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> "The Eiffel Tower in Paris is expected to be lit up in green light on Friday to mark the entry into force of the historic climate pact." It would be "greener

by spodek 10y ago

> "The Eiffel Tower in Paris is expected to be lit up in green light on Friday to mark the entry into force of the historic climate pact." It would be "greener" not to light it for an evening. And to remind people to reduce their consumption of things that pollute overall. Obviously not a total solution, but a start.

threesixandnine 10y ago
Maybe it's one of those things - you have to spend money to make money? All in all, I don't personally have any issues with lighting up the Eiffel Tower if that means a lot of exposure and information about sick planet reaching more people.
sambe 10y ago
Do you imagine a future where not lighting up the Eiffel Tower has saved us from climate change? More generally, these "solutions" don't work. Billions of people don't suddenly all agree to reduce their quality of life voluntarily. For every energy efficient lightbulb there's some beef they aren't supposed to eat, or a standby device that uses 2W too much power they have to switch off and on 5 times a day. It's never happened before and it won't happen for this, even if the world goes to crap due to climate change. Maybe stop wasting resources on feeling good about optimising the uncommon case and work on systematic stuff like clean power.
- Brakenshire 10y ago
  > It's never happened before and it won't happen for this It has happened that economic growth has untethered itself from fossil fuel growth almost everywhere in the Western world. I think consumer pressure can do something, apart from anything people just using it as an excuse to save money will do something. I agree that most of it has to be systemic, but there's a combination there. You need for instance cheaper storage and solar, more efficient a.c., better insulation, and so on, but you also need people to want to put in the effort to buy or install it.
  - maverick_iceman 10y ago
    >It has happened that economic growth has untethered itself from fossil fuel growth almost everywhere in the Western world. Hmm, then why is 67% of US electricity production is from fossil fuels?[1] [1] https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.cfm?id=427&t=3 https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.cfm?id=427&t=3
    - Brakenshire 10y ago
      Yes, that is saying a different thing. It has been that use of fossil fuels has been correlated to economic growth for 150 years. This is the first period in history when the Western countries have grown their economies while reducing their use of fossil fuels.
toyg 10y ago
Proposing buzzkill measures like this is a large part of why green movements always struggled to get mainstream traction. I call myself a fairly rational actor and still I deeply resent being forced to separate my rubbish - if green politicians had put half the effort they put into forcing this issue at political level, into pushing the disposal industry to come up with better technological solutions to do that for me, they'd be heroes of the people.
- douche 10y ago
  This kind of recycling measures are the biggest bit of bullshit imaginable. Work from home one day when the trash is getting collected. Watch your meticulously sorted waste products all get hucked into the same truck bed. Go to the transfer station, and watch all of those laboriously separated waste products be wound into the landfill or incinerator willy-nilly. Go home, and start burning your household trash in your home woodstove.
- thaumasiotes 10y ago
  > if green politicians had put half the effort they put into forcing this issue at political level, into pushing the disposal industry to come up with better technological solutions to do that for me, they'd be heroes of the people The disposal industry already has those solutions, because the error rate in individually-sorted trash is too high to work with. The point of having you sort your own trash is to make sure you're committed to the project, not to save effort for the disposal industry.
  - toyg 10y ago
    > The point of having you sort your own trash is to make sure you're committed to the project I hope you're joking, because that would be mind control on a level not seen since the Wall came down.
sqeaky 10y ago
You presumption only work if you think don't think of the electricity as a cost to reduce other costs, surely the net loss of people notified this way will reduce more than it costs.
icebraining 10y ago
They do that during Earth Hour (but only for an hour, of course). https://www.earthhour.org/ https://www.earthhour.org/
maverick_iceman 10y ago
Two words: human nature.

by spodek 10y ago

threesixandnine 10y ago

Maybe it's one of those things - you have to spend money to make money? All in all, I don't personally have any issues with lighting up the Eiffel Tower if that means a lot of exposure and information about sick planet reaching more people.

sambe 10y ago

Do you imagine a future where not lighting up the Eiffel Tower has saved us from climate change? More generally, these "solutions" don't work. Billions of people don't suddenly all agree to reduce their quality of life voluntarily. For every energy efficient lightbulb there's some beef they aren't supposed to eat, or a standby device that uses 2W too much power they have to switch off and on 5 times a day. It's never happened before and it won't happen for this, even if the world goes to crap due to climate change. Maybe stop wasting resources on feeling good about optimising the uncommon case and work on systematic stuff like clean power.

Brakenshire 10y ago
> It's never happened before and it won't happen for this It has happened that economic growth has untethered itself from fossil fuel growth almost everywhere in the Western world. I think consumer pressure can do something, apart from anything people just using it as an excuse to save money will do something. I agree that most of it has to be systemic, but there's a combination there. You need for instance cheaper storage and solar, more efficient a.c., better insulation, and so on, but you also need people to want to put in the effort to buy or install it.
- maverick_iceman 10y ago
  >It has happened that economic growth has untethered itself from fossil fuel growth almost everywhere in the Western world. Hmm, then why is 67% of US electricity production is from fossil fuels?[1] [1] https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.cfm?id=427&t=3 https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.cfm?id=427&t=3
  - Brakenshire 10y ago
    Yes, that is saying a different thing. It has been that use of fossil fuels has been correlated to economic growth for 150 years. This is the first period in history when the Western countries have grown their economies while reducing their use of fossil fuels.

toyg 10y ago

Proposing buzzkill measures like this is a large part of why green movements always struggled to get mainstream traction. I call myself a fairly rational actor and still I deeply resent being forced to separate my rubbish - if green politicians had put half the effort they put into forcing this issue at political level, into pushing the disposal industry to come up with better technological solutions to do that for me, they'd be heroes of the people.

douche 10y ago
This kind of recycling measures are the biggest bit of bullshit imaginable. Work from home one day when the trash is getting collected. Watch your meticulously sorted waste products all get hucked into the same truck bed. Go to the transfer station, and watch all of those laboriously separated waste products be wound into the landfill or incinerator willy-nilly. Go home, and start burning your household trash in your home woodstove.
thaumasiotes 10y ago
> if green politicians had put half the effort they put into forcing this issue at political level, into pushing the disposal industry to come up with better technological solutions to do that for me, they'd be heroes of the people The disposal industry already has those solutions, because the error rate in individually-sorted trash is too high to work with. The point of having you sort your own trash is to make sure you're committed to the project, not to save effort for the disposal industry.
- toyg 10y ago
  > The point of having you sort your own trash is to make sure you're committed to the project I hope you're joking, because that would be mind control on a level not seen since the Wall came down.

sqeaky 10y ago

You presumption only work if you think don't think of the electricity as a cost to reduce other costs, surely the net loss of people notified this way will reduce more than it costs.

icebraining 10y ago

They do that during Earth Hour (but only for an hour, of course). https://www.earthhour.org/ https://www.earthhour.org/

maverick_iceman 10y ago

Two words: human nature.