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It exhibits gender disparities very nicely too. https://twitter.com/OdaRygh/status/798872670221856768 https://twitter.com/OdaRygh/status/798872670221856768
by j2kun 10y ago
It exhibits gender disparities very nicely too.
https://twitter.com/OdaRygh/status/798872670221856768 https://twitter.com/OdaRygh/status/798872670221856768
- TeMPOraL 10y agoMakes sense to me. The training data set focuses on generic, gender-neutral shoe examples instead of highly gender-specific ones.
- gugagore 10y agoThere is another take on this issue. That it's not that the shoes are gender-neutral, it's that "male" is neutral. This essay explores that take: http://www.tarshi.net/inplainspeak/marked-women-unmarked-men/ http://www.tarshi.net/inplainspeak/marked-women-unmarked-men...
- mikeash 10y agoI don't think that's true for shoes. The male equivalent to high heels would be dress shoes, and women wearing male dress shoes would be weird and unusual. The examples shown appear to be casual or athletic shoes, which are indeed neutral.
- vacri 10y agoSit in a shopping centre, movie theater lobby, or even just out on the street. Watch the shoes of the women as they stroll by[1], and you'll find very few of the ridiculously high heels that are pictured in that tweet. Claiming that tweet's shoe as the typical women's shoe is laughably erroneously stereotyped. [1] Not just the young fashionistas that specifically dress up, but every woman.
- j2kun 10y agoYou might be able to explain it, but it still shows that it's wrong. (Though I disagree that these shoes are gender neutral; only ~5% of the shoes in my household look like "gender-neutral" shoes, and they're all mine)
- SamBam 10y agoYes, an absolutely classic example of implicit biases in training sets. On the one hand, the network should eventually learn to classify high heels as shoes. On the other, when these classification system actually get used, they're always at some arbitrary point in their training, so you can't just wait for "all the biases to go away."
- vacri 10y agoErm... high heels are not the only kind of shoes women wear. They're not even the most common kind of shoes women wear. Pointing to this as a 'gender disparity experience' is showing your own bias. Yes, high heels are shoes and it should learn to recognise them, but most women don't actually wear them most of the time.
- deleted 10y ago[deleted]
- AWildDHHAppears 10y agoMen wear high heels too, you cis-gendered transphobe.
- pearjuice 10y agoCan we please keep gender identities discussion from Hacker News?
- SamBam 10y agoThe comment was pointing out a specific example about how an AI miscategorized something because of a small sample-size in data, something that has been shown to be often the result of unintended biases in the training set, and you say that we're just talking about "gender identities"?? This is the kind of thing AI researchers write papers on (source: AI MSc), not some SJW topic, yet you saw the word "gender" and assumed it didn't belong?
- josefx 10y agoThere is their problem, they had Al Bundy train the AI. How else do you get from shoe to whale in only three pictures, with one involving food.