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What Trump supporters fail to grasp is that many on the left agree but don't think Trump is the man for the job. He doesn't care about culture. You've been dupe

by Melk 10y ago

What Trump supporters fail to grasp is that many on the left agree but don't think Trump is the man for the job. He doesn't care about culture. You've been duped.

welanes 10y ago
But that was never the conversation. It was always about how only bigots and deplorables could support him. The concerns powering Trump's rise were shooed away as small-minded. Well, Brexit and Trump are two black eyes. I really hope the Left tune in to the grievances of the majority now, because I'm fearful of what comes next if they don't.
- lunula 10y ago
  The left has almost no political power. It is also the popular majority. There are more registered democrats in the us than republicans. Clinton is likely to win the popular vote. The system is physically designed, by districting and the electoral college, to support the political minority. You are conflating the actual demographics with the electoral system, which is lending more power to an oppressive point of view that is precisely what the political elite cultivates.
  - cft 10y ago
    Trump won the popular vote too.
    - fsck--off 10y ago
      Just because he's leading in the popular vote now doesn't mean he won the popular vote. The New York Times projects that Clinton will win the popular vote once all the ballots have been counted. http://www.nytimes.com/elections/forecast/president http://www.nytimes.com/elections/forecast/president
      - heneryville 10y ago
        Right now it's projecting a margin of 0.7% It's pretty hard to call that a mandate from a clear majority. I think we've got to accept that what we have is a deeply divided country, not a highly vocal minority.
        Zach_the_Lizard 10y ago
        There are many people such as myself in places like NY or California that don't vote because we know our votes don't matter, so it may be that in a popular vote election we'd see a greater margin for Clinton.
        kbenson 10y ago
        I wonder what it would look like if you took the percentages that voted for each candidate and scaled it to the population of the state, and then used that to total the scaled popular vote? Of course, there's many problems with that, foremost being that you can't assume that those that didn't vote did so in the same relative percentages of support that those that did vote. For example, I imagine there's a higher percentage of Democrats/Clinton supporters in CA and NY that didn't vote compared to the alternatives, and the opposite is likely true of predominantly red states.
      - mibbiting 10y ago
        When will people learn that polls and "projections" from mainstream media etc are ridiculously wrong on this. They were wrong on Brexit. They were wrong on Trump. Maybe once more countries have results like this the polsters and media will start actually engaging with real people.
      - mason240 10y ago
        Of course they are, they have to spin it to get their base to believe they've been cheated. The results will come in eventually that she lost the popular vote, but that feeling they cultivated will remain.
        10y ago
    - beat 10y ago
      Given current tallies, Trump will probably lose the popular vote by over a million. And he won't break 300 in the Electoral College. This is a very, very narrow win.
      - wool_gather 10y ago
        100% (except for the "over a million" part). This is the third-closest result in the electoral college since 1960 (first that included AK and HI). The next two were G. W. Bush's two wins. It's the second-tightest in the popular vote since then (the results I see have Clinton ahead by about 200K; JFK beat Nixon by ~100K). Our most recent president, Obama, absolutely destroyed Trump's results as far as having a "mandate", if that's what winning is considered. He got twice as many electoral votes as McCain and a margin of 7% in the popular. The win over Romney was tighter but still in a different order than this election. Reagan got a mandate in 1984. The talk of "mandate" this year is utter, complete, uncontestable political horse puckey.
