - SwellJoe 10y ago
      I wasn't looking for docs on a folder, I was looking for docs about WSL (of which there were none other than the blog post about how to install and enable it, at the time). It's beta software, and I'm not complaining (my review of WSL at the time commented on this problem, without knowing it was a known issue, and I just said something to the effect of, "I won't do that again!" rather than "I'm gonna burn down Microsoft for doing this to me!"). It's no big deal, really. I didn't expect miracles, and it all works much better than I expected. I wish the interop were better, but I'm pleased it's even something Microsoft is trying to do.
      - wvenable 10y ago
        That quote comes from here: https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/wsl/2016/04/22/windows-subsystem-for-linux-overview/ https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/wsl/2016/04/22/windows-subs... But I suspect they specifically wouldn't mention it because it's an implementation detail people aren't supposed to know about or look into. The problem might have been more widespread had they actually said "Don't change anything in this specific hard to find hidden/system protected folder"
        SwellJoe 10y ago
        Cool. I might have even read that at some point in the process and lacked enough understanding of the system to know what it meant. I found the process of getting WSL installed quite confusing, so maybe I was distracted. But, reading it even now, it doesn't jump out at me that using a Windows app to mess with Linux files would be disastrous (it was not disastrous for me, but had the files been important, it would have been, as they disappeared). It sounds like it's a thing that just wouldn't work;, e.g. Windows apps wouldn't see them at all, rather than it would potentially destroy your Linux installation, which is what this blog post indicates can happen.

by mcbits 10y ago

ocdtrekkie 10y ago

It's absolutely fair. To even SEE these files, there's a warning you must click through that notifies you that you can cause significant harm to your system if you modify them. So when one does so, and then one modifies them... one should definitely expect to cause significant harm. People who enable visibility on protected system files and then act upset that messing with protected system files breaks things, are the sort of reason we don't give out admin rights where I come from.

mcbits 10y ago
I don't think it's fair to be upset when editing those files breaks things, either. To be surprised? Yes, definitely. It is fair to expect software labeled "beta" to break in surprising ways, so I hope they're not giving permission to use WSL in production where you come from.
SwellJoe 10y ago
Hmm...none of that matches my experience. I opened them from Powershell or git bash and from Atom, maybe vim was involved. I don't remember the process of getting there, but I do remember it being tricky to find the directory where the Linux environment lived, but, maybe, a grep or find was involved. Windows Explorer was not involved. I'm a 20+ year Linux user. I use Linux tools to find things and to navigate places. I guess if I were a Windows user, who does things in the usual Windows way, I might have received a warning of some sort. I'm just saying it'd be cool if there were a warning somewhere in the docs about this issue. It wasn't something I expected. I mean, I don't have to worry about editing "Windows" files on my Linux system with WINE. And, I'm able to mount my Windows partition from Linux and edit files without fear of harming things. I assumed things worked the same way for WSL. It was a wrong assumption, but I don't feel like it means I'm stupid to have made it, based on the knowledge I had at the time.
- wvenable 10y ago
  > I'm just saying it'd be cool if there were a warning somewhere in the docs about this issue. If you find any docs about this folder from Microsoft, you will find that they do warn you about exactly this. "Interoperability between Windows applications and files in VolFs is not supported." -- Microsoft
  - SwellJoe 10y ago
    I wasn't looking for docs on a folder, I was looking for docs about WSL (of which there were none other than the blog post about how to install and enable it, at the time). It's beta software, and I'm not complaining (my review of WSL at the time commented on this problem, without knowing it was a known issue, and I just said something to the effect of, "I won't do that again!" rather than "I'm gonna burn down Microsoft for doing this to me!"). It's no big deal, really. I didn't expect miracles, and it all works much better than I expected. I wish the interop were better, but I'm pleased it's even something Microsoft is trying to do.
    - wvenable 10y ago
      That quote comes from here: https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/wsl/2016/04/22/windows-subsystem-for-linux-overview/ https://blogs.msdn.microsoft.com/wsl/2016/04/22/windows-subs... But I suspect they specifically wouldn't mention it because it's an implementation detail people aren't supposed to know about or look into. The problem might have been more widespread had they actually said "Don't change anything in this specific hard to find hidden/system protected folder"
      - SwellJoe 10y ago
        Cool. I might have even read that at some point in the process and lacked enough understanding of the system to know what it meant. I found the process of getting WSL installed quite confusing, so maybe I was distracted. But, reading it even now, it doesn't jump out at me that using a Windows app to mess with Linux files would be disastrous (it was not disastrous for me, but had the files been important, it would have been, as they disappeared). It sounds like it's a thing that just wouldn't work;, e.g. Windows apps wouldn't see them at all, rather than it would potentially destroy your Linux installation, which is what this blog post indicates can happen.