8 ms·

A Black History Museum

21 points by samclemens 10y ago

SamUK96 10y ago
Every time I see something dedicated to POC, I can't help but think how the inverse would sound and how odd people think these days. There should be no reason that "Black X thing" and "White X thing" should be perceived any differently, however, strangely, you'd never see a "White History Museum" anywhere, whereas "Black History Museum" is considered something which "should be". Just a few hours ago I saw an ad for a new BBC documentary: "Black Nurses: The Women Who Saved the NHS", and this, again, really puzzles me. I wonder how people would react to "White Nurses: The History of the NHS" (Since historically, before POC came to britain, nurses would be white). Usually, the "liberal" response I get from my more left-leaning friends is somewhere along the lines of "POC have been mistreated, they can't be racist, they deserve an advantage, they deserve more attention, etc.". I find that a very facinating and disturbing view. One which is becoming more prevalent. Why couldn't the museum be named "African Museum", or "Caribbean Museum", or "Rastafarian Museum", or something a bit less divisive and racial? Like, how can you have a museum about "black people". What does that even mean? A museum about things that "black people" like to do? Isn't that racist in itself? It's all so backwards and hypocritical to me! EDIT: I seem to have stepped on a progressive mine! Don't worry, I won't debate the hive narrative again folks :)
- tehwebguy 10y ago
  It's a museum about the history of black people, not "things that black people like to do" Have you been to a museum?
  - gotthemwmds 10y ago
    This. I was going to say culture instead of history, but right on. If everything you know about black people is from the internet, TV, rap music, and pop culture in general, you are missing a lot of what being black in America is really about, and at how much interesting culture and history there is in black communities.
  - SamUK96 10y ago
    Okay, still doesn't really explain how a "museum about the history of white people" doesn't exist, and is perceived differently.
    - burkaman 10y ago
      Because nobody needs one. In a place where white people were systematically enslaved and excluded from history, one would make sense. In the US, a white history museum would just be a duplicate of a normal history museum.
      - SamUK96 10y ago
        Okay, so what about a "White History Museum" in Africa? Or China? Or Brazil? That is definitely perceived differently, and also it's content would not represent the "normal" history of the parent location.
        burkaman 10y ago
        I think a White History Museum in Africa would be fine, but it would be about the history of white people specifically in Africa, which is not very pleasant. It would be mostly imperialism, slave trade, apartheid, etc. The black history museum is not supposed to represent the "parent country" it's supposed to represent black people in America. A white history museum would do the same.
        wang_li 10y ago
        > I think a White History Museum in Africa would be fine, but it would be about the history of white people specifically in Africa, which is not very pleasant. It would be mostly imperialism, slave trade, apartheid, etc. That seems surprisingly narrow minded and makes me wonder whether you feel that there is a particular narrative that needs to be followed. European/white descended people and organizations have done some pretty amazing stuff in Africa. And continue to do so. One might ask how much time must pass after an event before it is considered history? Given that the Smithsonian African-American includes sections on Barack Obama and Anita Hill, as well as photos and memorabilia relating to sports stars, including LeBron James, it seems that the necessary time must be quite brief. As such I would expect an honest White History Museum in Africa would include the many significant positives.
- burkaman 10y ago
  > There should be no reason that "Black X thing" and "White X thing" should be perceived any differently But they already are. These things aren't created in a vacuum where we pretend racism is already over. It would be nice if we could all forget about race, but doing so would be ignoring all the racism that has and continues to exist. When you make an American history museum, you'll find that basically every important figure is white. Is that just random chance? Is it ok to cover your eyes and say "I'm colorblind, this is just an exhibit about the most important historical figures regardless of race"? I'm sure you're not racist, but you can't ignore the people and institutions that still are, and you can't ignore history. Ignoring a problem doesn't make it go away.
  - SamUK96 10y ago
    But read my reply further. I'm okay and I'm sure most are with an "African Museum", or something like that. That museum would be dominated by POC, just like an "American History Museum" would be dominated by White people. It's not racist. It's history. Also, surely you can see the shortfalls in trying to solve today's racism with treating one race over another, right? Surely?
