24 ms·

If we believe all the recently headlines about who he's bringing in it appears pure "pay to play". Lots of individuals who Trump "owes" through either money or

by Rapzid 10y ago

If we believe all the recently headlines about who he's bringing in it appears pure "pay to play". Lots of individuals who Trump "owes" through either money or support they provided to him; pure cronyism. I'm not sure Trump realizes what worked best in business, or what he felt worked best for him in what business he has done, is not necessarily best for operating policy. I'm not sure he cares. I suspect he might though. Dude looked humble-struck in the video today with Obama; almost worried about what he got himself into.

raspasov 10y ago
"humble-struck" - can't agree more, lol.
- ajeet_dhaliwal 10y ago
  If he treated it like a game that you win, he won, but he can't just go home now, he's signed up to be on call 24/7. I'm not wealthy but I've treated job interviews like this and been unhappy after "winning". Now I'm highly selective about what I do. Losing such personal freedom needs someone with a real conviction about the job and stamina, he may have it, otherwise he'll be miserable. The White House probably came across as a dump compared to what he's used to.
threeseed 10y ago
Trump I suspect will be very similar to George W Bush. From all accounts he simply doesn't have the intellectual stamina to handle the rigours of the job. And I don't mean that in a negative way he is just more of a hands on, energetic, get shit done sort of guy. So in order to survive he is going to delegate to people like Guilani, Christie, Gingrich, Carson etc. Some of the most shameless, self serving and unethical people around in politics.
- maverick_iceman 10y ago
  Last time I read the constitution there was no "intellectual stamina" requirement to become the President. Also if Hillary was elected would she have surrounded herself by Gandhi-like selfless advisors?
  - icebraining 10y ago
    Last time I read the constitution there was no "intellectual stamina" requirement to become the President. Nobody said it was a requirement to be a President. Just to be a decent one.
- Rapzid 10y ago
  Apparently because they supported his campaign too.. Man, it's hard to watch. I see evidence and hope very much that the pivot people thought would happen when he got the GOP nomination has happened now that he has won the White House and everything is sinking in. I didn't support Trump for prez, but I really hope he is successful and was a little excited shortly after the shock wore off. Excited for the unknown and the prospect that he might shake up the establishment. But reading all the news about him just surrounding himself with people who took a long shot on him pre-pivot; really eating away at my silver lining. It was clear during the debates he had little substance in the way of issue and policy awareness. He deflected, quipped and barbed to appeal to people's emotions. He needs to be surrounding himself with the best advisors and tapping the best from either side on the shoulder.
  - lamontcg 10y ago
    Coming as someone who lived through Reagan and both Bushes, I can state with a reasonable degree of certainty that you don't know how the world works, and you're about to get a lesson. I'm not even certain you understand how the government works, since it is going to be the Republican House and Senate who are going to be drafting and sending bills for him to sign.
    - corndoge 10y ago
      Well I'm relieved to hear that at least someone among us knows exactly how the world works.
  - lunula 10y ago
    > Excited for the unknown and the prospect that he might shake up the establishment. A lot of people say he isn't part of the establishment. The idea that someone who is rich and embedded in the media for the entire professional life is not part of the establishment is really confusing to me. Why do you have this perception? I am honestly curious.
    - mschuster91 10y ago
      > The idea that someone who is rich and embedded in the media for the entire professional life is not part of the establishment is really confusing to me. People usually mean "political establishment" as "people who entered their party's youth org at 14 and since then never left working for their party". Which is bad because a politician who never had to do a real-world job in his life can neither understand nor empathize with the problems of the average population.
- reflexive 10y ago
  > From all accounts he simply doesn't have the intellectual stamina Can you elaborate on what accounts these are? The only estimate I've seen of his intelligence was based the school he graduated from.
  - threeseed 10y ago
    Intellectual stamina != Intelligence. I am referring to the fact that the Presidency has been described as far more an exercise in patience, absorbing information and careful deliberation than say running a typical business especially a dynamic one like Trump used to. He is by all accounts a very smart guy. But by all accounts he isn't a particularly patient one.
