5 ms·

I love driving a manual, but with the rise of CVT, what's the point?

by russdill 10y ago

sliken 10y ago
Amusingly subaru simulates gears with their CVT. By default you get 6 "gears", but in sport you get 8.
- ferongr 10y ago
  And that's completely missing a point of a CVT where you can keep the engine at a its most efficient speed and vary the transmission ratio to accelerate or decelerate in response to throttle input.
  - sliken 10y ago
    Agreed, it's sad that in chasing more market share subaru is making multiple decisions based on marketing and not on engineering. Forcing a CVT from the ideal RPM to entertain drivers seems impressively silly. Kind of like the Golf R, which installed a vibrating/unbalanced motor under the winshield to make a more pleasing vibration. Or the Mustang EcoBoost, various BMWs, and other cars that are using speakers to make more vroom noises to hide the less appealing note of their smaller turbo engines. Maybe the automatic folks should install a manual looking stick between the seats and whenever you move it it kills power for 0.5 seconds.
    - taneq 10y ago
      > Many the automatic folks should install a manual looking stick between the seats and whenever you move it it kills power for 0.5 seconds. I don't know what I hate more, this suggestion or the fact that it would probably actually work.
  - kampsduac 10y ago
    But if you drive in the mountains, wouldn't gear simulation in a CVT help to save brakes while going downhill?
    - maxerickson 10y ago
      You don't need to jump between ratios to engine brake. You just need a way to get the car to do it.
    - ferongr 10y ago
      So, when you step off the accelerator on a car with an automatic transmission, the ECU has to decide whether it will switch to the tallest ratio to let the car coast and save on gas, or keep the same ratio and engine brake using the intake vacuum. On a traditional automatic, you either use the paddles to keep in the required gear, or on older transmissions use the 3 or 2 position on the column lever. CVTs have no fixed ratios, and do not need to in order to engine brake. My preferred control would be a small column-mounted stick with 2 or 3 positions that would enable automatic engine braking at varying strengths, kinda like the controls for an electric retarder on big trucks or buses.
    - russdill 10y ago
      Seems that light brake pressure could be translated to CVT downshifting. Any disadvantages? Or the cruise control of the car could control CVT.
johnwards 10y ago
Oh I hate CVT. I've got a Land Rover Discovery 3 with a non-CVT auto and it's as smooth as anything changing gear, you just don't notice. Looking at getting an auto for our second smaller car, and CVT is like someone has an elastic band on the gears. Would drive me up the wall. The Citroen box at least comes with paddles which helps. The VW/Audi dual clutch box is the best, you get the economy of CVT and it's so much smoother. Shame they are so much more expensive second hand than CVT autos :(
- ollie87 10y ago
  More expensive and a lot more unreliable too. I know of several people who have large repair bills for DSG boxes.

I love driving a manual, but with the rise of CVT, what's the point?

sliken 10y ago

Amusingly subaru simulates gears with their CVT. By default you get 6 "gears", but in sport you get 8.

ferongr 10y ago
And that's completely missing a point of a CVT where you can keep the engine at a its most efficient speed and vary the transmission ratio to accelerate or decelerate in response to throttle input.
- sliken 10y ago
  Agreed, it's sad that in chasing more market share subaru is making multiple decisions based on marketing and not on engineering. Forcing a CVT from the ideal RPM to entertain drivers seems impressively silly. Kind of like the Golf R, which installed a vibrating/unbalanced motor under the winshield to make a more pleasing vibration. Or the Mustang EcoBoost, various BMWs, and other cars that are using speakers to make more vroom noises to hide the less appealing note of their smaller turbo engines. Maybe the automatic folks should install a manual looking stick between the seats and whenever you move it it kills power for 0.5 seconds.
  - taneq 10y ago
    > Many the automatic folks should install a manual looking stick between the seats and whenever you move it it kills power for 0.5 seconds. I don't know what I hate more, this suggestion or the fact that it would probably actually work.
- kampsduac 10y ago
  But if you drive in the mountains, wouldn't gear simulation in a CVT help to save brakes while going downhill?
  - maxerickson 10y ago
    You don't need to jump between ratios to engine brake. You just need a way to get the car to do it.
  - ferongr 10y ago
    So, when you step off the accelerator on a car with an automatic transmission, the ECU has to decide whether it will switch to the tallest ratio to let the car coast and save on gas, or keep the same ratio and engine brake using the intake vacuum. On a traditional automatic, you either use the paddles to keep in the required gear, or on older transmissions use the 3 or 2 position on the column lever. CVTs have no fixed ratios, and do not need to in order to engine brake. My preferred control would be a small column-mounted stick with 2 or 3 positions that would enable automatic engine braking at varying strengths, kinda like the controls for an electric retarder on big trucks or buses.
  - russdill 10y ago
    Seems that light brake pressure could be translated to CVT downshifting. Any disadvantages? Or the cruise control of the car could control CVT.

johnwards 10y ago

Oh I hate CVT. I've got a Land Rover Discovery 3 with a non-CVT auto and it's as smooth as anything changing gear, you just don't notice. Looking at getting an auto for our second smaller car, and CVT is like someone has an elastic band on the gears. Would drive me up the wall. The Citroen box at least comes with paddles which helps. The VW/Audi dual clutch box is the best, you get the economy of CVT and it's so much smoother. Shame they are so much more expensive second hand than CVT autos :(

ollie87 10y ago
More expensive and a lot more unreliable too. I know of several people who have large repair bills for DSG boxes.