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Don't think that is possible. If I was a democrat today I'd do like the Republicans have been doing the last 8 years and do my outmost to make the Trump Preside

Don't think that is possible. If I was a democrat today I'd do like the Republicans have been doing the last 8 years and do my outmost to make the Trump Presidency be a major failure. The way the republicans have played this game is so dirty, that you can't expect people to forgive. We can not reward such a divisive character like Donald Trump with his racism, xenophobia, mysogny, insults and bullying with a successful presidency. Honestly I think the democrats should do the best the sabotage him and make sure everything he does fails. It should teach them a lesson that there is no reward in playing dirty and confrontational. If we reward this behavior it will only get worse. It is sad to say, but for the long term benefit of America it is probably better if it gets run to the ground over these four years. Then America will be spared for such leaders in the future.

buckbova 10y ago
> It is sad to say, but for the long term benefit of America it is probably better if it gets run to the ground over these four years. Then America will be spared for such leaders in the future. I heard this EXACT phrase said about Obama 8 years ago! We always get what we deserve. Hope, change, make america great again. > If I was a democrat today I'd do like the Republicans have been doing the last 8 years and do my outmost to make the Trump Presidency be a major failure. Good luck with that. GOP now has majorities and will probably pick up more in 2018. So be it.
- TAForObvReasons 10y ago
  Dems started with a majority in both houses back in 2009-2010. Still didn't stop the GOP from filibustering and pulling out all the stops. This is a real test of the spine of the democratic party. Will they pull the same stunts the GOP did back then? Who knows
  - buckbova 10y ago
    New rules since then. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Filibuster_in_the_United_States_Senate#Changes_in_2013 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Filibuster_in_the_United_State... > The new rules remove the requirement of 60 votes in order to begin debate on legislation and allow the minority two amendments to measures that reach the Senate floor, a change implemented as a standing order that expires at the end of the current term. In the new rules, the amount of time to debate following a motion to proceed has been reduced from 30 hours to four. Additionally, a filibuster on the motion to proceed will be blocked if a petition is signed by eight members of the minority, including the minority leader.
goatlover 10y ago
Won't this just devolve into a vicious circle, where the politically expedient thing to do is to utterly sabotage the other side, and teach the voters a less each election cycle?
cableshaft 10y ago
I don't think they should act like the Republicans did under Obama and vote against things they actually believed in just to make him ineffective. If they genuinely vote for things they believe in, maybe Trump will feel more of a reason to compromise instead of digging his heels into the dirt further and further and stomping on them anyway. It's because they did this that the country got further divided and less bipartisan. But yes, Democrats better do whatever they can to stop anything that's outrageous or they don't believe in even a little bit. No "Oh, the people have spoken, so we better go along with it" shit. Republicans pulled every dirty trick they could with Obama, so they should feel free to do the same.
notacoward 10y ago
> do like the Republicans have been doing the last 8 years and do my outmost to make the Trump Presidency be a major failure. I think I'd modify that just a little. Our too-few representatives in Congress should do everything to thwart the Trump agenda, but only because that agenda is itself a failure. By opposing it, we make America a success. Very different than what the Republicans have been doing.
- wtbob 10y ago
  Have you considered that Republicans might consider their opposition and obstruction to be in the best interests of America?
  - notacoward 10y ago
    They quite explicitly said the exact opposite the day after Obama was elected. They didn't just want Obama's policies to fail. They were willing to accept failures that hurt people, so that those people would associate the pain with Obama and vote the other way next time. That's the level of obstructionism I'm suggesting we not pursue.
    - wtbob 10y ago
      > They quite explicitly said the exact opposite the day after Obama was elected. They didn't just want Obama's policies to fail. They were willing to accept failures that hurt people, so that those people would associate the pain with Obama and vote the other way next time. What was the exact quote?
      - notacoward 10y ago
        I know you'll dismiss this because of the source, but that's your problem. http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/8/10/1118614/-Biden-Mitch-McConnell-vowed-no-cooperation-with-the-Obama-administration-from-the-get-go http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/8/10/1118614/-Biden-Mitch...
paulcole 10y ago
> the democrats should do the best the sabotage him and make sure everything he does fails. Trump's got a lot more experience playing that game than they do.
woodchuck64 10y ago
> Honestly I think the democrats should do the best the sabotage him and make sure everything he does fails. I don't think this is necessary. With Obama, his policies were ultimately shaped, designed and compromised to benefit centrist to left-leaning voters, and so he was sharply opposed by the right and extreme right. With Trump, his policies will be ultimately shaped, designed and compromised to benefit Trump, so it is far from clear that this will give advantage to any class of voter at all.
erikpukinskis 10y ago
I actually think we are facing real daily crises that need to be addressed. So no, I'm not going to try to sabotage my country in order to try to tarnish the Republican brand. I have work to do.

