4 ms·

Sorry, but this is wrong. "less battery is possible without less battery runtime" -> doesn't work with CPU bound software like Hangouts or external appliances

Sorry, but this is wrong. "less battery is possible without less battery runtime" -> doesn't work with CPU bound software like Hangouts or external appliances that need to be powered. Fact is the battery is much smaller. - Better display: granted - Better sound: Nope, there's no substitute for bass response, all of which gets better the larger the speaker and enclosure is - Lighter: Yes. This is a professional's priority number 2749 though. - Structural engineering: It's half as thin. If you know mechanics, you'd need a material double as tough in order to make up for the loss in structural stability. Not gonna happen, maybe their most recent super duper aluminum alloy is 20-30% tougher. Overall, a thinner structure is ALWAYS more brittle. All in all, OP is completely right: This simply isn't a professional machine.

matthewmacleod 10y ago
This simply isn't a professional machine. It's far from clear that this is 'simple'.
dpark 10y ago
> Lighter: Yes. This is a professional's priority number 2749 though. I use my laptop in a professional capacity and weight is a huge factor for me. I carry my laptop everywhere. Incremental yearly changes in weight have generally not been that impressive but in aggregate the difference is huge. Go pick up a 10-year-old laptop and you'll probably agree. > Structural engineering: It's half as thin. If you know mechanics, you'd need a material double as tough in order to make up for the loss in structural stability. I'm no mechanical engineer, but I don't believe that's correct. There are a number of factors that impact the structural stability of an item. The internal structure has a huge impact, which is why I-beams exist. It's also not as if the space saved is the result of just milling out half of the original aluminum. The actual metal case is probably the same thickness or close.
- blackoil 10y ago
  most developer(few thousand) in my company and most other I know of work for hours on desk in stretch, attend few meetings within office, use it some more in commute, back at home work/play some more on desk/bed. Once in few months travel to client/remote office/conference where they have to carry it for stretch. I expect same pattern from graphic/app designers, animators, video editor and PROfessionals in general. Sure marketing, consultant and similar profile move a lot but they don't need a pro level performance. So a lightweight/reasonable performance Macbook line and a little heavier/high performance Macbook Pro makes so much more sense.
  - dpark 10y ago
    You're describing people who are picking up and carrying their laptops multiple times per day and carry it back and forth to work and home every day. These people seem like the target market for a lightweight laptop.
    - anon12345690 10y ago
      The scenarios you describe are not that bad. People are just fine carrying a few pounds around.
    - blackoil 10y ago
      carrying but not for long, never seen a programmer wary of to carry their current Macbook Pro few floors down the lift and then walk to meeting room. If you start feeling the weight for this little, problem is not your laptop. And, I am all for lightweight if that does not include compromise in battery life and performance.
      - dpark 10y ago
        I don't think I said that people have trouble carrying their laptops. No one really had trouble carrying 10 lb laptops either but it's quite a bit nicer to carry a modern lighter laptop. Forever people have said that they would prefer a heavier laptop with a bigger battery and for better or worse, companies have generally ignored that. I don't think it's really a "pro" issue either way.
- snovv_crash 10y ago
  I am a mechanical engineer. GP is correct: if the skin stays the same thickness, then halving the distance between the two skins halves the strength to resist bending. Central reinforcement, like an I beam, don't help with the bending force but rather stops the two skins from moving towards or away from each other, AKA buckling. The other way it helps is as a shear web, in that it stops the skins from sliding past each other. But basically, for a laptop to be half the thickness and equivalently strong it will need the structure to be twice as heavy, as the skins and webbing need to be twice as thick. That leaves even less room for battery, quiet fans and replaceable components, a high price to pay for something which is labeled "Pro".
  - dpark 10y ago
    Well, I'm not a mechanical engineer, so I won't argue this further. Nonetheless, this discussion is irrelevant unless the new MacBook pros are too easy to bend, which I don't believe is a known issue. I've never heard of anyone having bending issues with MacBook Airs, so I don't see why it would be an issue here.
- anon12345690 10y ago
  I also carry my laptop everywhere and have never felt the weight to be an issue. Perhaps you should go to the gym more. The last-gen laptops weigh less than a decent hardcover book. How is that too much to deal with?

matthewmacleod 10y ago

This simply isn't a professional machine. It's far from clear that this is 'simple'.

dpark 10y ago

> Lighter: Yes. This is a professional's priority number 2749 though. I use my laptop in a professional capacity and weight is a huge factor for me. I carry my laptop everywhere. Incremental yearly changes in weight have generally not been that impressive but in aggregate the difference is huge. Go pick up a 10-year-old laptop and you'll probably agree. > Structural engineering: It's half as thin. If you know mechanics, you'd need a material double as tough in order to make up for the loss in structural stability. I'm no mechanical engineer, but I don't believe that's correct. There are a number of factors that impact the structural stability of an item. The internal structure has a huge impact, which is why I-beams exist. It's also not as if the space saved is the result of just milling out half of the original aluminum. The actual metal case is probably the same thickness or close.

blackoil 10y ago
most developer(few thousand) in my company and most other I know of work for hours on desk in stretch, attend few meetings within office, use it some more in commute, back at home work/play some more on desk/bed. Once in few months travel to client/remote office/conference where they have to carry it for stretch. I expect same pattern from graphic/app designers, animators, video editor and PROfessionals in general. Sure marketing, consultant and similar profile move a lot but they don't need a pro level performance. So a lightweight/reasonable performance Macbook line and a little heavier/high performance Macbook Pro makes so much more sense.
- dpark 10y ago
  You're describing people who are picking up and carrying their laptops multiple times per day and carry it back and forth to work and home every day. These people seem like the target market for a lightweight laptop.
  - anon12345690 10y ago
    The scenarios you describe are not that bad. People are just fine carrying a few pounds around.
  - blackoil 10y ago
    carrying but not for long, never seen a programmer wary of to carry their current Macbook Pro few floors down the lift and then walk to meeting room. If you start feeling the weight for this little, problem is not your laptop. And, I am all for lightweight if that does not include compromise in battery life and performance.
    - dpark 10y ago
      I don't think I said that people have trouble carrying their laptops. No one really had trouble carrying 10 lb laptops either but it's quite a bit nicer to carry a modern lighter laptop. Forever people have said that they would prefer a heavier laptop with a bigger battery and for better or worse, companies have generally ignored that. I don't think it's really a "pro" issue either way.
snovv_crash 10y ago
I am a mechanical engineer. GP is correct: if the skin stays the same thickness, then halving the distance between the two skins halves the strength to resist bending. Central reinforcement, like an I beam, don't help with the bending force but rather stops the two skins from moving towards or away from each other, AKA buckling. The other way it helps is as a shear web, in that it stops the skins from sliding past each other. But basically, for a laptop to be half the thickness and equivalently strong it will need the structure to be twice as heavy, as the skins and webbing need to be twice as thick. That leaves even less room for battery, quiet fans and replaceable components, a high price to pay for something which is labeled "Pro".
- dpark 10y ago
  Well, I'm not a mechanical engineer, so I won't argue this further. Nonetheless, this discussion is irrelevant unless the new MacBook pros are too easy to bend, which I don't believe is a known issue. I've never heard of anyone having bending issues with MacBook Airs, so I don't see why it would be an issue here.
anon12345690 10y ago
I also carry my laptop everywhere and have never felt the weight to be an issue. Perhaps you should go to the gym more. The last-gen laptops weigh less than a decent hardcover book. How is that too much to deal with?