    - legodt 10y ago
      This opinion is extremely naive and ignorant. White people controlled history through imperialism and colonialism for centuries, and the histories were all written by white people. Of course all the other museums feature white people only, because in the western world white people were the dominant, oppressive class. It is important to preserve these stories and histories that would have otherwise been lost in a white narrative
      - mooseburger 10y ago
        While I agree that these stories and histories are worth preserving, I would rather they were integrated into current historical accounts and current museums, creating more complete picture, rather than the racial segregationist approach this museum represents.
- thro32 10y ago
  I think full name is "Smithsonian National Museum of African American History and Culture" For some reason it excludes Egypt, big part of South America and other African countries ;-)
  - SamUK96 10y ago
    Really? Wow. Well, still, I do see examples of things called "Black X thing", so the point still holds, just not in this case. Talk about a misleading article. HN these days :/
- phil_s_stein 10y ago
  You don't see a White People Museum because, in the US and Europe anyway, that is the default: they are all white people museums unless otherwise stated.
  - SamUK96 10y ago
    Well, yes, because those countries / continents are historically white. Just like an African museum would be "black people", since Africa is historically black. And, okay, to really shut this one down, what would you say to a "White History Museum" in Africa? That's a real exception to your hypothesis!
    - phil_s_stein 10y ago
      There would not be a problem with a "White History Museum" if there was enough of an historical presence of white people in that place to support it. I don't know enough about the history of African countries to know if there is one that meets this criteria. The same could be said for any "non-default" minority "type" anywhere.
      - dajohnson89 10y ago
        >if there was enough of an historical presence of white people in that place to support it. Who has the authority to establish that threshold? Seems quite arbitrary and problematic. White History Museum in South Africa? What about Zambia? DRC? All have a white historical presence, and in places like Zimbabwe, an argument could be made that the culture has suffered a certain persecution (I am not taking a side on this argument here).
- ianai 10y ago
  Actually, the desire is to realize that everyone has prejudicial tendencies. It's a natural part of the human psyche. The desire is for people to know this about themselves and try to catch themselves before mistreating someone based on false prejudice. I.e. don't neglect to put the hot chile on a white persons order because they're white. it's the "because they're white/black/Asian/etc" part that causes issue.
- dvdcxn 10y ago
  Because, at least in the UK and US, white history forms the majority of a countries actual history. Black history museums are interesting because they offer an insight into the achievements of a transplant group in a country where they are a minority. It's not really about their history prior to immigrating. It's about their history after they've gotten into this new country, and the story of their integration. I don't think it has anything to do with race, it's a cultural thing - groups that identified with a common history in a strange land. For example, in the UK, despite being also predominantly white, I'm sure there would be a remit for a polish history museum, or even an irish history musuem.
  - SamUK96 10y ago
    Thing is though, "polish" and "irish" correspond to, clearly, the country's history only. "Black" refers to literally anything about black people, which is a totally different idea.
    - tptacek 10y ago
      They're identical ideas. The Irish-American community is the American community descended from Irish immigrants. The same is true of Polish-Americans, Italian-Americans, and German-Americans, all of whom have (a) museums, (b) pride parades, and (c) actual communities in most major US cities. You seem not to be aware that these things exist. They very much do. African-American museums celebrate the community of Americans descended, primarily, from people brought here as slaves from Africa. They have an immense shared culture and heritage, stemming in large part from the way the law of this country segregated them until just a few decades ago, and thus have a cultural identity here more coherent than those of (say) Irish-Americans (who do indeed have a museum, and most of whom couldn't name 3 cities in Ireland or tell you what Gaelic is).
      - pnathan 10y ago
        To strengthen your remark, there's a Nordic Heritage Museum in Seattle - a lot of Scandinavians settled here years ago. There is also an Asian American museum. Unsure about other <x>-American museums.
