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But those 200 years have been far from peaceful.

by patricius 10y ago

surfmike 10y ago
Internally they have been peaceful. The major exception being the civil war which can hardly be blamed on immigration.
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legodt 10y ago
Yeah but that wasn't the immigrant's fault. Quite the opposite actually. Ruling white people are a major source of the history of violence.
- FreedomToCreate 10y ago
  Do you even read what you write. I see comments like this all over the internet and it amazes me how the irony of your statement completely eludes you. You basic argument is that immigrant culture has no effect on violence but the culture of another group(the white people) does. Ok, so in that case, nations completely ruled by the culture the immigrants comes from, must inherently be free of major violence. Hmmm does that sound correct. If anything, the west post world war 2 bred a new culture that gave birth to true liberty. The democracies formed in this period shaped the freedoms we have today, and pushed for human rights and equality. There is still progress to make, but targeting groups of people is no solution. Btw I am Indian, and if you want to argue that ruling whites are a source of major violence, just go and read the history of India from 1000-1800. No white people, lots and lots of violence. All races are the same.
  - legodt 10y ago
    I was replying to specifically the last 200 years in America. As you right as you are it has nothing to do with what the comment was about. Also how is pointing out that the ruling class/race is responsible for violence "singling" them out? White people aren't some specific out-group here. Who fought to keep slaves? White people. Who only wanted to free the slaves to put moral pressure on other countries during they eqyptian cotton crisis? White people. Who roamed the country side after slaves were free to Lynch free men for the color of their skin. White people. Who imported crack to the inner cities? Who started the devastating war on drugs? Who defunded public welfare and health programs for the poor? Us every time. This goes on too. Concentration camps for asian-americans, constant abuses of Native American populations, the constant harassment of immigrant cultures- none of this was imported with immigrants, it's the product of a society they desperately wants to remain homogenous
    - humanrebar 10y ago
      > how is pointing out that the ruling class/race is responsible for violence "singling" them out It's not just because it stereotypes individuals, groups them, and judges them based on involuntary criteria (skin color). There is a rich history of American white culture absolutely opposed to racism. For example, white Quakers fought slavery since the 17th century, often at personal cost [1]. Countless white people died in the Civil War over the issue of slavery. So I reject the entire idea of a 'ruling race'. I guess 'ruling class' is technically more fluid, but people often have notions of class foisted on them, including here, so it's not necessarily any better. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quakers_in_the_Abolition_Movement https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quakers_in_the_Abolition_Movem...

But those 200 years have been far from peaceful.

surfmike 10y ago

Internally they have been peaceful. The major exception being the civil war which can hardly be blamed on immigration.

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legodt 10y ago

Yeah but that wasn't the immigrant's fault. Quite the opposite actually. Ruling white people are a major source of the history of violence.

FreedomToCreate 10y ago
Do you even read what you write. I see comments like this all over the internet and it amazes me how the irony of your statement completely eludes you. You basic argument is that immigrant culture has no effect on violence but the culture of another group(the white people) does. Ok, so in that case, nations completely ruled by the culture the immigrants comes from, must inherently be free of major violence. Hmmm does that sound correct. If anything, the west post world war 2 bred a new culture that gave birth to true liberty. The democracies formed in this period shaped the freedoms we have today, and pushed for human rights and equality. There is still progress to make, but targeting groups of people is no solution. Btw I am Indian, and if you want to argue that ruling whites are a source of major violence, just go and read the history of India from 1000-1800. No white people, lots and lots of violence. All races are the same.
- legodt 10y ago
  I was replying to specifically the last 200 years in America. As you right as you are it has nothing to do with what the comment was about. Also how is pointing out that the ruling class/race is responsible for violence "singling" them out? White people aren't some specific out-group here. Who fought to keep slaves? White people. Who only wanted to free the slaves to put moral pressure on other countries during they eqyptian cotton crisis? White people. Who roamed the country side after slaves were free to Lynch free men for the color of their skin. White people. Who imported crack to the inner cities? Who started the devastating war on drugs? Who defunded public welfare and health programs for the poor? Us every time. This goes on too. Concentration camps for asian-americans, constant abuses of Native American populations, the constant harassment of immigrant cultures- none of this was imported with immigrants, it's the product of a society they desperately wants to remain homogenous
  - humanrebar 10y ago
    > how is pointing out that the ruling class/race is responsible for violence "singling" them out It's not just because it stereotypes individuals, groups them, and judges them based on involuntary criteria (skin color). There is a rich history of American white culture absolutely opposed to racism. For example, white Quakers fought slavery since the 17th century, often at personal cost [1]. Countless white people died in the Civil War over the issue of slavery. So I reject the entire idea of a 'ruling race'. I guess 'ruling class' is technically more fluid, but people often have notions of class foisted on them, including here, so it's not necessarily any better. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quakers_in_the_Abolition_Movement https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quakers_in_the_Abolition_Movem...