    - reflexive 10y ago
      by all accounts I'm not disagreeing with you; I'm just asking you to cite one or more of these accounts describing his lack of intellectual stamina.
      - threeseed 10y ago
        "1986 memo I wrote re: Art of the Deal. Trump couldn't focus for interviews. Can't focus now for debate prep" - Tony Schwartz (who wrote Art of the Deal) And we all saw through the 3 debates that Trump started off well and then really struggled towards the end e.g. http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/projects/cp/opinion/clinton-trump-first-debate-election-2016/trump-fails-the-stamina-test http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/projects/cp/opinion/clint...
    - ant6n 10y ago
      I wonder whether you are getting voted down because you're suggesting Trump is smart, or because you're saying he's impatient. This account [1] by the ghostwriter who wrote 'Art of the deal', who spent months with him, suggests that he is neither smart nor patient. Over his long life, starting with a very silver spoon that he wasn't able to destroy, he effectively focussed most of his energy to coming up with a couple of heuristics for making deals and communication. I get the impression he spent most of his life's effort on something that might be called 'social hacking' here. [1] http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2016/07/25/donald-trumps-ghostwriter-tells-all http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2016/07/25/donald-trumps-g...
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- danm07 10y ago
  I think George W Bush would be quite happy that he will no longer be considered the worst president in recent history.
  - jdavis703 10y ago
    Maybe the Civilization game will remove Dan Quayle as the leader you get characterized as when you finish the game with the least points.
- Aloha 10y ago
  They said much the same of Ronald Reagan. I'm no fan of either Reagan or Trump - but I think they both had the stamina for the office.
  - steveax 10y ago
    Dunno, were you around when Reagan was in office? He nodded off in public frequently, once famously in a meeting with the Pope.
- filoeleven 10y ago
  Counterpoint to Bush's implied lack of intellect: http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2013/04/25/george_w_bush_is_smarter_than_you_118125.html http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2013/04/25/george_...
edblarney 10y ago
"Lots of individuals who Trump "owes" through either money or support they provided to him; pure cronyism." Trump is the most 'free' President in modern history. He 'owes' the least, to the fewest people. This is one thing even the center-left press were talking about. As for Thiel - $1M might seem like a lot - but Trump doesn't really 'owe' Thiel anything, because Thiel doesn't have direct future influence etc., and Trump doesn't need him in the future. For example: Bill Maher gave $1M to Obama. For that you get some friendly things, but Obama didn't need Maher after that. Hillary is not directly uber wealthy - and she accepted $57M from private individuals and businesses while she was Sec of State - for which she provided mostly small favours (introductions). Trump had the smallest team in Presidential history, the banks were mostly betting on Hillary etc.. I don't really like Trump, but he's largely unburdened by having to hand out appointments. He'll give them to those that 'stuck by him' i.e. Guliani etc. and scorn on the old Bush guard.
- Rapzid 10y ago
  > He'll give them to those that 'stuck by him' i.e. Guliani etc. and scorn on the old Bush guard. "owes" man. In quotes because he doesn't have any fiscal or otherwise legal obligation to pay them back. If he largely surrounds himself with those few who supported him(opportunistically dare I say?) then it's a huge red flag in my book he isn't really going for the best advisors. I'd like to see at least a couple old detractors on the list..
  - leakybit 10y ago
    This is the case with just about every politician, the campaign staff essential becomes part of the administration. Remember that he only has 8 weeks to fill hundreds of jobs in his cabinet.
  - Mathnerd314 10y ago
    My guess is that most of them will be "wildcards", people that have no political experience / ties whatsoever and were chosen because they were experts or at least moderately successful in their chosen field. Thiel kind of fits that profile, ignoring his recent antics.
zaroth 10y ago
Ok, it is a skill keeping a train of thought going with those camera shutters going off 50 times a second. [1] I didn't see what you saw, but Trump sure looks tired. Anyone would be, I have no idea how they keep the pace they do. Oldest President-elect in history. My first executive order as President of the United States would be to ban camera shutters at my press conferences. [1] - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWs4RzoPP6M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWs4RzoPP6M