- spenuke 10y ago
  > Usually, the "liberal" response I get from my more left-leaning friends is somewhere along the lines of "POC have been mistreated, they can't be racist... You should have asked your friends why a black person can't be racist, because to most white people it's an absurd proposition. So allow me to explain a bit here. Racism, unlike what we mostly think, is not a state of mind or an emotion. Racism is a sociological system that transcends the intentions of any one individual. In case US history is not forefront in anyone's mind: 150 years ago, a black person had the same legal status as a pig; 100 years ago, it was illegal for a white person to marry a black person; 60 years ago, it was illegal for a black person to drink at a water fountain. Today, the likelihood that you'll be shot by a cop if you're black is astronomically higher than if you're white. If you have a black sounding name, you're less likely to have a company respond to your job application. These things are institutional. When we say a black person can't be racist -- we don't mean they can't be prejudiced. They can, just like all people. But the privileges and paved roads that a white person enjoys simply aren't there by default for a POC, so they can't benefit from institutional racism. TL;DR - false equivalency. "Black X Thing" is in the context of a historically disenfranchised people overcoming an entire country hellbent on keeping them disenfranchised. "White X Thing" is ridiculous because it's redundant: "Thing" is already White by default.
  - SamUK96 10y ago
    > Racism is a sociological system that transcends the intentions of any one individual I think that's a rather ambitious definition of racism. Racism is the discrimination of some person/group due to their race. You are either denying that being white is a race (Caucasian more specifically), or you are denying the global definition of the word. Both are wrong. Anyway, onto your pseudo-fact opinions, since these are always sad to see purported as facts on HN: > Today, the likelihood that you'll be shot by a cop if you're black is astronomically higher than if you're white. ...Because black crime is 4x greater, not from any mass cop bias. False correlation. Also, "astronomical" is a totally inappropriate exaggeration. Please, look at statistics before hurling words at screens. > so they can't benefit from institutional racism. But, that is not even "racism". That is an expansion of the term that is not the term itself. It's irrelevant. Also, have you seen US University GPA requirements? I think you'll find that it favors POC more than anybody, and makes it hardest for Asians, then whites. So. That's not universally correct right off the bat. > "Thing" is already White by default. Another exaggeration. Regardless, I definitely do disagree with your general opinion that negative past events towards POC should mean they are treated specially now. Like in another comment, don't you think that trying to "revenge" on historical racism by being racist again with opposite races, is a little, well, stupid? You can already see that it doesn't work by how dissatisfied white people are with this mindset.
- mooseburger 10y ago
  I think it's bizarre how "People of Color" became an accepted PC term. Prior to that I thought it was a racist relic from the 50s. It's weird how they think the world can be grouped into white people and everyone else. Do Chinese, Nigerians, and Bolivians have so much in common they should be grouped into one category, other than "human" that is?
  - SolaceQuantum 10y ago
    I'm Chinese with a close mentor of a Nigerian American. We absolutely have related issues with regards to being treated differently because we are not white. We have things we both relate to in ways our mutual white friends can't really follow.
    - mooseburger 10y ago
      Is this in the US? I'm Puerto Rican, but I did research for a summer in Houston, TX, and encountered no racism directed towards me.
      - SolaceQuantum 10y ago
        This is in the US.
- mimimimi 10y ago
  Pretty much everything celebrates white america. You don't name it so because it is already implied. Unfortunately you are so insecure that when a bunch of historically opressed people try to make room for themselves you feel like you are the one being opressed. Highly ironic.
  - SamUK96 10y ago
    Oh, no, I don't feel oppressed. I am pointing out the ironic nature of a museum, and a general culture, that has the mindset of trying to "account" for past racism with treating one race differently to another, far since the effects of the past have dwindled to nothing but natural human impulses.
    - burkaman 10y ago
      I think this is maybe the core of your argument, that racism and its effects are no longer noticeable, so this kind of thing isn't necessary. I would encourage you to look up the many studies of how simply having a black sounding name can affect job prospects and other things, and ask some black people if they've ever been affected by discrimination.
      - SamUK96 10y ago
        a) there hasn't been many studies. Many headlines about few studies which makes you think there are lots however... b) If you read past the headlines into the correlation and probability theory of each study, you'll find that the reason why there is the difference is because of education and lower ambitions and goals of black people. You could say there is no real racism, only perceived racism, which then mentally affects the perceiever, and dissaudes them from getting better qualifications and therefore worse job prospects. That is not in itself racism. That is a false perception of reality ends up affecting reality later on. I think it's called the self-fulfillment fallacy.
        wang_li 10y ago
        > a) there hasn't been many studies. Many headlines about few studies which makes you think there are lots however... The social sciences suffer massive publication bias. Results ranging from failure of the study to support the hypothesis to the gathered data having being politically incorrect lead to research being abandoned.
