5 ms·

It's hard not to see this as a life-and-death struggle between people who think public transportation is the way of the future and people who think cars are the

by 1_2__3 10y ago

It's hard not to see this as a life-and-death struggle between people who think public transportation is the way of the future and people who think cars are the future. I know which way the HN crowd leans, but I feel compelled to point out that while pro-transit folks may feel comfortable being ideologically "correct", in practice this has just not worked out in the US and any argument about why sounds like someone hammering a bell upon which is inscribed "no true scotsman". Either there's been a multi-decade cabal holding the entire country in its grip and preventing us from leaping into our beautiful public transportation future... Or Americans just do not want it, kicking and screaming about sustainability to the contrary.

davidw 10y ago
> Either there's been a multi-decade cabal holding the entire country in its grip and preventing us from leaping into our beautiful public transportation future... Or Americans just do not want it, kicking and screaming about sustainability to the contrary. Zoning, basically. It makes density illegal in enough places that transit isn't terribly practical. It also makes even walking to a corner store something that is no longer an option in many new developments. If you'd like to read all about it, this book is very thorough: http://amzn.to/2fz1hPI http://amzn.to/2fz1hPI If you'd like something a bit more tl;dr, these are good: http://amzn.to/2erOJXL http://amzn.to/2erOJXL http://amzn.to/2fyXrpG http://amzn.to/2fyXrpG
- ghaff 10y ago
  But "Zoning" (to the degree that's the central reason) was also not created by a "multi-decade cabal". It's largely the summation of the preferences of residents in different areas.
  - davidw 10y ago
    > It's largely the summation of the preferences of residents in different areas. Yes. With the complicity of states/feds/courts etc... who have allowed neighbors to run rampant over others' property rights to a degree that I think has lead to a number of terrible consequences.
CaptSpify 10y ago
Americans generally just don't want it, which is a problem because we keep passing the buck to future generations. It's not a matter of preference, it's simply unsustainable both environmentally and density-wise. It's hilarious to me to watch as well. I have co-workers constantly complaining about spending too much time in traffic. I spend just as much time in traffic as they do, but I don't mind because I'm on a bus. I'm usually reading a book, or working on my laptop, while they are just staring at cars in front of them. The answer is right in front of their faces, but "I need a car because of.... reasons" is too ingrained in our culture.

by 1_2__3 10y ago

davidw 10y ago

> Either there's been a multi-decade cabal holding the entire country in its grip and preventing us from leaping into our beautiful public transportation future... Or Americans just do not want it, kicking and screaming about sustainability to the contrary. Zoning, basically. It makes density illegal in enough places that transit isn't terribly practical. It also makes even walking to a corner store something that is no longer an option in many new developments. If you'd like to read all about it, this book is very thorough: http://amzn.to/2fz1hPI http://amzn.to/2fz1hPI If you'd like something a bit more tl;dr, these are good: http://amzn.to/2erOJXL http://amzn.to/2erOJXL http://amzn.to/2fyXrpG http://amzn.to/2fyXrpG

ghaff 10y ago
But "Zoning" (to the degree that's the central reason) was also not created by a "multi-decade cabal". It's largely the summation of the preferences of residents in different areas.
- davidw 10y ago
  > It's largely the summation of the preferences of residents in different areas. Yes. With the complicity of states/feds/courts etc... who have allowed neighbors to run rampant over others' property rights to a degree that I think has lead to a number of terrible consequences.

CaptSpify 10y ago

Americans generally just don't want it, which is a problem because we keep passing the buck to future generations. It's not a matter of preference, it's simply unsustainable both environmentally and density-wise. It's hilarious to me to watch as well. I have co-workers constantly complaining about spending too much time in traffic. I spend just as much time in traffic as they do, but I don't mind because I'm on a bus. I'm usually reading a book, or working on my laptop, while they are just staring at cars in front of them. The answer is right in front of their faces, but "I need a car because of.... reasons" is too ingrained in our culture.