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Totally agreed, I read this earlier which is basically my view in a nutshell: The melt down right now is mental. What certain folk on the left don't seem to un

Totally agreed, I read this earlier which is basically my view in a nutshell: The melt down right now is mental. What certain folk on the left don't seem to understand is that you cannot simply disregard other peoples views because they do not align with your own. Huge swathes of 'I'm more educated than you, you're stupid if you voted for Trump' tweets flooding in. It's just embarrassing to be honest. As with brexit the people have spoken and fair enough if you don't like it, but you can't just denounce everyone who voted differently to you as an idiot. I used to be one of those people, then I realised I was being a tit and tried to be more open minded and crucially doing my own research rather than only paying attention to mainstream media. I don't like Trump and wouldn't even class myself a right winger but I am very glad Clinton didn't win. Corrupt career politicians who cause untold havoc and then try to dupe people into thinking they're actual, decent human beings can fuck right off. Make me sick

zamalek 10y ago
For the people that you refer to, Clinton was a benchmark: "we finally have a female president." As for the rest of us, it was a matter of how far down the rabbit hole we were: "can someone get voted in purely because they are female?" America could use a female president, oh hell yes, but only the correct female president. Someone who correctly demonstrates how we need women in leadership. Clinton is nothing of the kind. The fastest quick-draw on corruption and lies in the whole of Wall Street. She would have done decades worth of damage to feminism. I have mixed feelings. On the one hand, I worry for my gay brother who lives there, I sympathize with the honest Mexicans who genuinely try to contribute and I worry about my future in America as I immigrate early next year (family, you know). On the other, I'm a moderate and the left needs reigning in. They need to learn how to make friends and not enemies. The left has been an absolute shitshow for the past couple of years and some negative feedback is well overdue.
- sofaofthedamned 10y ago
  Good reply, agree with it all. The only nitpick I would have is that America don't really have a left when compared to the European type. Story time - I have been to Glastonbury Festival 13 times, it's my favourite place on earth. Michael Eavis who runs it is very left and has a bit of the festival that is dedicated to left politics, and the theme pretty much runs through the whole thing. I don't mind, it's his gig. Every year until he died, Tony Benn (a very left Labour politician) would be there Sunday morning doing a discussion. This was actually a proper discussion. I'd always go along as he was there either before or after my favourite drug smuggler ever Howard Marks who wrote the book Mr Nice. Now, Tony would always engage - pretty much each time I went he'd sit with a group of people with views orthogonal to his own and discuss them. We'd not often agree but we'd shake hands and hopefully everybody learned something. I put Tony Benn along with John Smith, and even Margaret Thatcher as people that believe in what they campaign for. Their politics were not mine, but I respect them. You do not see politicians of their type any more. They say what they feel and if they get in power they try to make it happen. Trump will not do half of what he said, Clinton would have been the same. there is the same smell from the pair of them. If this drama and Brexit should have taught these people anything it's to keep the hell away from politics. I doubt it'll happen however.
  - zamalek 10y ago
    > I went he'd sit with a group of people with views orthogonal to his own and discuss them. This is exactly what I wish for the human race. My old man is about colonialist as you get (having been born into colonial Rhodesia) - racist by the dictionary definition but will still take impeccable care of his workers. A few years ago, I finally had the privilege of challenging those beliefs - one of those red wine 3AM conversations. It was life-altering. Although I still strongly disagree with that specific belief of his, as an unusually logical person I was unable to convince him otherwise. I came away realizing that racism will fall away one day, but today is not the day. Until then I need to co-exist with bigots and respect them and their beliefs. As a singular example, I don't think there exists a solution to extremist terrorism. However, I think it would be far less rampant if we took the time to understand why people approach that subculture - instead of unilaterally condemning (right) or accepting (left) it. People are either for or against it, rather than contemplating why American teens would pick it up in the first place. The world today seems to be more concerned about stating what the problem is, rather than stating how we could possibly solve that problem. > there is the same smell from the pair of them. I fear what Trump has to say, I fear what Clinton never said. Bernie was great so far as representing the most progressive moral compass that we have, but he is no Lincoln. We simply lack that type of hero in our world today.

zamalek 10y ago

For the people that you refer to, Clinton was a benchmark: "we finally have a female president." As for the rest of us, it was a matter of how far down the rabbit hole we were: "can someone get voted in purely because they are female?" America could use a female president, oh hell yes, but only the correct female president. Someone who correctly demonstrates how we need women in leadership. Clinton is nothing of the kind. The fastest quick-draw on corruption and lies in the whole of Wall Street. She would have done decades worth of damage to feminism. I have mixed feelings. On the one hand, I worry for my gay brother who lives there, I sympathize with the honest Mexicans who genuinely try to contribute and I worry about my future in America as I immigrate early next year (family, you know). On the other, I'm a moderate and the left needs reigning in. They need to learn how to make friends and not enemies. The left has been an absolute shitshow for the past couple of years and some negative feedback is well overdue.

sofaofthedamned 10y ago
Good reply, agree with it all. The only nitpick I would have is that America don't really have a left when compared to the European type. Story time - I have been to Glastonbury Festival 13 times, it's my favourite place on earth. Michael Eavis who runs it is very left and has a bit of the festival that is dedicated to left politics, and the theme pretty much runs through the whole thing. I don't mind, it's his gig. Every year until he died, Tony Benn (a very left Labour politician) would be there Sunday morning doing a discussion. This was actually a proper discussion. I'd always go along as he was there either before or after my favourite drug smuggler ever Howard Marks who wrote the book Mr Nice. Now, Tony would always engage - pretty much each time I went he'd sit with a group of people with views orthogonal to his own and discuss them. We'd not often agree but we'd shake hands and hopefully everybody learned something. I put Tony Benn along with John Smith, and even Margaret Thatcher as people that believe in what they campaign for. Their politics were not mine, but I respect them. You do not see politicians of their type any more. They say what they feel and if they get in power they try to make it happen. Trump will not do half of what he said, Clinton would have been the same. there is the same smell from the pair of them. If this drama and Brexit should have taught these people anything it's to keep the hell away from politics. I doubt it'll happen however.
- zamalek 10y ago
  > I went he'd sit with a group of people with views orthogonal to his own and discuss them. This is exactly what I wish for the human race. My old man is about colonialist as you get (having been born into colonial Rhodesia) - racist by the dictionary definition but will still take impeccable care of his workers. A few years ago, I finally had the privilege of challenging those beliefs - one of those red wine 3AM conversations. It was life-altering. Although I still strongly disagree with that specific belief of his, as an unusually logical person I was unable to convince him otherwise. I came away realizing that racism will fall away one day, but today is not the day. Until then I need to co-exist with bigots and respect them and their beliefs. As a singular example, I don't think there exists a solution to extremist terrorism. However, I think it would be far less rampant if we took the time to understand why people approach that subculture - instead of unilaterally condemning (right) or accepting (left) it. People are either for or against it, rather than contemplating why American teens would pick it up in the first place. The world today seems to be more concerned about stating what the problem is, rather than stating how we could possibly solve that problem. > there is the same smell from the pair of them. I fear what Trump has to say, I fear what Clinton never said. Bernie was great so far as representing the most progressive moral compass that we have, but he is no Lincoln. We simply lack that type of hero in our world today.