- GFK_of_xmaspast 10y ago
  This is an exceptionally tired and stale argument. (In the same vein as "why isn't there a White History Month" and "why isn't there a White Entertainment Channel").
  - jbmorgado 10y ago
    It's also exceptionally not explained, since after a total lack or real arguments and coherence it always resorts to name calling to the ones asking these questions.
    - SamUK96 10y ago
      the main drive of the OC was observation, not argument preposition, but I guess you missed that.
  - SamUK96 10y ago
    Call every argument you don't agree with tired and stale? Am I allowed to say that in itself is an overused technique of shutting down debate? Ironic-ness intensifies.
- dang 10y ago
  > EDIT: I seem to have stepped on a progressive mine! Don't worry, I won't debate the hive narrative again folks :) First, name-calling potshots like this don't belong in HN comments; you should be editing them out, not in. The topic is inflammatory enough without getting meta-snarky. Second, you've broken the HN guideline that asks you not to start flamewars (https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html). There are interesting things—in HN's sense—that could have been discussed about this article; by posting the most predictable of all responses ("I can't help but think how the inverse would sound"), you created the most predictable of all flamewars. Then you kept it going by posting way too many comments. Flamewars should be starved, not fuelled. I don't at all think you were ill-intentioned, but doing these things lowers the quality of discussion and makes HN the sort of place we're hoping to avoid becoming, so please don't do them here.
gotthemwmds 10y ago
On a related note, if you're ever in Seattle and enjoy these types of things, the Northwest African American Museum (naamnw.org) is worth checking out, and it's right next to the just-renovated Jimi Hendrix Park, since he grew up in the general area it's located in. Judkins Park across the street (23rd Ave), or walking east towards the pedestrian/bike path along the I-90 floating bridge (Sam Smith Park), are also worth checking out! Especially biking across the bridge over Lake WA.

21 points by samclemens 10y ago

Every time I see something dedicated to POC, I can't help but think how the inverse would sound and how odd people think these days. There should be no reason that "Black X thing" and "White X thing" should be perceived any differently, however, strangely, you'd never see a "White History Museum" anywhere, whereas "Black History Museum" is considered something which "should be". Just a few hours ago I saw an ad for a new BBC documentary: "Black Nurses: The Women Who Saved the NHS", and this, again, really puzzles me. I wonder how people would react to "White Nurses: The History of the NHS" (Since historically, before POC came to britain, nurses would be white). Usually, the "liberal" response I get from my more left-leaning friends is somewhere along the lines of "POC have been mistreated, they can't be racist, they deserve an advantage, they deserve more attention, etc.". I find that a very facinating and disturbing view. One which is becoming more prevalent. Why couldn't the museum be named "African Museum", or "Caribbean Museum", or "Rastafarian Museum", or something a bit less divisive and racial? Like, how can you have a museum about "black people". What does that even mean? A museum about things that "black people" like to do? Isn't that racist in itself? It's all so backwards and hypocritical to me! EDIT: I seem to have stepped on a progressive mine! Don't worry, I won't debate the hive narrative again folks :)

tehwebguy 10y ago
It's a museum about the history of black people, not "things that black people like to do" Have you been to a museum?
- gotthemwmds 10y ago
  This. I was going to say culture instead of history, but right on. If everything you know about black people is from the internet, TV, rap music, and pop culture in general, you are missing a lot of what being black in America is really about, and at how much interesting culture and history there is in black communities.
- SamUK96 10y ago
  Okay, still doesn't really explain how a "museum about the history of white people" doesn't exist, and is perceived differently.
  - burkaman 10y ago
    Because nobody needs one. In a place where white people were systematically enslaved and excluded from history, one would make sense. In the US, a white history museum would just be a duplicate of a normal history museum.
