6 ms·

I like the idea but it is obviously biased with "promises "such as >"If I become president, we're all going to be saying 'Merry Christmas' again."

by thecopy 10y ago

wccrawford 10y ago
I can't imagine someone making this site without some bias. But that doesn't change the fact that he did promise these things. I think some of his ideas are good, some are disastrous, and some are crazy. But it'll be interesting to see which get fulfilled and which don't. For the record, some people already say "Merry Christmas", so I'm assuming he thinks we can somehow talk retail stores into offending their customers again, which I seriously doubt will happen.
- Mikeb85 10y ago
  > so I'm assuming he thinks we can somehow talk retail stores into offending their customers again How is it offensive? If a Muslim were to wish me a happy Ramadan I'd be cool with it, or if someone of Chinese descent wishes me a happy New Year on their New Year's date, that's ok too. When did people become such wimps that they think a well-wish is an insult? Do people also get offended when someone says "bless you" after a sneeze?
  - daveFNbuck 10y ago
    > When did people become such wimps that they think a well-wish is an insult? This whole argument started when some people decided that "happy holidays" was an affront. Stores forcing their non-Christian employees to mention Christmas to their non-Christian customers in every interaction is weird and no one involved likes it.
  - yequalsx 10y ago
    OK. So it's not offensive to you. Is there no one who would be offended by being told "Happy Ramadan"? I think it's clear that some people would be offended. Walk a mile in their shoes and maybe you'll understand why some people get offended at things you don't get offended at. Is there anything that offends, disgusts you? Is there anything that causes you to react with anger, sadness, fear, or any other such emotion? If so can you imagine someone that would not be similarly offended? Can you imagine that person saying, "Why is Mikeb85 such a goddamned wimp?"
    - mc32 10y ago
      If someone were move/emigrate to Jordan knowing Jordan their traditions, history and religion and they found that offensive, there is something fundamentally wrong with them moving to Jordan. I'm also sure Christians, Buddhists , Jews, in Jordan understand and are not offended by that either.
      - yequalsx 10y ago
        As far as I can tell almost everyone offended at "Happy Holidays" comes from Christians who prefer to be told "Merry Christmas".
        mc32 10y ago
        Christians might see if as part of their religious identity, as an atheist it's not part of any religious identity to me, but I find it peculiar that people find that it could be offensive since it does not mean to me Christ Mass [and other non religious or people of other religions presumably would not see it as Christ Mass], but rather a seasonal greeting with historical religious roots --like many things in our lives. Do we rebrand Halloween because of its pagan _religious_ historical context? Do we say, no no no more quinceaneras, that just promotes more patriarchal hegemony in a community which is characterized by patriarchy?
        yequalsx 10y ago
        It seems ironic to me that my comment was about recognizing that people do and can get offended by phrases without being a wimp. Now you seem to be saying that Christmas should have been rebranded because that offends some Christians. But that is my point. People can and do get offended by phrases. Let's recognize this. Sometimes the offense is something that warrants change and sometimes not. I don't think Christians are wimps for not liking "Happy Holidays".
        mc32 10y ago
        Do you think people in other countries who have other majority religions should say "Happy Holidays" so as not to offend people who might not share their religion?
- mc32 10y ago
  I'm atheist and I don't get offended. I also don't get offended when people greet me with minority-religion greetings either. When I'm abroad and people greet me with their local greetings with which I have no cultural grounding, understanding or commonality, I also don't feel offended, rather, I find them interesting. These kinds of nonsensical diversion into trying to become bland entities stripped of their own identity might contribute to the attraction of people like Trump. PS. I've worked at Chinese [with lots of Chinese ex-pats] companies where people say Merry Christmas way more often than in American companies where you might get a Merry Christmas one-to-one but not in a group setting, as if they are ashamed to say it. Rather odd.
- boona 10y ago
  > so I'm assuming he thinks we can somehow talk retail stores into offending their customers again I don't believe that most people are so intolerant as to allow themselves to be offended when they hear "Merry Christmas". If they truly are that intolerant to western customs, then I don't think it's right give them a pass. Tolerance goes both ways.