- heartbreak 10y ago
  I see fidgeting, I see him not looking at the President while he's speaking (watch how the President listens). Later with Speaker Ryan, President-elect Trump kept his hands beneath the table in his lap during the press conference. This is a businessman, and it's not his first time sitting at a boardroom table. He knows to keep his hands in view, and he's tired, stressed, and showing weakness. I assure you the President is also tired and stressed, and probably feeling pretty defeated right now. He's putting on a public face despite that, and he's doing a much better job of it than his successor. Give it time, though. In a few weeks the President-elect will be back to his confident self.
- danm07 10y ago
  I don't think he's tired. By the time he took the stage, news networkers have been railing about global markets in free-fall for several hours. He literally cannot restart his shpiel until the markets stabilize. To me, his suppression looks contrived.
coderdude 10y ago
If we're talking about believing headlines it's important to note that headlines would have had you believe that 90% of the country was going to vote for Hillary. They've been very wrong and will likely continue to be wrong until proven otherwise.
pmorici 10y ago
What you guys are describing isn't cronyism. The definition of cronyism is, "the appointment of friends and associates to positions of authority, _without proper regard to their qualifications._" I'm not seeing anyone arguing that Peter Theil isn't qualified. Bush nominating Harriet Miers is an example of cronyism. This really isn't. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harriet_Miers_Supreme_Court_nomination https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harriet_Miers_Supreme_Court_no...
- billiam 10y ago
  Here, this guy. Thiel isn't qualified. He knows nothing about running a real business, just investing in them. He knows nothing about economic policy. And clearly he knows nothing about governance.
  - lloyddobbler 10y ago
    You apparently haven't read up on the history of Paypal...?
  - pmorici 10y ago
    What evidence do you have that that is true? Looking at his career experience on Wikipedia suggests the exact opposite. Not to mention it's a win for LGBT causes which he is known to be a supporter of.
    - peterclary 10y ago
      It's a win for LGBT causes to ally himself with somebody who believes in Conversion Therapy? [Edit: I meant Trump, and I was wrong - see below. Technically Thiel is also allied with Pence, who does believe in Conversion Therapy, but that wasn't who I meant. I apologise]
      - pmorici 10y ago
        Trump has never said he believes in conversion therapy. That is Pence, who is the vice president a position of little to no power. If you are advocating that you shouldn't ever associate with anyone who has a wrong idea about something then I think you are really wrong. Engaging people is how you change minds not shunning them because they have a factually incorrect belief or disagree with you.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
dajohnson89 10y ago
>almost worried about what he got himself into. Uh, no shit?
dcposch 10y ago
> Dude looked humble-struck in the video today with Obama; almost worried about what he got himself into. I bet part of that was an emotion completely absent from Trump's public persona: shame. Trump started his political career circa 2010 as a "birther" -- going on national TV, asking for Obama's birth certificate, saying he was born in Kenya and therefore ineligible to hold office. Really racist, bottom-of-the-barrel tabloid stuff. -- Obama was incredibly gracious the day after the election. Here he is, talking about how he's "rooting" for Trump to do well, how Trump's success as President will be the nation's success: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wr2USTE3L98 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wr2USTE3L98 Meeting after all that must have been at least a little bit embarrassing. Even for the Donald.
- DefaultUserHN 10y ago
  Trump did not start in 2010. It had been a long road to the White House for Trump. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxf1XmVZ9qY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxf1XmVZ9qY
- pmorici 10y ago
  Trump didn't start his political career in 2010. He first considered running for president in the 1988 election. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SEPs17_AkTI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SEPs17_AkTI This also isn't the first time he's run. He ran as a reform party candidate in 2000 when he campaigned on the issues of "fair trade, eliminating the national debt, and achieving universal healthcare" he also said he wanted Oprah to be his running mate. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donald_Trump_presidential_campaign,_2000 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donald_Trump_presidential_camp...