        wool_gather 10y ago
        This is interesting, as an update: The Atlantic says that there's still almost 7 million votes outstanding as of Saturday the 12th. http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/11/clintons-popular-vote-lead-will-grow-and-grow/507455/ http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/11/clintons... So maybe she will break a million delta.
        beat 10y ago
        A week later, we're at 1.7+M Hillary lead and still growing. That's huge, 3% now and maybe up to 5% in the end.
        deleted 10y ago
        [deleted]
- ZeroGravitas 10y ago
  You've quoted the word deplorable, yet ignored the entire point of the statement that it came from, that it's not just bigots that are supporting Trump. How does that happen? You're on here emploring the left to pay attention to something, while (intentionally?) ignoring the fact that they did, and it got spun against them as one of their biggest gaffes of the campaign.
  - wavefunction 10y ago
    That's not paying attention to the "basket of deplorables," it's dismissing them. This election has shown me how out of touch most Americans are with each other. The media doesn't care about whole swathes of the country and our political systems write off rural inhabitants all the time.
    - ZeroGravitas 10y ago
      Yes she's dismissing the basked of deplorables, it's the other voters who don't fit that description she's reaching out to: "And unfortunately there are people like that. And he has lifted them up. He has given voice to their websites that used to only have 11,000 people — now how 11 million. He tweets and retweets their offensive hateful mean-spirited rhetoric. Now, some of those folks — they are irredeemable, but thankfully they are not America. But the other basket — and I know this because I see friends from all over America here — I see friends from Florida and Georgia and South Carolina and Texas — as well as, you know, New York and California — but that other basket of people are people who feel that the government has let them down, the economy has let them down, nobody cares about them, nobody worries about what happens to their lives and their futures, and they’re just desperate for change. It doesn’t really even matter where it comes from. They don’t buy everything he says, but he seems to hold out some hope that their lives will be different. They won’t wake up and see their jobs disappear, lose a kid to heroine, feel like they’re in a dead-end. Those are people we have to understand and empathize with as well. "
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
gph 10y ago
>You've been duped. True, but you could say that about nearly every politician that's been elected recently. At some point you have to vote for the person you agree with and just hope they will hold up at least some part of what they've promised.
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
JakeAl 10y ago
>You've been duped. Not if you were simply voting against Hillary.
noobiemcfoob 10y ago
Many supporters might agree that Trump isn't the man for the job. But you really think Hillary can serve as a symbol of our culture? She's a integral part of the politically correct movement that Trump supporters hate. They weren't duped - they got what they ordered - but liberals might want to re-examine their mission statement.
noobiemcfoob 10y ago
Many supporters might agree that Trump isn't the man for the job. But you really think Hillary can serve as a symbol of our culture? She's a integral part of the politically correct movement that Trump supporters hate. They weren't duped - they got what they ordered - but liberals might want to re-examine their mission statement.

