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I believe Magic Leap has a new kind of display technology, but the article is pretty bullshit-sounding with statements like this: "Throw out your PC, your lapt
by spyder 10y ago
I believe Magic Leap has a new kind of display technology, but the article is pretty bullshit-sounding with statements like this:
"Throw out your PC, your laptop and your mobile phone, because the computing power you need will be in your glasses, and they can make a display appear anywhere, at any size you like."
Yeah sure, they not only made a new display tech but integrated the computing power of desktops or laptops into glasses. I wonder how they cool the GTX 1080 cards on your head...
- BatFastard 10y agoI had the same thoughts, but if its true! But might was well stay hopeful for as long as possible. Problem is that would require at least two huge leaps in technology one in display technology and one in compact computing power, probably more.
- ajmarsh 10y agoI assume the GTX 1080 lives in the cloud. We shall see I guess.
- simonebrunozzi 10y agoCan't. The bandwidth wouldn't be enough.
- jerf 10y agoBandwidth is not the problem, latency is. Bandwidth can be fixed by throwing more bandwidth at the problem. Cloud gaming has not done all that well; it's right at the edge of feasibility due to latency. VR moves it back off the edge to "unquestionably infeasible". If VR gaming were to take off and become a dominant paradigm it would make cloud gaming even harder to justify.
- Bartweiss 10y agoGaming and banking/trading are definitely the informative projects here. Pseudo-real-time gaming is possible, but only for regional servers. Live global gaming is off the table permanently unless known physics changes; speed of light delays are larger than human reaction times. Right now, the best we can do is predictive techniques and continental servers, which have barely enabled MMO shooters. VR gaming worsens the problem - 80ms delays in VR are nauseating and game-ruining. Global latency isn't a solvable problem via money or devotion.
- flukus 10y ago> Bandwidth is not the problem, latency is. Bandwidth can be fixed by throwing more bandwidth at the problem. There is a limited useful spectrum that's shared between everyone in the area. You can't just throw more bandwidth at the problem.
- jerf 10y agoYou sound like you think wireless is the only option...? All my consoles are wired. Anything that was doing cloud gaming would take an ethernet port unless the manufacturer is just an idiot. It might work with wireless but it would recommend wired.
- deckard1 10y agoI had to look it up, but it appears OnLive was shut down in 2015 and patents sold off to Sony. I was completely skeptical at their claims with respect to latency. I never believed they could get the service to work, and for enough people to make it profitable. It appears quite a few people were able to enjoy the service at decent enough framerates. Which is surprising.
- pault 10y agoI used onlive for a year or so and really enjoyed it. There were some issues, but even the multiplayer FPSs were playable. Most of the time I was playing single player games that were less twitchy, and if you had done a blind test I probably wouldn't have been able to tell you if it was running locally or not.
- dkersten 10y agoI recently tried the PS4's remote play functionality. My friend in another city was able to play my bloodborne, which is a very timing-sensitive game, perfectly fine. A few weeks ago my cousin ran games at 1080p on an EC2 GPU instance and used Steam's In-Home Streaming to play remotely and it worked perfectly fine. I think the latency is now there, if you have a fast connection and live relatively close to the datacenter.
- VanillaCafe 10y agoLatency is also critical for VR and AR
- Bartweiss 10y agoLatency is critical-path for VR not just in existing solutions, but fundamentally. Speed-of-light delays are sufficient to cripple remote-processing approaches to VR, so we won't see cloud solutions unless we're wrong about the fundamentals of relativity.
- VanillaCafe 10y agoI wouldn't rule it out completely, though. There is some opportunity to mitigate latency, such as performing the heavy lifting remotely with local transformations on a simplified description of the scene to account for head movement and the like. It would certainly be a much more complex solution that would still have inferior results compared to computing everything locally (just like cloud streaming now). Just that it's not "change the laws of physics" impossible to get to a workable implementation. See also John Carmack's comments from 2013 on latency mitigation: https://web.archive.org/web/20140719053303/http://www.altdev.co/2013/02/22/latency-mitigation-strategies/ https://web.archive.org/web/20140719053303/http://www.altdev...
- doczoidberg 10y agocritical but not impossible to fix. I can't find it but Microsoft published a video some time ago to realize cheap VR/AR headsets which do rendering in the cloud
- filoeleven 10y agoA previous article (possibly from over a year ago) said that the computing power and battery come from a cell-phone-sized device that you keep in a pocket and attach to the glasses via fiber.
- pkulak 10y agoUncompressed 8K over the public internet!
- jobigoud 10y agoWhy uncompressed? Recent mobile devices have hardware video decoding.
- striking 10y agoThere are plenty of devices without HEVC hardware decode, though, which is basically a prerequisite to 4K. And software decoding is god-awful for anything besides South Park. (It's not actually required, but the efficiency loss between H.264 and HEVC for 4K is pretty massive.)
- danpalmer 10y agoSupposedly, because it's only rendering a small portion of your field of view at any given time, the compute resource required to power it is substantially less. I seem to also remember reading about it not using a standard pixel-filling kind of rendering, and using something else that requires less power instead.