I like the idea but it is obviously biased with "promises "such as >"If I become president, we're all going to be saying 'Merry Christmas' again."

by thecopy 10y ago

I like the idea but it is obviously biased with "promises "such as >"If I become president, we're all going to be saying 'Merry Christmas' again."

wccrawford 10y ago

I can't imagine someone making this site without some bias. But that doesn't change the fact that he did promise these things. I think some of his ideas are good, some are disastrous, and some are crazy. But it'll be interesting to see which get fulfilled and which don't. For the record, some people already say "Merry Christmas", so I'm assuming he thinks we can somehow talk retail stores into offending their customers again, which I seriously doubt will happen.

Mikeb85 10y ago
> so I'm assuming he thinks we can somehow talk retail stores into offending their customers again How is it offensive? If a Muslim were to wish me a happy Ramadan I'd be cool with it, or if someone of Chinese descent wishes me a happy New Year on their New Year's date, that's ok too. When did people become such wimps that they think a well-wish is an insult? Do people also get offended when someone says "bless you" after a sneeze?
- daveFNbuck 10y ago
  > When did people become such wimps that they think a well-wish is an insult? This whole argument started when some people decided that "happy holidays" was an affront. Stores forcing their non-Christian employees to mention Christmas to their non-Christian customers in every interaction is weird and no one involved likes it.
- yequalsx 10y ago
  OK. So it's not offensive to you. Is there no one who would be offended by being told "Happy Ramadan"? I think it's clear that some people would be offended. Walk a mile in their shoes and maybe you'll understand why some people get offended at things you don't get offended at. Is there anything that offends, disgusts you? Is there anything that causes you to react with anger, sadness, fear, or any other such emotion? If so can you imagine someone that would not be similarly offended? Can you imagine that person saying, "Why is Mikeb85 such a goddamned wimp?"
  - mc32 10y ago
    If someone were move/emigrate to Jordan knowing Jordan their traditions, history and religion and they found that offensive, there is something fundamentally wrong with them moving to Jordan. I'm also sure Christians, Buddhists , Jews, in Jordan understand and are not offended by that either.
    - yequalsx 10y ago
      As far as I can tell almost everyone offended at "Happy Holidays" comes from Christians who prefer to be told "Merry Christmas".
      - mc32 10y ago
        Christians might see if as part of their religious identity, as an atheist it's not part of any religious identity to me, but I find it peculiar that people find that it could be offensive since it does not mean to me Christ Mass [and other non religious or people of other religions presumably would not see it as Christ Mass], but rather a seasonal greeting with historical religious roots --like many things in our lives. Do we rebrand Halloween because of its pagan _religious_ historical context? Do we say, no no no more quinceaneras, that just promotes more patriarchal hegemony in a community which is characterized by patriarchy?
        yequalsx 10y ago
        It seems ironic to me that my comment was about recognizing that people do and can get offended by phrases without being a wimp. Now you seem to be saying that Christmas should have been rebranded because that offends some Christians. But that is my point. People can and do get offended by phrases. Let's recognize this. Sometimes the offense is something that warrants change and sometimes not. I don't think Christians are wimps for not liking "Happy Holidays".
        mc32 10y ago
        Do you think people in other countries who have other majority religions should say "Happy Holidays" so as not to offend people who might not share their religion?
mc32 10y ago
I'm atheist and I don't get offended. I also don't get offended when people greet me with minority-religion greetings either. When I'm abroad and people greet me with their local greetings with which I have no cultural grounding, understanding or commonality, I also don't feel offended, rather, I find them interesting. These kinds of nonsensical diversion into trying to become bland entities stripped of their own identity might contribute to the attraction of people like Trump. PS. I've worked at Chinese [with lots of Chinese ex-pats] companies where people say Merry Christmas way more often than in American companies where you might get a Merry Christmas one-to-one but not in a group setting, as if they are ashamed to say it. Rather odd.
boona 10y ago
> so I'm assuming he thinks we can somehow talk retail stores into offending their customers again I don't believe that most people are so intolerant as to allow themselves to be offended when they hear "Merry Christmas". If they truly are that intolerant to western customs, then I don't think it's right give them a pass. Tolerance goes both ways.