    - SamUK96 10y ago
      Okay, so what about a "White History Museum" in Africa? Or China? Or Brazil? That is definitely perceived differently, and also it's content would not represent the "normal" history of the parent location.
      - burkaman 10y ago
        I think a White History Museum in Africa would be fine, but it would be about the history of white people specifically in Africa, which is not very pleasant. It would be mostly imperialism, slave trade, apartheid, etc. The black history museum is not supposed to represent the "parent country" it's supposed to represent black people in America. A white history museum would do the same.
        wang_li 10y ago
        > I think a White History Museum in Africa would be fine, but it would be about the history of white people specifically in Africa, which is not very pleasant. It would be mostly imperialism, slave trade, apartheid, etc. That seems surprisingly narrow minded and makes me wonder whether you feel that there is a particular narrative that needs to be followed. European/white descended people and organizations have done some pretty amazing stuff in Africa. And continue to do so. One might ask how much time must pass after an event before it is considered history? Given that the Smithsonian African-American includes sections on Barack Obama and Anita Hill, as well as photos and memorabilia relating to sports stars, including LeBron James, it seems that the necessary time must be quite brief. As such I would expect an honest White History Museum in Africa would include the many significant positives.
burkaman 10y ago
> There should be no reason that "Black X thing" and "White X thing" should be perceived any differently But they already are. These things aren't created in a vacuum where we pretend racism is already over. It would be nice if we could all forget about race, but doing so would be ignoring all the racism that has and continues to exist. When you make an American history museum, you'll find that basically every important figure is white. Is that just random chance? Is it ok to cover your eyes and say "I'm colorblind, this is just an exhibit about the most important historical figures regardless of race"? I'm sure you're not racist, but you can't ignore the people and institutions that still are, and you can't ignore history. Ignoring a problem doesn't make it go away.
- SamUK96 10y ago
  But read my reply further. I'm okay and I'm sure most are with an "African Museum", or something like that. That museum would be dominated by POC, just like an "American History Museum" would be dominated by White people. It's not racist. It's history. Also, surely you can see the shortfalls in trying to solve today's racism with treating one race over another, right? Surely?
  - legodt 10y ago
    This opinion is extremely naive and ignorant. White people controlled history through imperialism and colonialism for centuries, and the histories were all written by white people. Of course all the other museums feature white people only, because in the western world white people were the dominant, oppressive class. It is important to preserve these stories and histories that would have otherwise been lost in a white narrative
    - mooseburger 10y ago
      While I agree that these stories and histories are worth preserving, I would rather they were integrated into current historical accounts and current museums, creating more complete picture, rather than the racial segregationist approach this museum represents.
thro32 10y ago
I think full name is "Smithsonian National Museum of African American History and Culture" For some reason it excludes Egypt, big part of South America and other African countries ;-)
- SamUK96 10y ago
  Really? Wow. Well, still, I do see examples of things called "Black X thing", so the point still holds, just not in this case. Talk about a misleading article. HN these days :/
phil_s_stein 10y ago
You don't see a White People Museum because, in the US and Europe anyway, that is the default: they are all white people museums unless otherwise stated.
- SamUK96 10y ago
  Well, yes, because those countries / continents are historically white. Just like an African museum would be "black people", since Africa is historically black. And, okay, to really shut this one down, what would you say to a "White History Museum" in Africa? That's a real exception to your hypothesis!
  - phil_s_stein 10y ago
    There would not be a problem with a "White History Museum" if there was enough of an historical presence of white people in that place to support it. I don't know enough about the history of African countries to know if there is one that meets this criteria. The same could be said for any "non-default" minority "type" anywhere.
    - dajohnson89 10y ago
      >if there was enough of an historical presence of white people in that place to support it. Who has the authority to establish that threshold? Seems quite arbitrary and problematic. White History Museum in South Africa? What about Zambia? DRC? All have a white historical presence, and in places like Zimbabwe, an argument could be made that the culture has suffered a certain persecution (I am not taking a side on this argument here).
ianai 10y ago
Actually, the desire is to realize that everyone has prejudicial tendencies. It's a natural part of the human psyche. The desire is for people to know this about themselves and try to catch themselves before mistreating someone based on false prejudice. I.e. don't neglect to put the hot chile on a white persons order because they're white. it's the "because they're white/black/Asian/etc" part that causes issue.
dvdcxn 10y ago
Because, at least in the UK and US, white history forms the majority of a countries actual history. Black history museums are interesting because they offer an insight into the achievements of a transplant group in a country where they are a minority. It's not really about their history prior to immigrating. It's about their history after they've gotten into this new country, and the story of their integration. I don't think it has anything to do with race, it's a cultural thing - groups that identified with a common history in a strange land. For example, in the UK, despite being also predominantly white, I'm sure there would be a remit for a polish history museum, or even an irish history musuem.
