14 ms·

A really great short documentary on this subject is Louis Theroux's "Gambling in Las Vegas". His frank manner really cuts to the core of not only the length to

by komon 10y ago

A really great short documentary on this subject is Louis Theroux's "Gambling in Las Vegas". His frank manner really cuts to the core of not only the length to which addicts will justify gambling but also to the lengths to which the casino employees justify their enabling. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uJRYUZbxwyA https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uJRYUZbxwyA

kirykl 10y ago
That's a great documentary. I'd like to see a followup on some of the people he interviewed. Some research online will show that the "Mattress King" had lost his young son shortly before this was filmed
- Smushman 10y ago
  Could you provide a link to this? I googled for "Mattress King" and found stories ie: Reddit; but nothing about his son... thanks.
  - kirykl 10y ago
    Google Allan Erlick
overcast 10y ago
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5EcyUaZQrU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5EcyUaZQrU Better version that doesn't have all kind of broken artifacts. I enjoy hearing the justification of "friendship" between the high roller, and his fixer. Pretty hilarious.
itsmemattchung 10y ago
Thanks for sharing—my family was ripped apart due to my father's unbridled gambling. Although it's conceivable that casinos play their part in motivating people to gamble, much of the addiction is a battle within the individuals.
- tunap 10y ago
  Absolutely an individual choice. Why someone chooses to continue to detriment is an infinte pool of rationalizations. I did it for the entertainment & group inclusion(poker). I justified it as I didn't lose $200, I paid for several(sometimes many) hours of entertainment. Then one time I ran out of time while I was up several hundred. The next time was again time constrained and I walked w/ $700.* The last time I met an old friend I haen't sen in 15 years and we blew our cash on drinks talking about old times. I figure I'll never be this close to even ever again so I haven't played again in 9 years. *I'm still way behind, but figure the odds of recouping more are stacked against me.
  - jfoutz 10y ago
    funny thing about addiction. I agree that in the beginning it's a choice. But i think every event biases the choice a little bit. So, if it's go to the movies or go gambling, the first time around it's a 50/50 split. then next time around it's a 40/60 split, the next time around 20/80 split. Clearly the rate of bias modification curves vary from person to person. That, in and of itself isn't bad, nothing wrong with always picking gambling when you have some free time and money. With addiction, of any kind, it kind of creeps past the point of free time and money. Preferring X over sleep, work, food, whatever other things are important is where it gets pretty rough for people. So anyway, yeah, there's an element of personal choice. When the biases get so strong, it's hard to recognize that a choice is even being made. People don't exactly choose to brush their teeth in the morning, it's just something that happens as part of the morning routine. It's technically a choice, but the bias is so strong, people rarely consider not brushing their teeth. (as a somewhat silly example)
    - tunap 10y ago
      Good thing toothpaste isn't addictive... hope the Crest folk aren't reading this. Very good point, though. I was lucky, I had several positive experiences in a short time period and could rationalize my decision to desist. I have failed repeatedly to mirror that experience with my other addictions, cigs and sex. * * More so than just getting a lot, I was missing work, foregoing important events and losing sleep to engage with any woman who gave me permission. Aging & perpetual lack of funds cured that one for me, although it is always on my mind. I can not credit that to any personal strength. edit:reword last sentences and fix *s
drzaiusapelord 10y ago
Reminds of the strategies freemium devs employ where they do their best to snare "whales" who are players who will causally drop thousands of dollars on various in-game powerups and skins. There was a report a few months ago claiming these players are responsible for 70% of an app's revenue! I imagine its similar for casinos, so they have no real incentive to actually stop addiction as addicts are their revenue generating "whales."
- Bartweiss 10y ago
  Absolutely the case, though casinos don't have quite the same incentives. Freemium devs can't fly in wealthy players and customize their games, for instance. But this absolutely explains a lot of these things. For a while, I wondered why freemium games don't offer an "unlock all" option for $2, or $10, or $100? Turns out, it's because even $100 would be a massive loss compared to what the 'top' players sink into Candy Crush. For that matter, the heaviest-drinking 10% of adults consume more alcohol than the other 90% combined. This whole question has affected my feelings on addiction and vice industries. Its one thing to have an industry that has harmful side effects, or drives some people to failures of willpower. It's another to have an industry that depends on addiction or compulsive use, and it turns out that's almost always the case.
  - jon-wood 10y ago
    > Freemium devs can't fly in wealthy players and customize their games, for instance. I wish I could remember the source but I'm sure I've heard of freemium developers researching their biggest whales and then tailoring high end items to match the colours of their favourite football team.
    - gozur88 10y ago
      They absolutely do stuff like that. There's a freemium game developer that lives in my neighborhood. Something crazy like 50% of their income came from just a handful of people (literally - something like five people). Naturally, the devs made the effort to reach out and figure out why those people were buying things and what the company could do to keep them buying, asking what features they'd like to see and what models they liked.
Demcox 10y ago
It's block in my country. Does anyone have a mirror?
- mojoB 10y ago
  http://eachvideo.com/watch?v=q5EcyUaZQrU http://eachvideo.com/watch?v=q5EcyUaZQrU
Spooky23 10y ago
Just google for HN threads about sports books and daily fantasy sports. They are nearly a continuous eye roll of outraged geeks complaining about how states like NY were an affront to freedom and liberty. Edit: The downvotes are awesome on this topic. Folks love their crack.
schoen 10y ago
Wow, that's amazing for the ways the people interviewed will talk about gambling (especially the different ways that they resist Theroux's efforts to get them to talk about the expected outcome of a gambling session, think about how much money they're losing, or identify a point at which they would stop).

