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Or easier. Hillary is a face of western corruption to much of the world. So long as Trump delegates the tech stuff properly and doesn't do anything too unusual

Or easier. Hillary is a face of western corruption to much of the world. So long as Trump delegates the tech stuff properly and doesn't do anything too unusual the moral choice of the US should be easier.

onion2k 10y ago
Hillary is a face of western corruption to much of the world. That's not even slightly true here in the UK.
- lern_too_spel 10y ago
  The UK is part of the west. He's talking about the face of corruption from Russia's point of view.
  - johncolanduoni 10y ago
    Then that's a pretty bad argument that Trump's election will make software developers from "Europe, Australia, NZ, etc." more willing to come to the US.
  - Normal_gaussian 10y ago
    I'm not actually. It was a reference towards the belief of many but not most that most of the west is dominated by a special political class that strikes underhand and immoral deals which they justify through the claim that they were democratically elected despite not having been elected for anything resembling those actions (often completely ignoring things they were elected for) and despite the process through which they were elected not actually being 'completely' democratic. For these people Hillary and her ilk represent a local minima, and votes for her a stagnation or move away from actual democracy. The harm Trump will cause is indefinite and the claims that have been made are hard to substantiate, whilst he is obviously not an ideal POTUS it is not obvious that Hillary would be better.
    - lern_too_spel 10y ago
      Not obvious that Clinton would be better? It is certainly obvious to economists that taxing the increased economic welfare from trade and using it to help workers whose industries move is better than restricting trade. It is obvious to scientists that speeding up the movement from fossil fuels is better for managing Earth's climate than trying to bring back coal. It is obvious to criminologists that community policing is better for managing crime than stop and frisk and adversarial policing. It is obvious to sociologists that allowing gays to marry as they please increases their well-being and allowing women to control their pregnancies decreases poverty and crime. I can't find a single reason why Clinton would be worse.
- Sacho 10y ago
  A lot of people are making categorical statements about whole countries, on what I can only assume are their own experience. I'm surprised that after Brexit, you can still be this categorical about "the will of the people".
puranjay 10y ago
From what I've read about the man, Trump doesn't seem to be a micro manager, especially with things he can't understand like tech. Plus, it appears that Peter Thiel is going to be in some sort of advisory role. That's valuable insight
dguaraglia 10y ago
I don't know where you get your facts from, but the way the world sees the Clintons (whether corrupt or not) is as "expedient, better work with them, good things might come out of it." The way the world sees Trump is "what the fuck? This guy used to be a reality TV star in a program that didn't really make it outside of the US? What? He also says all this bizarre things?" If you thought American image around the world was at its lowest it could reach during GWB's presidency, oh boy you are in for a surprise.
thowar2 10y ago
Not true here in Asia. People love Obama and they see Hillary as an extension of his presidency. People are afraid of Trump. He reminds them of the corrupt, self interested, dictator types, which are rampant in this region.
janoc 10y ago
Not true here in France or most of Europe, for that matter. The only people happy about Trump is ultra-right wing/neo nazi panopticon of odd figures - Wilders, Le Pen, Farage, Orban ... Really the "crème de la crème" of Europe. And, of course, Putin. The rest is worried now - people are seriously questioning what happens, for example with NATO, after Trump's remarks on not unconditionally supporting the allies. Is Trump going to divide Europe between himself and Putin, e.g. in exchange for Syria? Is Putin going to have a free hand to invade Baltics now? What about Ukraine, Moldavia? Are we going to go back to the Iron Curtain era where Soviet "borders" were the ones with West Germany? These are serious issues which you don't feel on the other side of the Atlantic, but for us living there it is a big deal. What about business? Trump made some remarks about erecting trade barriers to protect American markets. So, of course, this concerns us too. On the other hand, the misogynist, racist, xenophobic BS he was producing during the last few months is mostly seen as disgusting, but finally mostly your internal problem. I am sure someone like Merkel is not going to be personally happy to have to sit next to him at some official function, but people do respect the result of the election and are professionals. GWB was not seen as the sharpest tool in the shed in Europe neither but everyone survived it. Clinton was seen as a continuation of the US policies, so naturally people would have preferred her - nobody likes to rock the boat too much when it comes to foreign policy or business. Trump is seen as unpredictable, unreadable and incompetent in this regard, unfortunately.
- Maarten88 10y ago
  > GWB was not seen as the sharpest tool in the shed in Europe neither but everyone survived it. In the EU. Lots of people in the middle east did not after he started a war there. As a European, I'm quite scared of what wars Trump will start / cause.
  - throwaway1892 10y ago
    As an European, I am less afraid of Trump than as the potential source/cause of wars. Time will tell if I am right or wrong.
- cs02rm0 10y ago
pavlov 10y ago
Hillary is a face of western corruption to much of the world. No, to 99% of the rest of the world she's just a former Secretary of State and the wife of a former president whose era is often viewed through a nostalgic lens compared to current turmoil. Fox News doesn't broadcast outside USA, you know.
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
- Normal_gaussian 10y ago
  I'm not from or in the USA, you know.
threatofrain 10y ago
No ruler manages bureaucracy alone. Trump will have to bring in classical Washington. We'd like to think that Trump will perform a full-on house cleaning, sourcing principally from his business connections, but the reality is that everyone needs classical Washington because each person you bring on is a king of his little fiefdom in the NSA, CIA, FBI, armed forces, etc.