- russdill 10y agoThey've been doing this for how many years? And sinking how much money into content development? How about developing an actual product?
- BatFastard 10y agoIsn't this what you dream of as a developer, the budget to do things right? Rather then pushing a demo into an actual commercial product?
- awesomerobot 10y agoYes and no, you want to have a ton of time tinkering in a lab and the room to experiment and fail... but who would know Edison if he didn't eventually ship the lightbulb? Also considering how litigious/secretive things are — it must suck to work on something for so long and be contractually obligated to avoid talking about it in public.
- pault 10y agoHow long was the iphone in development?
- awesomerobot 10y agoAbout 5 years, but in working for Apple you worked for a company that still shipped other products.
- drzaiusapelord 10y agoUploadvr demystified this stuff a couple years ago: http://uploadvr.com/magic-leap-how-it-works/ http://uploadvr.com/magic-leap-how-it-works/ Magic leap is a pair of glasses you wear on your face that displays AR imagery through a clear glass lens. There's a cable leading from these glasses to your pocket where you have a tablet-size device doing all the heavy lifting, most likely using mobile SoC's. Pretty sure you can't run a desktop CPU and GPU on a pocketable device. You don't get 1080gtx performance or anything remotely close to that with a setup like this. Its mobile-level graphics. Oculus's recent showing of its mobile SoC-based Santa Cruz prototype shows fairly poor graphics compared to PC-based VR like the Rift or Vive. I imagine the Magic Leap has less pixels to push considering it isn't doing any backgrounds, but still, those very impressive marketing shots of high resolution dragons flying around and interacting with you might not really be possible without a lot of compromises on graphic quality, fov, framerate, etc. Worse, no one wants to talk about transparency, especially in well-lit rooms. The few hands-on Hololens reports we've gotten make this out to be a big issue, as well as fov, and fundamentally the Magic Leap and what hololens is using could be the same or very similar technologies. My gut feeling is that no one has yet to handle the transparency issue (and this is why MS can show off the hololens with confidence) and because of that it makes sense for Magic Leap to keep its product secretive. The tech press was not too kind to Hololens prototypes due to transparecy issues and Magic Leap doesn't need that kind of negative press as it continues to fund-raise and develop its product.
- neuronexmachina 10y agoHow many years will it be until Pascal-like performance is available in a tablet form-factor?
- drzaiusapelord 10y agoMaybe never. Pascal is 16nm process and the mid-range gaming card, the 1070, uses up to 150 watts. A "powerful" mobile chipset uses a tiny fraction of that even at its highest settings. 100 watts for the CPU and another 150watts for the GPU is a staggering 250watts of continuous power no pocket-able lithium-ion battery can handle. If we want current gen graphics we're more than likely looking at a PC backpack solution. More than likely we'll probably be looking at some low watt solution, like the 35W AMD chipset in the Solus Q and accept a lower level of graphic quality, but still well above mobile standards. This may involve wearing a battery belt or battery hip-pouch for extended use. For lower run times the battery can be part of the headstrap with no need for anything to be pocketable.
- XorNot 10y agoI question how much resolution they have. How is the text rendering?
- cma 10y agoTheir initial design was a fiber projector that oscillated in a spiral pattern with something like 512 rings (I can't remember the exact number). Along the the spiral you can have any resolution, only limited by how fast you can modulate the laser. Details along the spiral would be sharp, anything along the normal (spokes radiating inwards) would be only have 1024 distinct levels of detail. But their later patents showed whole arrays of these fiber projectors. They are probably limited by the optics in-between the fiber and the eye and by the display controller bandwidth more than anything.
- nickthemagicman 10y agoMagic! Its in the name duh!
- pault 10y agoTo be fair, if the tracking and resolution is first-in-class, there are a billion business applications that won't require major graphics horsepower. I'm going to buy a vive soon to play around with virtual desktop, but I don't have high hopes for it since I know the resolution isn't there yet. If they can come up with something light weight and high resolution that lets me see the rest of my environment I'm all in.
- jm4 10y agoDon't buy the Vive for virtual desktop unless you don't care about your money. I have the Vive and it's awesome for games. Virtual desktop is cool too, but it's not something you want to use for any length of time. It's like looking at your phone stretched out on a 50 foot screen. VR videos are about the only use. Anything else is maybe just a glimpse into the future. The resolution is too low right now.
- BHSPitMonkey 10y agoHave you tried adjusting your supersampling settings?
- TwoBit 10y agoWell the Oculus Rift VR quality is better than Vive and it has a lot better apps, so I wouldn't conclude about VR based on the Vive.
- pault 10y agoDon't they have the same resolution?
- pault 10y agoI actually want it for gaming but I'm pretending it's for work. ;)
- schnelle 10y agoGot my Vive last week. The other thing you don't realize is because of the lenses, the edges of your vision are blurry. So, you can't scan with your eyes like a regular monitor. I too wanted a virtual monitor and it's just not there yet.