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I tried to Google article I want to show, but I'm not able to find it, so I used first link with keywords similar to what I expected to find. I read linked arti

by lisivka 10y ago

I tried to Google article I want to show, but I'm not able to find it, so I used first link with keywords similar to what I expected to find. I read linked articles and they are crap, so let dismiss this paper. Sorry. Article, I looking for, is about experiment conducted using Sagnac interferometer for more than year to detect deviations of predicted Sagnac effect, from Earth rotation, during year, from actual measurement. They tried to account everything they know and still had small anisotropic variations across year. I'm not able to find that article, so I will try to use LIGO observation of gravitational wave as argument. Can you accept, after confirming of gravitational waves, that there is field, called „gravitational field“, which affects speed of light, at least temporary? PS. It's looks like we cannot continue discussion because of larger delays between posts, so just thanks you for your replies — they were helpful. I will try to prepare better for next time.

acqq 10y ago
Thank you too for answering my questions. And to answer your last: You can imagine that what is measured with LIGO is the change of the space itself as the wave hits the detector. The speed of light remains constant. But please let's not discuss it more in this thread, I also prefer continuing somewhere else on some other occasion.
- lisivka 10y ago
  I found papers: they are calibration results of LIGO detectors. I read them years ago, so I forget anything except that they found systematic temporal variations across day and year, and they are using long 2km arms. Their latest paper: https://arxiv.org/pdf/1608.05134v1.pdf https://arxiv.org/pdf/1608.05134v1.pdf . Systematic error is still there. Speed of light will remain constant, no doubt, so observer need to be far away to feel difference, otherwise it will be affected by wave, with his instruments and clock. It's why 2-4km arms are able to pickup temporal signal, while smaller setups are able to pickup thermal noise only. PS. Not sure that I will survive for so long, because of war with Russia — next week will be hard for me. :-)
  - acqq 10y ago
    It's a LIGO paper that you link now but it doesn't support any of your old claims, sorry. I still have an impression that you don't understand the physics, especially as you claimed before the "variable speed of light," it looks that you throw around something you remembered but never understood. So I'm more interested what's that "war with Russia"? Why next week? Is there a new conscription wave in Ukraine going on? I thought this was the latest state, only professionals: http://www.worldbulletin.net/world/179487/ukraine-removes-last-conscripts-from-war-zone http://www.worldbulletin.net/world/179487/ukraine-removes-la...
    - lisivka 10y ago
      English language is foreign for me and physics is my hobby, so you can safely assume that I'm noob in physics and use plain English and simple explanations. I need much more time to read in English that in my native language, especially in areas I'm not familiar with. I cannot just look at page and understand it, like in my native language. Yep, it was not LIGO. LIGO uses Michelson inteferometer, while I'm looking for Sagnac interferometer results. As far as I remember, I started with that article: https://arxiv.org/pdf/gr-qc/0401005v3.pdf https://arxiv.org/pdf/gr-qc/0401005v3.pdf , then started searching of articles about rotation sensing mentioned in the article. It looks like that it: http://porto.polito.it/2460498/1/G_GranSasso_18.pdf http://porto.polito.it/2460498/1/G_GranSasso_18.pdf (or a newer paper). I looked at FIG. 10: The rotation rate of the Earth measured with the G ring laser as a function of time. Averaging over 2 hours was applied to a corrected dataset, where all known geophysical signals have been removed But their measurements were done with up to 1E-11 accuracy, which is just not enough, because (IMHO) signal will be 10-100x weaker than gravitational wave, so, IMHO, 1E-21 accuracy is required. So my comment, which started that discussion, is just wrong. :-( About war: war is still here. We are switched to professional army (hence no new conscription) and situation is stable enough (1-7 killed, 3-15 injured every day). Crimea is still captured. Next week will be hard because I will have meeting with my killers. But, after 2 month of preparation, I forgot about one small but important detail, so I am basically unprepared now. Unfortunately, I cannot stop my play because I want to free Crimea next year, and lot of people are already involved, and contact with Russians is important in this case, so I will try to improvise, like before, when I was unprepared. I will delete that text tomorrow.

by lisivka 10y ago

acqq 10y ago

Thank you too for answering my questions. And to answer your last: You can imagine that what is measured with LIGO is the change of the space itself as the wave hits the detector. The speed of light remains constant. But please let's not discuss it more in this thread, I also prefer continuing somewhere else on some other occasion.

lisivka 10y ago
I found papers: they are calibration results of LIGO detectors. I read them years ago, so I forget anything except that they found systematic temporal variations across day and year, and they are using long 2km arms. Their latest paper: https://arxiv.org/pdf/1608.05134v1.pdf https://arxiv.org/pdf/1608.05134v1.pdf . Systematic error is still there. Speed of light will remain constant, no doubt, so observer need to be far away to feel difference, otherwise it will be affected by wave, with his instruments and clock. It's why 2-4km arms are able to pickup temporal signal, while smaller setups are able to pickup thermal noise only. PS. Not sure that I will survive for so long, because of war with Russia — next week will be hard for me. :-)
- acqq 10y ago
  It's a LIGO paper that you link now but it doesn't support any of your old claims, sorry. I still have an impression that you don't understand the physics, especially as you claimed before the "variable speed of light," it looks that you throw around something you remembered but never understood. So I'm more interested what's that "war with Russia"? Why next week? Is there a new conscription wave in Ukraine going on? I thought this was the latest state, only professionals: http://www.worldbulletin.net/world/179487/ukraine-removes-last-conscripts-from-war-zone http://www.worldbulletin.net/world/179487/ukraine-removes-la...
  - lisivka 10y ago
    English language is foreign for me and physics is my hobby, so you can safely assume that I'm noob in physics and use plain English and simple explanations. I need much more time to read in English that in my native language, especially in areas I'm not familiar with. I cannot just look at page and understand it, like in my native language. Yep, it was not LIGO. LIGO uses Michelson inteferometer, while I'm looking for Sagnac interferometer results. As far as I remember, I started with that article: https://arxiv.org/pdf/gr-qc/0401005v3.pdf https://arxiv.org/pdf/gr-qc/0401005v3.pdf , then started searching of articles about rotation sensing mentioned in the article. It looks like that it: http://porto.polito.it/2460498/1/G_GranSasso_18.pdf http://porto.polito.it/2460498/1/G_GranSasso_18.pdf (or a newer paper). I looked at FIG. 10: The rotation rate of the Earth measured with the G ring laser as a function of time. Averaging over 2 hours was applied to a corrected dataset, where all known geophysical signals have been removed But their measurements were done with up to 1E-11 accuracy, which is just not enough, because (IMHO) signal will be 10-100x weaker than gravitational wave, so, IMHO, 1E-21 accuracy is required. So my comment, which started that discussion, is just wrong. :-( About war: war is still here. We are switched to professional army (hence no new conscription) and situation is stable enough (1-7 killed, 3-15 injured every day). Crimea is still captured. Next week will be hard because I will have meeting with my killers. But, after 2 month of preparation, I forgot about one small but important detail, so I am basically unprepared now. Unfortunately, I cannot stop my play because I want to free Crimea next year, and lot of people are already involved, and contact with Russians is important in this case, so I will try to improvise, like before, when I was unprepared. I will delete that text tomorrow.