by Rapzid 10y ago

raspasov 10y ago

"humble-struck" - can't agree more, lol.

ajeet_dhaliwal 10y ago
If he treated it like a game that you win, he won, but he can't just go home now, he's signed up to be on call 24/7. I'm not wealthy but I've treated job interviews like this and been unhappy after "winning". Now I'm highly selective about what I do. Losing such personal freedom needs someone with a real conviction about the job and stamina, he may have it, otherwise he'll be miserable. The White House probably came across as a dump compared to what he's used to.

threeseed 10y ago

Trump I suspect will be very similar to George W Bush. From all accounts he simply doesn't have the intellectual stamina to handle the rigours of the job. And I don't mean that in a negative way he is just more of a hands on, energetic, get shit done sort of guy. So in order to survive he is going to delegate to people like Guilani, Christie, Gingrich, Carson etc. Some of the most shameless, self serving and unethical people around in politics.

maverick_iceman 10y ago
Last time I read the constitution there was no "intellectual stamina" requirement to become the President. Also if Hillary was elected would she have surrounded herself by Gandhi-like selfless advisors?
- icebraining 10y ago
  Last time I read the constitution there was no "intellectual stamina" requirement to become the President. Nobody said it was a requirement to be a President. Just to be a decent one.
Rapzid 10y ago
Apparently because they supported his campaign too.. Man, it's hard to watch. I see evidence and hope very much that the pivot people thought would happen when he got the GOP nomination has happened now that he has won the White House and everything is sinking in. I didn't support Trump for prez, but I really hope he is successful and was a little excited shortly after the shock wore off. Excited for the unknown and the prospect that he might shake up the establishment. But reading all the news about him just surrounding himself with people who took a long shot on him pre-pivot; really eating away at my silver lining. It was clear during the debates he had little substance in the way of issue and policy awareness. He deflected, quipped and barbed to appeal to people's emotions. He needs to be surrounding himself with the best advisors and tapping the best from either side on the shoulder.
- lamontcg 10y ago
  Coming as someone who lived through Reagan and both Bushes, I can state with a reasonable degree of certainty that you don't know how the world works, and you're about to get a lesson. I'm not even certain you understand how the government works, since it is going to be the Republican House and Senate who are going to be drafting and sending bills for him to sign.
  - corndoge 10y ago
    Well I'm relieved to hear that at least someone among us knows exactly how the world works.
- lunula 10y ago
  > Excited for the unknown and the prospect that he might shake up the establishment. A lot of people say he isn't part of the establishment. The idea that someone who is rich and embedded in the media for the entire professional life is not part of the establishment is really confusing to me. Why do you have this perception? I am honestly curious.
  - mschuster91 10y ago
    > The idea that someone who is rich and embedded in the media for the entire professional life is not part of the establishment is really confusing to me. People usually mean "political establishment" as "people who entered their party's youth org at 14 and since then never left working for their party". Which is bad because a politician who never had to do a real-world job in his life can neither understand nor empathize with the problems of the average population.
reflexive 10y ago
> From all accounts he simply doesn't have the intellectual stamina Can you elaborate on what accounts these are? The only estimate I've seen of his intelligence was based the school he graduated from.
- threeseed 10y ago
  Intellectual stamina != Intelligence. I am referring to the fact that the Presidency has been described as far more an exercise in patience, absorbing information and careful deliberation than say running a typical business especially a dynamic one like Trump used to. He is by all accounts a very smart guy. But by all accounts he isn't a particularly patient one.
  - reflexive 10y ago
    by all accounts I'm not disagreeing with you; I'm just asking you to cite one or more of these accounts describing his lack of intellectual stamina.
    - threeseed 10y ago
      "1986 memo I wrote re: Art of the Deal. Trump couldn't focus for interviews. Can't focus now for debate prep" - Tony Schwartz (who wrote Art of the Deal) And we all saw through the 3 debates that Trump started off well and then really struggled towards the end e.g. http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/projects/cp/opinion/clinton-trump-first-debate-election-2016/trump-fails-the-stamina-test http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/projects/cp/opinion/clint...
  - ant6n 10y ago
    I wonder whether you are getting voted down because you're suggesting Trump is smart, or because you're saying he's impatient. This account [1] by the ghostwriter who wrote 'Art of the deal', who spent months with him, suggests that he is neither smart nor patient. Over his long life, starting with a very silver spoon that he wasn't able to destroy, he effectively focussed most of his energy to coming up with a couple of heuristics for making deals and communication. I get the impression he spent most of his life's effort on something that might be called 'social hacking' here. [1] http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2016/07/25/donald-trumps-ghostwriter-tells-all http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2016/07/25/donald-trumps-g...
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
danm07 10y ago
I think George W Bush would be quite happy that he will no longer be considered the worst president in recent history.
- jdavis703 10y ago
  Maybe the Civilization game will remove Dan Quayle as the leader you get characterized as when you finish the game with the least points.
Aloha 10y ago
They said much the same of Ronald Reagan. I'm no fan of either Reagan or Trump - but I think they both had the stamina for the office.
- steveax 10y ago
  Dunno, were you around when Reagan was in office? He nodded off in public frequently, once famously in a meeting with the Pope.
filoeleven 10y ago
Counterpoint to Bush's implied lack of intellect: http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2013/04/25/george_w_bush_is_smarter_than_you_118125.html http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2013/04/25/george_...