by komon 10y ago

kirykl 10y ago

That's a great documentary. I'd like to see a followup on some of the people he interviewed. Some research online will show that the "Mattress King" had lost his young son shortly before this was filmed

Smushman 10y ago
Could you provide a link to this? I googled for "Mattress King" and found stories ie: Reddit; but nothing about his son... thanks.
- kirykl 10y ago
  Google Allan Erlick

overcast 10y ago

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5EcyUaZQrU https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q5EcyUaZQrU Better version that doesn't have all kind of broken artifacts. I enjoy hearing the justification of "friendship" between the high roller, and his fixer. Pretty hilarious.

itsmemattchung 10y ago

Thanks for sharing—my family was ripped apart due to my father's unbridled gambling. Although it's conceivable that casinos play their part in motivating people to gamble, much of the addiction is a battle within the individuals.

tunap 10y ago
Absolutely an individual choice. Why someone chooses to continue to detriment is an infinte pool of rationalizations. I did it for the entertainment & group inclusion(poker). I justified it as I didn't lose $200, I paid for several(sometimes many) hours of entertainment. Then one time I ran out of time while I was up several hundred. The next time was again time constrained and I walked w/ $700.* The last time I met an old friend I haen't sen in 15 years and we blew our cash on drinks talking about old times. I figure I'll never be this close to even ever again so I haven't played again in 9 years. *I'm still way behind, but figure the odds of recouping more are stacked against me.
- jfoutz 10y ago
  funny thing about addiction. I agree that in the beginning it's a choice. But i think every event biases the choice a little bit. So, if it's go to the movies or go gambling, the first time around it's a 50/50 split. then next time around it's a 40/60 split, the next time around 20/80 split. Clearly the rate of bias modification curves vary from person to person. That, in and of itself isn't bad, nothing wrong with always picking gambling when you have some free time and money. With addiction, of any kind, it kind of creeps past the point of free time and money. Preferring X over sleep, work, food, whatever other things are important is where it gets pretty rough for people. So anyway, yeah, there's an element of personal choice. When the biases get so strong, it's hard to recognize that a choice is even being made. People don't exactly choose to brush their teeth in the morning, it's just something that happens as part of the morning routine. It's technically a choice, but the bias is so strong, people rarely consider not brushing their teeth. (as a somewhat silly example)
  - tunap 10y ago
    Good thing toothpaste isn't addictive... hope the Crest folk aren't reading this. Very good point, though. I was lucky, I had several positive experiences in a short time period and could rationalize my decision to desist. I have failed repeatedly to mirror that experience with my other addictions, cigs and sex. * * More so than just getting a lot, I was missing work, foregoing important events and losing sleep to engage with any woman who gave me permission. Aging & perpetual lack of funds cured that one for me, although it is always on my mind. I can not credit that to any personal strength. edit:reword last sentences and fix *s

drzaiusapelord 10y ago

Reminds of the strategies freemium devs employ where they do their best to snare "whales" who are players who will causally drop thousands of dollars on various in-game powerups and skins. There was a report a few months ago claiming these players are responsible for 70% of an app's revenue! I imagine its similar for casinos, so they have no real incentive to actually stop addiction as addicts are their revenue generating "whales."

Bartweiss 10y ago
Absolutely the case, though casinos don't have quite the same incentives. Freemium devs can't fly in wealthy players and customize their games, for instance. But this absolutely explains a lot of these things. For a while, I wondered why freemium games don't offer an "unlock all" option for $2, or $10, or $100? Turns out, it's because even $100 would be a massive loss compared to what the 'top' players sink into Candy Crush. For that matter, the heaviest-drinking 10% of adults consume more alcohol than the other 90% combined. This whole question has affected my feelings on addiction and vice industries. Its one thing to have an industry that has harmful side effects, or drives some people to failures of willpower. It's another to have an industry that depends on addiction or compulsive use, and it turns out that's almost always the case.
- jon-wood 10y ago
  > Freemium devs can't fly in wealthy players and customize their games, for instance. I wish I could remember the source but I'm sure I've heard of freemium developers researching their biggest whales and then tailoring high end items to match the colours of their favourite football team.
  - gozur88 10y ago
    They absolutely do stuff like that. There's a freemium game developer that lives in my neighborhood. Something crazy like 50% of their income came from just a handful of people (literally - something like five people). Naturally, the devs made the effort to reach out and figure out why those people were buying things and what the company could do to keep them buying, asking what features they'd like to see and what models they liked.

Demcox 10y ago

It's block in my country. Does anyone have a mirror?

mojoB 10y ago
http://eachvideo.com/watch?v=q5EcyUaZQrU http://eachvideo.com/watch?v=q5EcyUaZQrU

Spooky23 10y ago

Just google for HN threads about sports books and daily fantasy sports. They are nearly a continuous eye roll of outraged geeks complaining about how states like NY were an affront to freedom and liberty. Edit: The downvotes are awesome on this topic. Folks love their crack.

schoen 10y ago

Wow, that's amazing for the ways the people interviewed will talk about gambling (especially the different ways that they resist Theroux's efforts to get them to talk about the expected outcome of a gambling session, think about how much money they're losing, or identify a point at which they would stop).