buckbova 10y ago

> It is sad to say, but for the long term benefit of America it is probably better if it gets run to the ground over these four years. Then America will be spared for such leaders in the future. I heard this EXACT phrase said about Obama 8 years ago! We always get what we deserve. Hope, change, make america great again. > If I was a democrat today I'd do like the Republicans have been doing the last 8 years and do my outmost to make the Trump Presidency be a major failure. Good luck with that. GOP now has majorities and will probably pick up more in 2018. So be it.

TAForObvReasons 10y ago
Dems started with a majority in both houses back in 2009-2010. Still didn't stop the GOP from filibustering and pulling out all the stops. This is a real test of the spine of the democratic party. Will they pull the same stunts the GOP did back then? Who knows
- buckbova 10y ago
  New rules since then. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Filibuster_in_the_United_States_Senate#Changes_in_2013 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Filibuster_in_the_United_State... > The new rules remove the requirement of 60 votes in order to begin debate on legislation and allow the minority two amendments to measures that reach the Senate floor, a change implemented as a standing order that expires at the end of the current term. In the new rules, the amount of time to debate following a motion to proceed has been reduced from 30 hours to four. Additionally, a filibuster on the motion to proceed will be blocked if a petition is signed by eight members of the minority, including the minority leader.

goatlover 10y ago

Won't this just devolve into a vicious circle, where the politically expedient thing to do is to utterly sabotage the other side, and teach the voters a less each election cycle?

cableshaft 10y ago

I don't think they should act like the Republicans did under Obama and vote against things they actually believed in just to make him ineffective. If they genuinely vote for things they believe in, maybe Trump will feel more of a reason to compromise instead of digging his heels into the dirt further and further and stomping on them anyway. It's because they did this that the country got further divided and less bipartisan. But yes, Democrats better do whatever they can to stop anything that's outrageous or they don't believe in even a little bit. No "Oh, the people have spoken, so we better go along with it" shit. Republicans pulled every dirty trick they could with Obama, so they should feel free to do the same.

notacoward 10y ago

> do like the Republicans have been doing the last 8 years and do my outmost to make the Trump Presidency be a major failure. I think I'd modify that just a little. Our too-few representatives in Congress should do everything to thwart the Trump agenda, but only because that agenda is itself a failure. By opposing it, we make America a success. Very different than what the Republicans have been doing.

wtbob 10y ago
Have you considered that Republicans might consider their opposition and obstruction to be in the best interests of America?
- notacoward 10y ago
  They quite explicitly said the exact opposite the day after Obama was elected. They didn't just want Obama's policies to fail. They were willing to accept failures that hurt people, so that those people would associate the pain with Obama and vote the other way next time. That's the level of obstructionism I'm suggesting we not pursue.
  - wtbob 10y ago
    > They quite explicitly said the exact opposite the day after Obama was elected. They didn't just want Obama's policies to fail. They were willing to accept failures that hurt people, so that those people would associate the pain with Obama and vote the other way next time. What was the exact quote?
    - notacoward 10y ago
      I know you'll dismiss this because of the source, but that's your problem. http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/8/10/1118614/-Biden-Mitch-McConnell-vowed-no-cooperation-with-the-Obama-administration-from-the-get-go http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/8/10/1118614/-Biden-Mitch...

paulcole 10y ago

> the democrats should do the best the sabotage him and make sure everything he does fails. Trump's got a lot more experience playing that game than they do.

woodchuck64 10y ago

> Honestly I think the democrats should do the best the sabotage him and make sure everything he does fails. I don't think this is necessary. With Obama, his policies were ultimately shaped, designed and compromised to benefit centrist to left-leaning voters, and so he was sharply opposed by the right and extreme right. With Trump, his policies will be ultimately shaped, designed and compromised to benefit Trump, so it is far from clear that this will give advantage to any class of voter at all.

erikpukinskis 10y ago

I actually think we are facing real daily crises that need to be addressed. So no, I'm not going to try to sabotage my country in order to try to tarnish the Republican brand. I have work to do.