edblarney 10y ago

"Lots of individuals who Trump "owes" through either money or support they provided to him; pure cronyism." Trump is the most 'free' President in modern history. He 'owes' the least, to the fewest people. This is one thing even the center-left press were talking about. As for Thiel - $1M might seem like a lot - but Trump doesn't really 'owe' Thiel anything, because Thiel doesn't have direct future influence etc., and Trump doesn't need him in the future. For example: Bill Maher gave $1M to Obama. For that you get some friendly things, but Obama didn't need Maher after that. Hillary is not directly uber wealthy - and she accepted $57M from private individuals and businesses while she was Sec of State - for which she provided mostly small favours (introductions). Trump had the smallest team in Presidential history, the banks were mostly betting on Hillary etc.. I don't really like Trump, but he's largely unburdened by having to hand out appointments. He'll give them to those that 'stuck by him' i.e. Guliani etc. and scorn on the old Bush guard.

Rapzid 10y ago
> He'll give them to those that 'stuck by him' i.e. Guliani etc. and scorn on the old Bush guard. "owes" man. In quotes because he doesn't have any fiscal or otherwise legal obligation to pay them back. If he largely surrounds himself with those few who supported him(opportunistically dare I say?) then it's a huge red flag in my book he isn't really going for the best advisors. I'd like to see at least a couple old detractors on the list..
- leakybit 10y ago
  This is the case with just about every politician, the campaign staff essential becomes part of the administration. Remember that he only has 8 weeks to fill hundreds of jobs in his cabinet.
- Mathnerd314 10y ago
  My guess is that most of them will be "wildcards", people that have no political experience / ties whatsoever and were chosen because they were experts or at least moderately successful in their chosen field. Thiel kind of fits that profile, ignoring his recent antics.