- SamUK96 10y ago
  Thing is though, "polish" and "irish" correspond to, clearly, the country's history only. "Black" refers to literally anything about black people, which is a totally different idea.
  - tptacek 10y ago
    They're identical ideas. The Irish-American community is the American community descended from Irish immigrants. The same is true of Polish-Americans, Italian-Americans, and German-Americans, all of whom have (a) museums, (b) pride parades, and (c) actual communities in most major US cities. You seem not to be aware that these things exist. They very much do. African-American museums celebrate the community of Americans descended, primarily, from people brought here as slaves from Africa. They have an immense shared culture and heritage, stemming in large part from the way the law of this country segregated them until just a few decades ago, and thus have a cultural identity here more coherent than those of (say) Irish-Americans (who do indeed have a museum, and most of whom couldn't name 3 cities in Ireland or tell you what Gaelic is).
    - pnathan 10y ago
      To strengthen your remark, there's a Nordic Heritage Museum in Seattle - a lot of Scandinavians settled here years ago. There is also an Asian American museum. Unsure about other <x>-American museums.
spenuke 10y ago
> Usually, the "liberal" response I get from my more left-leaning friends is somewhere along the lines of "POC have been mistreated, they can't be racist... You should have asked your friends why a black person can't be racist, because to most white people it's an absurd proposition. So allow me to explain a bit here. Racism, unlike what we mostly think, is not a state of mind or an emotion. Racism is a sociological system that transcends the intentions of any one individual. In case US history is not forefront in anyone's mind: 150 years ago, a black person had the same legal status as a pig; 100 years ago, it was illegal for a white person to marry a black person; 60 years ago, it was illegal for a black person to drink at a water fountain. Today, the likelihood that you'll be shot by a cop if you're black is astronomically higher than if you're white. If you have a black sounding name, you're less likely to have a company respond to your job application. These things are institutional. When we say a black person can't be racist -- we don't mean they can't be prejudiced. They can, just like all people. But the privileges and paved roads that a white person enjoys simply aren't there by default for a POC, so they can't benefit from institutional racism. TL;DR - false equivalency. "Black X Thing" is in the context of a historically disenfranchised people overcoming an entire country hellbent on keeping them disenfranchised. "White X Thing" is ridiculous because it's redundant: "Thing" is already White by default.
- SamUK96 10y ago
  > Racism is a sociological system that transcends the intentions of any one individual I think that's a rather ambitious definition of racism. Racism is the discrimination of some person/group due to their race. You are either denying that being white is a race (Caucasian more specifically), or you are denying the global definition of the word. Both are wrong. Anyway, onto your pseudo-fact opinions, since these are always sad to see purported as facts on HN: > Today, the likelihood that you'll be shot by a cop if you're black is astronomically higher than if you're white. ...Because black crime is 4x greater, not from any mass cop bias. False correlation. Also, "astronomical" is a totally inappropriate exaggeration. Please, look at statistics before hurling words at screens. > so they can't benefit from institutional racism. But, that is not even "racism". That is an expansion of the term that is not the term itself. It's irrelevant. Also, have you seen US University GPA requirements? I think you'll find that it favors POC more than anybody, and makes it hardest for Asians, then whites. So. That's not universally correct right off the bat. > "Thing" is already White by default. Another exaggeration. Regardless, I definitely do disagree with your general opinion that negative past events towards POC should mean they are treated specially now. Like in another comment, don't you think that trying to "revenge" on historical racism by being racist again with opposite races, is a little, well, stupid? You can already see that it doesn't work by how dissatisfied white people are with this mindset.
mooseburger 10y ago
I think it's bizarre how "People of Color" became an accepted PC term. Prior to that I thought it was a racist relic from the 50s. It's weird how they think the world can be grouped into white people and everyone else. Do Chinese, Nigerians, and Bolivians have so much in common they should be grouped into one category, other than "human" that is?
