5 ms·

Aside from Diebold etc.[1], the only fraud happening in our elections are a) gerrymandering and b) racist voter suppression laws like those in North Carolina, w

by snsr 10y ago

Aside from Diebold etc.[1], the only fraud happening in our elections are a) gerrymandering and b) racist voter suppression laws like those in North Carolina, where a state senator admitted as much in a televised interview. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hacking_Democracy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hacking_Democracy

maehwasu 10y ago
That's an extremely strong claim to back up with no evidence. The commenter above you has given at least anecdotal evidence of substantial opportunity for fraud, and we already know motive is strong on both sides.
- specialist 10y ago
  What measure of proof do you require?
  - tropo 10y ago
    Well, how about the same ID you'd need to board a plane or buy alcohol or deal with being stopped by a cop? Let's start with that. To reduce forgery, match the ID against an image of it on a computer. Better yet, scan it into a computer and have the computer do the matching. Also, take a new picture. This can be used to help catch and prosecute any remaining fraud. More importantly, such fraud would be strongly discouraged by the increased possibility of being caught.
    - specialist 10y ago
      Hmmm. Let's try again. GP wrote: "...the only fraud happening in our elections are a) gerrymandering and b) racist voter suppression laws..." You wrote: "That's an extremely strong claim to back up with no evidence." I asked: "What measure of proof do you require?" Honestly, I expected something related to proving gerrymandering, disenfranchisement, or something.
trendia 10y ago
If John votes and pretends to be Jim (who doesn't vote), how would we know?
- specialist 10y ago
  In my jurisdiction, John had to show some kind of ID. Recent utility bill with matching address. Worker photo ID. It was a pretty long list. The idea is the state will no disenfranchise you for making a mistake while making the cost (risk) of bulk voter fraud higher as to be infeasible.
ythl 10y ago
How do you know people aren't double voting in areas that don't check IDs? Seems like an easy untraceable/unprovable way to commit voting fraud.
- grzm 10y ago
  In my experience in the US, you have a registered polling station where you are allowed to cast your ballot. When you arrive, they cross your name off the list. If I'm only allowed to vote in one location, and that location only allows me to vote once, that should prevent double voting, even if I'm not who I say I am. Or rather, I'm not going to vote twice as the same person. Is this the case across the US? Whether the voter registration rolls are up-to-date, that's another matter as well. And double voting is only one type of fraud.
- specialist 10y ago
  Meta: Please do not down vote legit questions. Election administration in the USA is arcane. This is a teachable moment.
- mrsteveman1 10y ago
  Trump supporters just tried this and were in fact caught. Nobody with sense would try, it carries severe punishment (it's a felony) for virtually no benefit to the person taking the risk, and really virtually no effect on the election either. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2016/10/29/trump-supporter-charged-with-voting-twice-in-iowa/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2016/10/2...
- snsr 10y ago
  > How do you know people aren't double voting in areas that don't check IDs? Because it doesn't fucking matter? Also going to need to see some receipts for that.

by snsr 10y ago

maehwasu 10y ago

That's an extremely strong claim to back up with no evidence. The commenter above you has given at least anecdotal evidence of substantial opportunity for fraud, and we already know motive is strong on both sides.

specialist 10y ago
What measure of proof do you require?
- tropo 10y ago
  Well, how about the same ID you'd need to board a plane or buy alcohol or deal with being stopped by a cop? Let's start with that. To reduce forgery, match the ID against an image of it on a computer. Better yet, scan it into a computer and have the computer do the matching. Also, take a new picture. This can be used to help catch and prosecute any remaining fraud. More importantly, such fraud would be strongly discouraged by the increased possibility of being caught.
  - specialist 10y ago
    Hmmm. Let's try again. GP wrote: "...the only fraud happening in our elections are a) gerrymandering and b) racist voter suppression laws..." You wrote: "That's an extremely strong claim to back up with no evidence." I asked: "What measure of proof do you require?" Honestly, I expected something related to proving gerrymandering, disenfranchisement, or something.

trendia 10y ago

If John votes and pretends to be Jim (who doesn't vote), how would we know?

specialist 10y ago
In my jurisdiction, John had to show some kind of ID. Recent utility bill with matching address. Worker photo ID. It was a pretty long list. The idea is the state will no disenfranchise you for making a mistake while making the cost (risk) of bulk voter fraud higher as to be infeasible.

ythl 10y ago

How do you know people aren't double voting in areas that don't check IDs? Seems like an easy untraceable/unprovable way to commit voting fraud.

grzm 10y ago
In my experience in the US, you have a registered polling station where you are allowed to cast your ballot. When you arrive, they cross your name off the list. If I'm only allowed to vote in one location, and that location only allows me to vote once, that should prevent double voting, even if I'm not who I say I am. Or rather, I'm not going to vote twice as the same person. Is this the case across the US? Whether the voter registration rolls are up-to-date, that's another matter as well. And double voting is only one type of fraud.
specialist 10y ago
Meta: Please do not down vote legit questions. Election administration in the USA is arcane. This is a teachable moment.
mrsteveman1 10y ago
Trump supporters just tried this and were in fact caught. Nobody with sense would try, it carries severe punishment (it's a felony) for virtually no benefit to the person taking the risk, and really virtually no effect on the election either. https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2016/10/29/trump-supporter-charged-with-voting-twice-in-iowa/ https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-nation/wp/2016/10/2...
snsr 10y ago
> How do you know people aren't double voting in areas that don't check IDs? Because it doesn't fucking matter? Also going to need to see some receipts for that.