4 ms·

Simply because you have a CS degree doesn't mean you're qualified enough to be hired. Companies don't just hire based on a degree, they want demonstrable skills

by ropiku 10y ago

Simply because you have a CS degree doesn't mean you're qualified enough to be hired. Companies don't just hire based on a degree, they want demonstrable skills. I've seen 3rd year students unable to fix a basic java compilation error in their own program. No reasonable CS graduate I know is unemployed.

pvaldes 10y ago
Demonstrable skills? Of course, here you are the results of my 100 exams, that I passed sucessfully. In an officially certified document, easy to authenticate. Its called curriculum, and is comfortably standardized for all students so you can find the best easily. Otherwise you would need to compare among random arbitrary sets of skills, different for each one of your candidates and this would be for companies basically like playing blind chicken to hire a candidate. You need still to show demonstrable skills is often a way to say "I expect you to work for free until you realize that this is the real game here. I will replace you with the next hungry guy in the queue". Is just a mean to obtain the same cheaper, or free.
- rahimnathwani 10y ago
  A CS degree isn't 'comfortably standardised'. Each university has its own curriculum, its own exams, and its own standards. If I could prove to you that I was awarded a CS degree from a UK university, would that be sufficient for you to agree to employ me?
  - pvaldes 10y ago
    If your scores were high, probably yes. Recruitment should be put in the right context. The best recruiter have an evening, or a few hours to figure out if you are a good fit or if you have any skills. If you have a bad day, your recruiter don't liked your face or he/she wants to remain the big fish in a small pond; you fall under the radar. Your teachers instead had four years for "recruit you". They have see you performing in solitary and in group; know if you have any real skills or not or if you have problems with the other studens. They understand you much better that any recruiter; is their job. The job of a recruiter is having the position filled at the lowest price possible. They need the psychological tricks to make the process random again and put pressure on the candidate. To be able to cheat the tests or to seduce your recruiter is not a skill that the company needs. Is just smoke. Unsusprisingly a lot of those swans turn into ugly ducklings just after being hired.
    - rahimnathwani 10y ago
      ropiku: Simply because you have a CS degree doesn't mean you're qualified enough to be hired. pvaldes: here you are the results of my 100 exams, that I passed sucessfully. In an officially certified document, easy to authenticate. me: If I could prove to you that I was awarded a CS degree from a UK university, would that be sufficient for you to agree to employ me? pvaldes: If your scores were high, probably yes. So it seems that you and ropiku _agree_ that a CS degree _isn't_ enough. Where you differ is that you want to see scores above some threshold (although I can't imagine how you'd standardise those across 100+ UK universities), and ropiku wants to see someone write some Java code. Both seem reasonable approaches, but the latter seems a little easier and more reliable.
      - pvaldes 10y ago
        > I can't imagine how you'd standardise those across 100+ UK universities Is Python a different language if written in Cardiff, Liverpool or Plymouth?
        rahimnathwani 10y ago
        > Is Python a different language if written in Cardiff, Liverpool or Plymouth? No, but that has zero relevance to the comparability of scores between universities.
        pvaldes 10y ago
        Has Python zero relevance to have a job? For some jobs yes, of course; for other I don't think so. If you have a soft spot for elitism and want to have universities ranked by categories you can have it. Is universally standardized, as I said before. You could hire people only of universities ranking in prime number positions if you want. Is your choice. If you want simply to hire somebody able to code in the language X, you could just take a quick look at the curriculum of your candidate and see if that language was teached in his/her university, what contents have been teached (can find it in the web of the university) and how the guy/girl scored, so... what is the problem exactly? Do you think that to make them repeat the same tests is a good way to spend the money of your company and your time as employer? Is your company a wannabe-university? Do you feel better qualified to score correctly a candidate than the teacher that spent 30 years doing exactly that job?

by ropiku 10y ago

pvaldes 10y ago

Demonstrable skills? Of course, here you are the results of my 100 exams, that I passed sucessfully. In an officially certified document, easy to authenticate. Its called curriculum, and is comfortably standardized for all students so you can find the best easily. Otherwise you would need to compare among random arbitrary sets of skills, different for each one of your candidates and this would be for companies basically like playing blind chicken to hire a candidate. You need still to show demonstrable skills is often a way to say "I expect you to work for free until you realize that this is the real game here. I will replace you with the next hungry guy in the queue". Is just a mean to obtain the same cheaper, or free.

rahimnathwani 10y ago
A CS degree isn't 'comfortably standardised'. Each university has its own curriculum, its own exams, and its own standards. If I could prove to you that I was awarded a CS degree from a UK university, would that be sufficient for you to agree to employ me?
- pvaldes 10y ago
  If your scores were high, probably yes. Recruitment should be put in the right context. The best recruiter have an evening, or a few hours to figure out if you are a good fit or if you have any skills. If you have a bad day, your recruiter don't liked your face or he/she wants to remain the big fish in a small pond; you fall under the radar. Your teachers instead had four years for "recruit you". They have see you performing in solitary and in group; know if you have any real skills or not or if you have problems with the other studens. They understand you much better that any recruiter; is their job. The job of a recruiter is having the position filled at the lowest price possible. They need the psychological tricks to make the process random again and put pressure on the candidate. To be able to cheat the tests or to seduce your recruiter is not a skill that the company needs. Is just smoke. Unsusprisingly a lot of those swans turn into ugly ducklings just after being hired.
  - rahimnathwani 10y ago
    ropiku: Simply because you have a CS degree doesn't mean you're qualified enough to be hired. pvaldes: here you are the results of my 100 exams, that I passed sucessfully. In an officially certified document, easy to authenticate. me: If I could prove to you that I was awarded a CS degree from a UK university, would that be sufficient for you to agree to employ me? pvaldes: If your scores were high, probably yes. So it seems that you and ropiku _agree_ that a CS degree _isn't_ enough. Where you differ is that you want to see scores above some threshold (although I can't imagine how you'd standardise those across 100+ UK universities), and ropiku wants to see someone write some Java code. Both seem reasonable approaches, but the latter seems a little easier and more reliable.
    - pvaldes 10y ago
      > I can't imagine how you'd standardise those across 100+ UK universities Is Python a different language if written in Cardiff, Liverpool or Plymouth?
      - rahimnathwani 10y ago
        > Is Python a different language if written in Cardiff, Liverpool or Plymouth? No, but that has zero relevance to the comparability of scores between universities.
        pvaldes 10y ago
        Has Python zero relevance to have a job? For some jobs yes, of course; for other I don't think so. If you have a soft spot for elitism and want to have universities ranked by categories you can have it. Is universally standardized, as I said before. You could hire people only of universities ranking in prime number positions if you want. Is your choice. If you want simply to hire somebody able to code in the language X, you could just take a quick look at the curriculum of your candidate and see if that language was teached in his/her university, what contents have been teached (can find it in the web of the university) and how the guy/girl scored, so... what is the problem exactly? Do you think that to make them repeat the same tests is a good way to spend the money of your company and your time as employer? Is your company a wannabe-university? Do you feel better qualified to score correctly a candidate than the teacher that spent 30 years doing exactly that job?