- SolaceQuantum 10y ago
  I'm Chinese with a close mentor of a Nigerian American. We absolutely have related issues with regards to being treated differently because we are not white. We have things we both relate to in ways our mutual white friends can't really follow.
  - mooseburger 10y ago
    Is this in the US? I'm Puerto Rican, but I did research for a summer in Houston, TX, and encountered no racism directed towards me.
    - SolaceQuantum 10y ago
      This is in the US.
mimimimi 10y ago
Pretty much everything celebrates white america. You don't name it so because it is already implied. Unfortunately you are so insecure that when a bunch of historically opressed people try to make room for themselves you feel like you are the one being opressed. Highly ironic.
- SamUK96 10y ago
  Oh, no, I don't feel oppressed. I am pointing out the ironic nature of a museum, and a general culture, that has the mindset of trying to "account" for past racism with treating one race differently to another, far since the effects of the past have dwindled to nothing but natural human impulses.
  - burkaman 10y ago
    I think this is maybe the core of your argument, that racism and its effects are no longer noticeable, so this kind of thing isn't necessary. I would encourage you to look up the many studies of how simply having a black sounding name can affect job prospects and other things, and ask some black people if they've ever been affected by discrimination.
    - SamUK96 10y ago
      a) there hasn't been many studies. Many headlines about few studies which makes you think there are lots however... b) If you read past the headlines into the correlation and probability theory of each study, you'll find that the reason why there is the difference is because of education and lower ambitions and goals of black people. You could say there is no real racism, only perceived racism, which then mentally affects the perceiever, and dissaudes them from getting better qualifications and therefore worse job prospects. That is not in itself racism. That is a false perception of reality ends up affecting reality later on. I think it's called the self-fulfillment fallacy.
      - wang_li 10y ago
        > a) there hasn't been many studies. Many headlines about few studies which makes you think there are lots however... The social sciences suffer massive publication bias. Results ranging from failure of the study to support the hypothesis to the gathered data having being politically incorrect lead to research being abandoned.
GFK_of_xmaspast 10y ago
This is an exceptionally tired and stale argument. (In the same vein as "why isn't there a White History Month" and "why isn't there a White Entertainment Channel").
- jbmorgado 10y ago
  It's also exceptionally not explained, since after a total lack or real arguments and coherence it always resorts to name calling to the ones asking these questions.
  - SamUK96 10y ago
    the main drive of the OC was observation, not argument preposition, but I guess you missed that.
- SamUK96 10y ago
  Call every argument you don't agree with tired and stale? Am I allowed to say that in itself is an overused technique of shutting down debate? Ironic-ness intensifies.
dang 10y ago
> EDIT: I seem to have stepped on a progressive mine! Don't worry, I won't debate the hive narrative again folks :) First, name-calling potshots like this don't belong in HN comments; you should be editing them out, not in. The topic is inflammatory enough without getting meta-snarky. Second, you've broken the HN guideline that asks you not to start flamewars (https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html). There are interesting things—in HN's sense—that could have been discussed about this article; by posting the most predictable of all responses ("I can't help but think how the inverse would sound"), you created the most predictable of all flamewars. Then you kept it going by posting way too many comments. Flamewars should be starved, not fuelled. I don't at all think you were ill-intentioned, but doing these things lowers the quality of discussion and makes HN the sort of place we're hoping to avoid becoming, so please don't do them here.

gotthemwmds 10y ago

On a related note, if you're ever in Seattle and enjoy these types of things, the Northwest African American Museum (naamnw.org) is worth checking out, and it's right next to the just-renovated Jimi Hendrix Park, since he grew up in the general area it's located in. Judkins Park across the street (23rd Ave), or walking east towards the pedestrian/bike path along the I-90 floating bridge (Sam Smith Park), are also worth checking out! Especially biking across the bridge over Lake WA.