3 ms·

I didn't say that you are wrong. I didn't say "that everyone with experience agrees with [me]". I specifically used the words "mostly favored by" twice. Mostly

I didn't say that you are wrong. I didn't say "that everyone with experience agrees with [me]". I specifically used the words "mostly favored by" twice. Mostly does not mean "everyone". It's fine if you want to use different words. But you either have words for the different types or not. And if you have separate words, you either use the five existing ones or try to push five new ones. I think it's significant that you objected to my claim about the popular taxonomy without suggesting five alternative terms with even a fraction of the adoption. (I've built an entire career partly on popularizing this stuff and I've never even encountered a competing set of terms!)

dpark 10y ago
My comment at the bottom was pointing out that you basically called people who don't agree with you amateurs. Yes, you qualified it with "most" but the sentiment remains. This sort of response is especially unhelpful when the "amateurs" being dismissed are not laypeople but professionals in the same field. It's like a group of heart surgeons asserting that arteries are very specifically the blood vessels that carry blood from the heart to the lungs and then calling general practitioners inexperienced for not getting on board with the retroactive redefinition. I also don't believe it's reasonable to assert that I have to provide new terminology in order to point out that this definition is fundamentally problematic and does not match the common usage. But if you want a word, call it a preset (because all the interactions are defined in advance) or a mine field (because if you step in the wrong place, it blows up your test, and because your grandkids will still be dealing with the mess).
- gary_bernhardt 10y ago
  It's possible to be a world-class programmer and think that test doubles are a silly waste of time. Many of the programmers whom I admire most think that. Nothing that I said precludes it. I now regret writing my monthly comment on the web.
  - dpark 10y ago
    I overreacted to a phrasing issue and it drowned out the rest of the discussion. That's my fault, and I'm sorry, because you legitimately tried to engage in discussion and I was rude. I appreciate your insight here and while I don't agree with the definition being asserted for "mock", I understand the desire for more fine-grained terminology. I hope your next monthly comment isn't wasted on someone who overreacts to one tiny piece like I did.
    - deleted 10y ago
      [deleted]

dpark 10y ago

My comment at the bottom was pointing out that you basically called people who don't agree with you amateurs. Yes, you qualified it with "most" but the sentiment remains. This sort of response is especially unhelpful when the "amateurs" being dismissed are not laypeople but professionals in the same field. It's like a group of heart surgeons asserting that arteries are very specifically the blood vessels that carry blood from the heart to the lungs and then calling general practitioners inexperienced for not getting on board with the retroactive redefinition. I also don't believe it's reasonable to assert that I have to provide new terminology in order to point out that this definition is fundamentally problematic and does not match the common usage. But if you want a word, call it a preset (because all the interactions are defined in advance) or a mine field (because if you step in the wrong place, it blows up your test, and because your grandkids will still be dealing with the mess).

gary_bernhardt 10y ago
It's possible to be a world-class programmer and think that test doubles are a silly waste of time. Many of the programmers whom I admire most think that. Nothing that I said precludes it. I now regret writing my monthly comment on the web.
- dpark 10y ago
  I overreacted to a phrasing issue and it drowned out the rest of the discussion. That's my fault, and I'm sorry, because you legitimately tried to engage in discussion and I was rude. I appreciate your insight here and while I don't agree with the definition being asserted for "mock", I understand the desire for more fine-grained terminology. I hope your next monthly comment isn't wasted on someone who overreacts to one tiny piece like I did.
  - deleted 10y ago
    [deleted]