by Melk 10y ago

What Trump supporters fail to grasp is that many on the left agree but don't think Trump is the man for the job. He doesn't care about culture. You've been duped.

welanes 10y ago

But that was never the conversation. It was always about how only bigots and deplorables could support him. The concerns powering Trump's rise were shooed away as small-minded. Well, Brexit and Trump are two black eyes. I really hope the Left tune in to the grievances of the majority now, because I'm fearful of what comes next if they don't.

lunula 10y ago
The left has almost no political power. It is also the popular majority. There are more registered democrats in the us than republicans. Clinton is likely to win the popular vote. The system is physically designed, by districting and the electoral college, to support the political minority. You are conflating the actual demographics with the electoral system, which is lending more power to an oppressive point of view that is precisely what the political elite cultivates.
- cft 10y ago
  Trump won the popular vote too.
  - fsck--off 10y ago
    Just because he's leading in the popular vote now doesn't mean he won the popular vote. The New York Times projects that Clinton will win the popular vote once all the ballots have been counted. http://www.nytimes.com/elections/forecast/president http://www.nytimes.com/elections/forecast/president
    - heneryville 10y ago
      Right now it's projecting a margin of 0.7% It's pretty hard to call that a mandate from a clear majority. I think we've got to accept that what we have is a deeply divided country, not a highly vocal minority.
      - Zach_the_Lizard 10y ago
        There are many people such as myself in places like NY or California that don't vote because we know our votes don't matter, so it may be that in a popular vote election we'd see a greater margin for Clinton.
        kbenson 10y ago
        I wonder what it would look like if you took the percentages that voted for each candidate and scaled it to the population of the state, and then used that to total the scaled popular vote? Of course, there's many problems with that, foremost being that you can't assume that those that didn't vote did so in the same relative percentages of support that those that did vote. For example, I imagine there's a higher percentage of Democrats/Clinton supporters in CA and NY that didn't vote compared to the alternatives, and the opposite is likely true of predominantly red states.
    - mibbiting 10y ago
      When will people learn that polls and "projections" from mainstream media etc are ridiculously wrong on this. They were wrong on Brexit. They were wrong on Trump. Maybe once more countries have results like this the polsters and media will start actually engaging with real people.
    - mason240 10y ago
      Of course they are, they have to spin it to get their base to believe they've been cheated. The results will come in eventually that she lost the popular vote, but that feeling they cultivated will remain.
      - 10y ago
  - beat 10y ago
    Given current tallies, Trump will probably lose the popular vote by over a million. And he won't break 300 in the Electoral College. This is a very, very narrow win.
    - wool_gather 10y ago
      100% (except for the "over a million" part). This is the third-closest result in the electoral college since 1960 (first that included AK and HI). The next two were G. W. Bush's two wins. It's the second-tightest in the popular vote since then (the results I see have Clinton ahead by about 200K; JFK beat Nixon by ~100K). Our most recent president, Obama, absolutely destroyed Trump's results as far as having a "mandate", if that's what winning is considered. He got twice as many electoral votes as McCain and a margin of 7% in the popular. The win over Romney was tighter but still in a different order than this election. Reagan got a mandate in 1984. The talk of "mandate" this year is utter, complete, uncontestable political horse puckey.
      - wool_gather 10y ago
        This is interesting, as an update: The Atlantic says that there's still almost 7 million votes outstanding as of Saturday the 12th. http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/11/clintons-popular-vote-lead-will-grow-and-grow/507455/ http://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/11/clintons... So maybe she will break a million delta.
        beat 10y ago
        A week later, we're at 1.7+M Hillary lead and still growing. That's huge, 3% now and maybe up to 5% in the end.
      - deleted 10y ago
        [deleted]
ZeroGravitas 10y ago
You've quoted the word deplorable, yet ignored the entire point of the statement that it came from, that it's not just bigots that are supporting Trump. How does that happen? You're on here emploring the left to pay attention to something, while (intentionally?) ignoring the fact that they did, and it got spun against them as one of their biggest gaffes of the campaign.
- wavefunction 10y ago
  That's not paying attention to the "basket of deplorables," it's dismissing them. This election has shown me how out of touch most Americans are with each other. The media doesn't care about whole swathes of the country and our political systems write off rural inhabitants all the time.
  - ZeroGravitas 10y ago
    Yes she's dismissing the basked of deplorables, it's the other voters who don't fit that description she's reaching out to: "And unfortunately there are people like that. And he has lifted them up. He has given voice to their websites that used to only have 11,000 people — now how 11 million. He tweets and retweets their offensive hateful mean-spirited rhetoric. Now, some of those folks — they are irredeemable, but thankfully they are not America. But the other basket — and I know this because I see friends from all over America here — I see friends from Florida and Georgia and South Carolina and Texas — as well as, you know, New York and California — but that other basket of people are people who feel that the government has let them down, the economy has let them down, nobody cares about them, nobody worries about what happens to their lives and their futures, and they’re just desperate for change. It doesn’t really even matter where it comes from. They don’t buy everything he says, but he seems to hold out some hope that their lives will be different. They won’t wake up and see their jobs disappear, lose a kid to heroine, feel like they’re in a dead-end. Those are people we have to understand and empathize with as well. "
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]

gph 10y ago

>You've been duped. True, but you could say that about nearly every politician that's been elected recently. At some point you have to vote for the person you agree with and just hope they will hold up at least some part of what they've promised.

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]

JakeAl 10y ago

>You've been duped. Not if you were simply voting against Hillary.

noobiemcfoob 10y ago

Many supporters might agree that Trump isn't the man for the job. But you really think Hillary can serve as a symbol of our culture? She's a integral part of the politically correct movement that Trump supporters hate. They weren't duped - they got what they ordered - but liberals might want to re-examine their mission statement.

noobiemcfoob 10y ago