6 ms·

That might be true, but your Indian colleagues are probably well off with much of their transactions happening in plastic/electronic anyways, so this will have

by rwbt 10y ago

That might be true, but your Indian colleagues are probably well off with much of their transactions happening in plastic/electronic anyways, so this will have very little effect on their day to day lives. Since much of the Indian economy is cash based, there is a lot of frustration in the working class and there is a serious cash (as in bank notes) crunch.

nitinreddy88 10y ago
I do accept this fact. Is there better option? I am quite sure this decision was taken after discussing with lot of people who might have done PhDs in Economics and serving for Govt.
- meira 10y ago
  Not necessarily. It is never a good premise to expect good faith from politicians.
- rwbt 10y ago
  I don't know if there is a better option but the GoI definitely didn't think this throughly. Countries that demonetized in the past did this over a span of a time to prevent panic and fear. If the Govt set a deadline instead of abolishing them overnight that would go a lot smoother. Sure, that'll give 'some' tax evaders time to plan their 'exit' smoothly but it'll make lives of millions so much easier. Most likely, the evaders use that money to buy gold, so the Govt can temporarily track all gold purchases (they do it anyways for puchases over 2 lakh rupees). Even if they end up spending the cash on inflated real estate, they're in someways helping the economy instead of hoarding the cash and will end up in someone's bank account eventually. Also, all the big tax evaders rarely hoard cash. They usually have offshore accounts and sophisticated corporate structures. Secondly, the new notes being minted have no additional security features. The RBI confirmed that the new 500 and 2000 bank notes carry the same security features as the previous ones, which probably makes it similarly easy to counterfeit. The RBI previously claimed that it would take 5-6 years to design notes with new security features and I think they should've waited until they have better bank notes to curb fake notes.
- wav-part 10y ago
  > I am quite sure this decision was taken after discussing with lot of people who might have done PhDs in Economics and serving for Govt. I have no hope for this country to find such views on HN of all places. EDIT: I acknowledge this is low content comment. So I quote "the first job of an economist is to tell governments what they cannot do". Please sit back and give this a fair read [1]. [1] https://mises.org/about-mises/what-austrian-economics https://mises.org/about-mises/what-austrian-economics
- kamaal 10y ago
  >>I do accept this fact. Is there better option? Which fact do you not accept? Do you believe every person in India has a bank account? Every person has credit cards? Debit cards? Do you believe purchasing chain from production to end consumers has infrastructure for electronic transactions? Or that there is a way to make the economy run when close to 80% of the money is taken out of circulation? >>I am quite sure this decision was taken after discussing with lot of people who might have done PhDs in Economics and serving for Govt. That doesn't mean much when the results on the ground say the opposite.
  - swatkat 10y ago
    Well, due to Prime Minister's Jan Dhan Yojana scheme, a lot more people have bank accounts and debit cards now. Over 220 million bank accounts were opened since 2014. People who have those accounts can actually make use of them now.
    - kamaal 10y ago
      A lot more != All, let alone that. A lot more != Everybody-in-the-purchase-chain. Now it was a known fact that 80% of the currency will go out of rotation. Now regardless of whether you have an account, 80% of the money people use to trade is gone! Doesn't help if you have a account either. You don't have money to buy stuff. Your point is if(and that is a big 'if' given 80% is gone!) you have money you could deposit it. Not spend it.
      - swatkat 10y ago
        Well, I didn't actually say 'lot more == all'. I was just mentioning that PMJDY bank accounts and debit cards would ease things a bit for the people who have them, compared to the days when they had no bank accounts whatsoever (remember, PMJDY bank accounts are specially tailored for people with low income and/or unstructured income). Anyway, you don't need a bank account to exchange demonetized currency notes.
        kamaal 10y ago
- sufiyan 10y ago
  Nope. This decision seems to have happened at the whim of 3 people - the PM, the finance minister, the RBI governor. Clearly they didn't even proof read the notes. The back side of the 2k rupee notes is a mess. They screwed up the spelling of 2 in Hindi and 1000 in Urdu making it Bazaar from Hazaar
  - kranner 10y ago
    I can read Urdu and from what I can make out in images of the note, the Urdu text is fine. The font could have been better. The orthographic sign that makes the H in 'hazaar' is correct; the 'be' nuqta is a different shape. There should have been a hair-width's space after the 'dal' in 'do', but it is easily readable as 'dal' and not 'lam' as some people are claiming.
    - sufiyan 10y ago
      Yes. So, can I read Urdu and the hey looks like a bey. ب has the dot below it which you can clearly see in all images. ح doesn't have any dots beneath it.
      - kranner 10y ago
        Hazaar is spelt with a choti he which does have that inverted comma under it (clearly distinguishable from a nuqta by the elongated head shape, as it is on the note (but it is tiny because the font size is tiny)). Here's an example of hazaar with the spelling I mean: https://lh3.ggpht.com/FXu7LY_Ki5uDcYTcOWwMSxAL0lC9ttGLbNZrrTUtD_qjzSZeMcNcP6gn2VMlpKNx9N0=w300 https://lh3.ggpht.com/FXu7LY_Ki5uDcYTcOWwMSxAL0lC9ttGLbNZrrT...
  - susam 10y ago
    "Two" appears as "दो" (do) in Hindi in the 2000 INR notes. This looks correct to me: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:2000_INR_Rev_2016.jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:2000_INR_Rev_2016.jpg (see the left edge of the note just below the string "2016"). If you are talking about "दोन" (don) appearing twice within the pink rectangular box, that's Konkani and Marathi, not Hindi. Two is indeed written as "दोन" (don) in Konkani and Marathi.