zaroth 10y ago

Ok, it is a skill keeping a train of thought going with those camera shutters going off 50 times a second. [1] I didn't see what you saw, but Trump sure looks tired. Anyone would be, I have no idea how they keep the pace they do. Oldest President-elect in history. My first executive order as President of the United States would be to ban camera shutters at my press conferences. [1] - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWs4RzoPP6M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dWs4RzoPP6M

heartbreak 10y ago
I see fidgeting, I see him not looking at the President while he's speaking (watch how the President listens). Later with Speaker Ryan, President-elect Trump kept his hands beneath the table in his lap during the press conference. This is a businessman, and it's not his first time sitting at a boardroom table. He knows to keep his hands in view, and he's tired, stressed, and showing weakness. I assure you the President is also tired and stressed, and probably feeling pretty defeated right now. He's putting on a public face despite that, and he's doing a much better job of it than his successor. Give it time, though. In a few weeks the President-elect will be back to his confident self.
danm07 10y ago
I don't think he's tired. By the time he took the stage, news networkers have been railing about global markets in free-fall for several hours. He literally cannot restart his shpiel until the markets stabilize. To me, his suppression looks contrived.

coderdude 10y ago

If we're talking about believing headlines it's important to note that headlines would have had you believe that 90% of the country was going to vote for Hillary. They've been very wrong and will likely continue to be wrong until proven otherwise.

pmorici 10y ago

What you guys are describing isn't cronyism. The definition of cronyism is, "the appointment of friends and associates to positions of authority, _without proper regard to their qualifications._" I'm not seeing anyone arguing that Peter Theil isn't qualified. Bush nominating Harriet Miers is an example of cronyism. This really isn't. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harriet_Miers_Supreme_Court_nomination https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harriet_Miers_Supreme_Court_no...

billiam 10y ago
Here, this guy. Thiel isn't qualified. He knows nothing about running a real business, just investing in them. He knows nothing about economic policy. And clearly he knows nothing about governance.
- lloyddobbler 10y ago
  You apparently haven't read up on the history of Paypal...?
- pmorici 10y ago
  What evidence do you have that that is true? Looking at his career experience on Wikipedia suggests the exact opposite. Not to mention it's a win for LGBT causes which he is known to be a supporter of.
  - peterclary 10y ago
    It's a win for LGBT causes to ally himself with somebody who believes in Conversion Therapy? [Edit: I meant Trump, and I was wrong - see below. Technically Thiel is also allied with Pence, who does believe in Conversion Therapy, but that wasn't who I meant. I apologise]
    - pmorici 10y ago
      Trump has never said he believes in conversion therapy. That is Pence, who is the vice president a position of little to no power. If you are advocating that you shouldn't ever associate with anyone who has a wrong idea about something then I think you are really wrong. Engaging people is how you change minds not shunning them because they have a factually incorrect belief or disagree with you.

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

dajohnson89 10y ago

>almost worried about what he got himself into. Uh, no shit?

dcposch 10y ago

> Dude looked humble-struck in the video today with Obama; almost worried about what he got himself into. I bet part of that was an emotion completely absent from Trump's public persona: shame. Trump started his political career circa 2010 as a "birther" -- going on national TV, asking for Obama's birth certificate, saying he was born in Kenya and therefore ineligible to hold office. Really racist, bottom-of-the-barrel tabloid stuff. -- Obama was incredibly gracious the day after the election. Here he is, talking about how he's "rooting" for Trump to do well, how Trump's success as President will be the nation's success: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wr2USTE3L98 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wr2USTE3L98 Meeting after all that must have been at least a little bit embarrassing. Even for the Donald.

DefaultUserHN 10y ago
Trump did not start in 2010. It had been a long road to the White House for Trump. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxf1XmVZ9qY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mxf1XmVZ9qY
pmorici 10y ago
Trump didn't start his political career in 2010. He first considered running for president in the 1988 election. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SEPs17_AkTI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SEPs17_AkTI This also isn't the first time he's run. He ran as a reform party candidate in 2000 when he campaigned on the issues of "fair trade, eliminating the national debt, and achieving universal healthcare" he also said he wanted Oprah to be his running mate. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donald_Trump_presidential_campaign,_2000 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donald_Trump_presidential_camp...