4 ms·

You (and Soylent) have absolutely no idea whether that's true. Which is the problem.

by TillE 10y ago

ng12 10y ago
I believe Soylent has a pretty good idea. They know what changed in their formula, they know the difference between the products receiving complaints and the products not, and they have evidence from other companies (Honey Stinger) who had similar issues.
- dzhiurgis 10y ago
  I wonder if they run any sort of A/B testing. Wouldn't harm if they sent few packages with one ingredient missing once in a while, then see what's the response.
  - DashRattlesnake 10y ago
    > I wonder if they run any sort of A/B testing. Wouldn't harm if they sent few packages with one ingredient missing once in a while, then see what's the response. The idea of using A/B testing for food safety testing is horrifying.
    - dzhiurgis 10y ago
      Why? Do you actually think anything bad will happen if you ate for a month sans one micronutrient will permanently damage you?
baddox 10y ago
How might they acquire that knowledge, other than through the process they seem to currently be executing?
- Alupis 10y ago
  > How might they acquire that knowledge, other than through the process they seem to currently be executing? Well, a lot of folks would like to see a bit more care paid attention to the entire process. This isn't the first time Soylent has shipped potentially dangerous product. Not long ago, they shipped their new bottled formula to folks, and it arrived covered in mold! Their snack bars have made people violently ill, and now their powder too. Every product Soylent makes, is making or has made people ill. Soylent has practically zero quality control/testing, and doesn't have on-site staff dedicated to ensuring their product is safe. They send out a few carefully selected samples to an external lab, but that's far from continuous testing of the product rolling off the line. Some might attribute it to the "silicon valley" mindset Soylent has. "We'll disrupt the food industry - but we won't bother to learn what it takes to produce uniformly clean and safe product". There's good reasons the "big guys" spend so much on lab personnel and equipment. If people all around the world started getting sick from Coca-Cola, it wouldn't be good - to say the least. Edit - Adding sources: [1] http://motherboard.vice.com/read/soylent-20-shipments-were-delayed-due-to-mold http://motherboard.vice.com/read/soylent-20-shipments-were-d... [2] http://arstechnica.com/science/2016/10/reports-of-violent-vomiting-diarrhea-from-bars-has-soylent-on-the-defense/ http://arstechnica.com/science/2016/10/reports-of-violent-vo... [3] http://www.latimes.com/business/technology/la-fi-tn-soylent-recall-20161027-story.html http://www.latimes.com/business/technology/la-fi-tn-soylent-... [4] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12812730 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12812730 [5] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8NCigh54jg&feature=youtu.be&t=5m50s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8NCigh54jg&feature=youtu.be...
  - ng12 10y ago
    Do you have sources? I was of the opinion that all of this stuff is heavily regulated by the FDA. What makes you think Soylent really criminally negligent, or at least any more so than any other food manufacturer? FWIW, the ingredient in question is "generally recognized as safe" by the FDA: http://investors.terravia.com/releasedetail.cfm?releaseid=891472 http://investors.terravia.com/releasedetail.cfm?releaseid=89...
    - Alupis 10y ago
      Soylent is classified as a nutritional supplement, which isn't the same as "food". It's the same umbrella things like body-building supplements enjoy being under, with far more relaxed requirements than "food". Sources are well known, a quick search turns them up[1][2][3]. The testing procedure has been disclosed by Soylent during their last debacle, and there was discussion here on HN[3][4]. I used to buy Soylent myself, started at version 1.5 (powder in the bag). But come on, this sort of thing is seriously not OK. You need better quality control, and you need better (and more rapid) testing of product as it rolls off the line. Hunt and pecking clearly isn't getting it done, and problems are slipping out under their noses. It's people's health - nothing to joke at. "Move fast; make people sick" isn't a good mantra. > FWIW, the ingredient in question is "generally recognized as safe" by the FDA Soylent has no real idea if that ingredient was the culprit (and from the FDA's classification, it seems reasonable to suspect that ingredient is not the problem). For all anyone knows, it could be a combination of ingredients, or not an ingredient at all, but rather contamination in the manufacturing process. [1] http://motherboard.vice.com/read/soylent-20-shipments-were-delayed-due-to-mold http://motherboard.vice.com/read/soylent-20-shipments-were-d... [2] http://arstechnica.com/science/2016/10/reports-of-violent-vomiting-diarrhea-from-bars-has-soylent-on-the-defense/ http://arstechnica.com/science/2016/10/reports-of-violent-vo... [3] http://www.latimes.com/business/technology/la-fi-tn-soylent-recall-20161027-story.html http://www.latimes.com/business/technology/la-fi-tn-soylent-... [4] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12812730 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12812730 [5] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8NCigh54jg&feature=youtu.be&t=5m50s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8NCigh54jg&feature=youtu.be...