onion2k 10y ago

Hillary is a face of western corruption to much of the world. That's not even slightly true here in the UK.

lern_too_spel 10y ago
The UK is part of the west. He's talking about the face of corruption from Russia's point of view.
- johncolanduoni 10y ago
  Then that's a pretty bad argument that Trump's election will make software developers from "Europe, Australia, NZ, etc." more willing to come to the US.
- Normal_gaussian 10y ago
  I'm not actually. It was a reference towards the belief of many but not most that most of the west is dominated by a special political class that strikes underhand and immoral deals which they justify through the claim that they were democratically elected despite not having been elected for anything resembling those actions (often completely ignoring things they were elected for) and despite the process through which they were elected not actually being 'completely' democratic. For these people Hillary and her ilk represent a local minima, and votes for her a stagnation or move away from actual democracy. The harm Trump will cause is indefinite and the claims that have been made are hard to substantiate, whilst he is obviously not an ideal POTUS it is not obvious that Hillary would be better.
  - lern_too_spel 10y ago
    Not obvious that Clinton would be better? It is certainly obvious to economists that taxing the increased economic welfare from trade and using it to help workers whose industries move is better than restricting trade. It is obvious to scientists that speeding up the movement from fossil fuels is better for managing Earth's climate than trying to bring back coal. It is obvious to criminologists that community policing is better for managing crime than stop and frisk and adversarial policing. It is obvious to sociologists that allowing gays to marry as they please increases their well-being and allowing women to control their pregnancies decreases poverty and crime. I can't find a single reason why Clinton would be worse.
Sacho 10y ago
A lot of people are making categorical statements about whole countries, on what I can only assume are their own experience. I'm surprised that after Brexit, you can still be this categorical about "the will of the people".

puranjay 10y ago

From what I've read about the man, Trump doesn't seem to be a micro manager, especially with things he can't understand like tech. Plus, it appears that Peter Thiel is going to be in some sort of advisory role. That's valuable insight

dguaraglia 10y ago

I don't know where you get your facts from, but the way the world sees the Clintons (whether corrupt or not) is as "expedient, better work with them, good things might come out of it." The way the world sees Trump is "what the fuck? This guy used to be a reality TV star in a program that didn't really make it outside of the US? What? He also says all this bizarre things?" If you thought American image around the world was at its lowest it could reach during GWB's presidency, oh boy you are in for a surprise.

thowar2 10y ago

Not true here in Asia. People love Obama and they see Hillary as an extension of his presidency. People are afraid of Trump. He reminds them of the corrupt, self interested, dictator types, which are rampant in this region.

janoc 10y ago

Not true here in France or most of Europe, for that matter. The only people happy about Trump is ultra-right wing/neo nazi panopticon of odd figures - Wilders, Le Pen, Farage, Orban ... Really the "crème de la crème" of Europe. And, of course, Putin. The rest is worried now - people are seriously questioning what happens, for example with NATO, after Trump's remarks on not unconditionally supporting the allies. Is Trump going to divide Europe between himself and Putin, e.g. in exchange for Syria? Is Putin going to have a free hand to invade Baltics now? What about Ukraine, Moldavia? Are we going to go back to the Iron Curtain era where Soviet "borders" were the ones with West Germany? These are serious issues which you don't feel on the other side of the Atlantic, but for us living there it is a big deal. What about business? Trump made some remarks about erecting trade barriers to protect American markets. So, of course, this concerns us too. On the other hand, the misogynist, racist, xenophobic BS he was producing during the last few months is mostly seen as disgusting, but finally mostly your internal problem. I am sure someone like Merkel is not going to be personally happy to have to sit next to him at some official function, but people do respect the result of the election and are professionals. GWB was not seen as the sharpest tool in the shed in Europe neither but everyone survived it. Clinton was seen as a continuation of the US policies, so naturally people would have preferred her - nobody likes to rock the boat too much when it comes to foreign policy or business. Trump is seen as unpredictable, unreadable and incompetent in this regard, unfortunately.

Maarten88 10y ago
> GWB was not seen as the sharpest tool in the shed in Europe neither but everyone survived it. In the EU. Lots of people in the middle east did not after he started a war there. As a European, I'm quite scared of what wars Trump will start / cause.
- throwaway1892 10y ago
  As an European, I am less afraid of Trump than as the potential source/cause of wars. Time will tell if I am right or wrong.
cs02rm0 10y ago

pavlov 10y ago

Hillary is a face of western corruption to much of the world. No, to 99% of the rest of the world she's just a former Secretary of State and the wife of a former president whose era is often viewed through a nostalgic lens compared to current turmoil. Fox News doesn't broadcast outside USA, you know.

deleted 10y ago
[deleted]
Normal_gaussian 10y ago
I'm not from or in the USA, you know.

threatofrain 10y ago

No ruler manages bureaucracy alone. Trump will have to bring in classical Washington. We'd like to think that Trump will perform a full-on house cleaning, sourcing principally from his business connections, but the reality is that everyone needs classical Washington because each person you bring on is a king of his little fiefdom in the NSA, CIA, FBI, armed forces, etc.