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>Alternatively: my possessions, hobbies, tools are extensions of my real self. I do not NEED them, but I am more actualized when I have them. Do you identify yo
by hosh 10y ago
>Alternatively: my possessions, hobbies, tools are extensions of my real self. I do not NEED them, but I am more actualized when I have them. Do you identify yourself as a software engineer? Do you continue to be one when someone takes your access to all computers away? The computer actualizes part of how you identify yourself. It is hard to think of yourself as a mechanic when you have no ability to act on your talents or skills because of a lack of tools.
You are confusing your actualization with your identity. What you think of as your "real self" isn't. What you are saying here is the mainstream view of what someone's authentic self is. If you and I make a bet to talk to 100 random strangers in an arbitrary city, likely, all of those 100 people will agree with you and not with me. That's fine with with me.
I do not identify myself as a software engineer. Software engineering is a skill I have (for now), and it is a role I adopt. It is a profession I presently have. But this is not me. Skills fade, roles will retire, professions will disappear. I remain. When the time comes, the time comes. That time will come for you as well as everyone else.
This is something that meditators and mystics have been saying consistently for a while. I am not the first to say this and I won't be the last. This is something discovered anew for each person that dives into it. Not everyone is exploring this and I don't expect people to. This does not have anything to do with knowledge, authority, or judgement. People are more impulsive than they think they are, and so long as someone is owned their possessions, socialization, and thought patterns, that person is not acting freely.
Stripped of all your possessions, socializations, and thought patterns is something far more amazing. This doesn't have to do with what "I want", but has to do with your natural self.
No one is making you strip yourself of possessions, socializations, or thought patterns right now, or ever. You are welcomed to think like this and act like you are, and neither require mine's or anyone else's judgement or approval.
- dwaltrip 10y agoDo you believe in materialism? If so, how can the self be anything but the collection of patterns, behaviors, and memories, as seen at a particular moment, that, starting with the initial genetics, have accumulated thus far during a person's life? Through continual interaction with the universe, the accumulation (the "self") constantly changes, as each moment passes by. Occasionally, these changes result in new behaviors that others might describe as "becoming a new person" -- this does not mean that some hidden potential self was finally activated. If you are speaking highly metaphorically, then that is a different matter, of course.
- hosh 10y agoThanks for bringing this up. Rational materialism is a powerful frame, but it is not complete in and of itself. "How can the self be anything but the collection of patterns, behaviors and memories" -- all those things, patterns, behaviors, and memories arises, and will eventually passes. Only awareness remains. You can test this empirically for yourself (though not necessarily for other people). It isn't that there is a hidden potential self is finally activated. That true self was already present before the conditioning started, and is still present. I am not speaking metaphorically.
- dwaltrip 10y agoThanks for the response. As someone who generally relies on a materialistic framework, I can't fathom where this true self resides or is coming from, but it is interesting to read about.