You (and Soylent) have absolutely no idea whether that's true. Which is the problem.

by TillE 10y ago

You (and Soylent) have absolutely no idea whether that's true. Which is the problem.

ng12 10y ago

I believe Soylent has a pretty good idea. They know what changed in their formula, they know the difference between the products receiving complaints and the products not, and they have evidence from other companies (Honey Stinger) who had similar issues.

dzhiurgis 10y ago
I wonder if they run any sort of A/B testing. Wouldn't harm if they sent few packages with one ingredient missing once in a while, then see what's the response.
- DashRattlesnake 10y ago
  > I wonder if they run any sort of A/B testing. Wouldn't harm if they sent few packages with one ingredient missing once in a while, then see what's the response. The idea of using A/B testing for food safety testing is horrifying.
  - dzhiurgis 10y ago
    Why? Do you actually think anything bad will happen if you ate for a month sans one micronutrient will permanently damage you?

baddox 10y ago

How might they acquire that knowledge, other than through the process they seem to currently be executing?

Alupis 10y ago
> How might they acquire that knowledge, other than through the process they seem to currently be executing? Well, a lot of folks would like to see a bit more care paid attention to the entire process. This isn't the first time Soylent has shipped potentially dangerous product. Not long ago, they shipped their new bottled formula to folks, and it arrived covered in mold! Their snack bars have made people violently ill, and now their powder too. Every product Soylent makes, is making or has made people ill. Soylent has practically zero quality control/testing, and doesn't have on-site staff dedicated to ensuring their product is safe. They send out a few carefully selected samples to an external lab, but that's far from continuous testing of the product rolling off the line. Some might attribute it to the "silicon valley" mindset Soylent has. "We'll disrupt the food industry - but we won't bother to learn what it takes to produce uniformly clean and safe product". There's good reasons the "big guys" spend so much on lab personnel and equipment. If people all around the world started getting sick from Coca-Cola, it wouldn't be good - to say the least. Edit - Adding sources: [1] http://motherboard.vice.com/read/soylent-20-shipments-were-delayed-due-to-mold http://motherboard.vice.com/read/soylent-20-shipments-were-d... [2] http://arstechnica.com/science/2016/10/reports-of-violent-vomiting-diarrhea-from-bars-has-soylent-on-the-defense/ http://arstechnica.com/science/2016/10/reports-of-violent-vo... [3] http://www.latimes.com/business/technology/la-fi-tn-soylent-recall-20161027-story.html http://www.latimes.com/business/technology/la-fi-tn-soylent-... [4] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12812730 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12812730 [5] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8NCigh54jg&feature=youtu.be&t=5m50s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8NCigh54jg&feature=youtu.be...
- ng12 10y ago
  Do you have sources? I was of the opinion that all of this stuff is heavily regulated by the FDA. What makes you think Soylent really criminally negligent, or at least any more so than any other food manufacturer? FWIW, the ingredient in question is "generally recognized as safe" by the FDA: http://investors.terravia.com/releasedetail.cfm?releaseid=891472 http://investors.terravia.com/releasedetail.cfm?releaseid=89...
  - Alupis 10y ago
    Soylent is classified as a nutritional supplement, which isn't the same as "food". It's the same umbrella things like body-building supplements enjoy being under, with far more relaxed requirements than "food". Sources are well known, a quick search turns them up[1][2][3]. The testing procedure has been disclosed by Soylent during their last debacle, and there was discussion here on HN[3][4]. I used to buy Soylent myself, started at version 1.5 (powder in the bag). But come on, this sort of thing is seriously not OK. You need better quality control, and you need better (and more rapid) testing of product as it rolls off the line. Hunt and pecking clearly isn't getting it done, and problems are slipping out under their noses. It's people's health - nothing to joke at. "Move fast; make people sick" isn't a good mantra. > FWIW, the ingredient in question is "generally recognized as safe" by the FDA Soylent has no real idea if that ingredient was the culprit (and from the FDA's classification, it seems reasonable to suspect that ingredient is not the problem). For all anyone knows, it could be a combination of ingredients, or not an ingredient at all, but rather contamination in the manufacturing process. [1] http://motherboard.vice.com/read/soylent-20-shipments-were-delayed-due-to-mold http://motherboard.vice.com/read/soylent-20-shipments-were-d... [2] http://arstechnica.com/science/2016/10/reports-of-violent-vomiting-diarrhea-from-bars-has-soylent-on-the-defense/ http://arstechnica.com/science/2016/10/reports-of-violent-vo... [3] http://www.latimes.com/business/technology/la-fi-tn-soylent-recall-20161027-story.html http://www.latimes.com/business/technology/la-fi-tn-soylent-... [4] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12812730 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=12812730 [5] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8NCigh54jg&feature=youtu.be&t=5m50s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8NCigh54jg&feature=youtu.be...