by rwbt 10y ago

nitinreddy88 10y ago

I do accept this fact. Is there better option? I am quite sure this decision was taken after discussing with lot of people who might have done PhDs in Economics and serving for Govt.

meira 10y ago
Not necessarily. It is never a good premise to expect good faith from politicians.
rwbt 10y ago
I don't know if there is a better option but the GoI definitely didn't think this throughly. Countries that demonetized in the past did this over a span of a time to prevent panic and fear. If the Govt set a deadline instead of abolishing them overnight that would go a lot smoother. Sure, that'll give 'some' tax evaders time to plan their 'exit' smoothly but it'll make lives of millions so much easier. Most likely, the evaders use that money to buy gold, so the Govt can temporarily track all gold purchases (they do it anyways for puchases over 2 lakh rupees). Even if they end up spending the cash on inflated real estate, they're in someways helping the economy instead of hoarding the cash and will end up in someone's bank account eventually. Also, all the big tax evaders rarely hoard cash. They usually have offshore accounts and sophisticated corporate structures. Secondly, the new notes being minted have no additional security features. The RBI confirmed that the new 500 and 2000 bank notes carry the same security features as the previous ones, which probably makes it similarly easy to counterfeit. The RBI previously claimed that it would take 5-6 years to design notes with new security features and I think they should've waited until they have better bank notes to curb fake notes.
wav-part 10y ago
> I am quite sure this decision was taken after discussing with lot of people who might have done PhDs in Economics and serving for Govt. I have no hope for this country to find such views on HN of all places. EDIT: I acknowledge this is low content comment. So I quote "the first job of an economist is to tell governments what they cannot do". Please sit back and give this a fair read [1]. [1] https://mises.org/about-mises/what-austrian-economics https://mises.org/about-mises/what-austrian-economics
kamaal 10y ago
>>I do accept this fact. Is there better option? Which fact do you not accept? Do you believe every person in India has a bank account? Every person has credit cards? Debit cards? Do you believe purchasing chain from production to end consumers has infrastructure for electronic transactions? Or that there is a way to make the economy run when close to 80% of the money is taken out of circulation? >>I am quite sure this decision was taken after discussing with lot of people who might have done PhDs in Economics and serving for Govt. That doesn't mean much when the results on the ground say the opposite.
- swatkat 10y ago
  Well, due to Prime Minister's Jan Dhan Yojana scheme, a lot more people have bank accounts and debit cards now. Over 220 million bank accounts were opened since 2014. People who have those accounts can actually make use of them now.
  - kamaal 10y ago
    A lot more != All, let alone that. A lot more != Everybody-in-the-purchase-chain. Now it was a known fact that 80% of the currency will go out of rotation. Now regardless of whether you have an account, 80% of the money people use to trade is gone! Doesn't help if you have a account either. You don't have money to buy stuff. Your point is if(and that is a big 'if' given 80% is gone!) you have money you could deposit it. Not spend it.
    - swatkat 10y ago
      Well, I didn't actually say 'lot more == all'. I was just mentioning that PMJDY bank accounts and debit cards would ease things a bit for the people who have them, compared to the days when they had no bank accounts whatsoever (remember, PMJDY bank accounts are specially tailored for people with low income and/or unstructured income). Anyway, you don't need a bank account to exchange demonetized currency notes.
      - kamaal 10y ago
sufiyan 10y ago
Nope. This decision seems to have happened at the whim of 3 people - the PM, the finance minister, the RBI governor. Clearly they didn't even proof read the notes. The back side of the 2k rupee notes is a mess. They screwed up the spelling of 2 in Hindi and 1000 in Urdu making it Bazaar from Hazaar
- kranner 10y ago
  I can read Urdu and from what I can make out in images of the note, the Urdu text is fine. The font could have been better. The orthographic sign that makes the H in 'hazaar' is correct; the 'be' nuqta is a different shape. There should have been a hair-width's space after the 'dal' in 'do', but it is easily readable as 'dal' and not 'lam' as some people are claiming.
  - sufiyan 10y ago
    Yes. So, can I read Urdu and the hey looks like a bey. ب has the dot below it which you can clearly see in all images. ح doesn't have any dots beneath it.
    - kranner 10y ago
      Hazaar is spelt with a choti he which does have that inverted comma under it (clearly distinguishable from a nuqta by the elongated head shape, as it is on the note (but it is tiny because the font size is tiny)). Here's an example of hazaar with the spelling I mean: https://lh3.ggpht.com/FXu7LY_Ki5uDcYTcOWwMSxAL0lC9ttGLbNZrrTUtD_qjzSZeMcNcP6gn2VMlpKNx9N0=w300 https://lh3.ggpht.com/FXu7LY_Ki5uDcYTcOWwMSxAL0lC9ttGLbNZrrT...
- susam 10y ago
  "Two" appears as "दो" (do) in Hindi in the 2000 INR notes. This looks correct to me: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:2000_INR_Rev_2016.jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:2000_INR_Rev_2016.jpg (see the left edge of the note just below the string "2016"). If you are talking about "दोन" (don) appearing twice within the pink rectangular box, that's Konkani and Marathi, not Hindi. Two is indeed written as "दोन" (don) in Konkani and Marathi.