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It seems like the culprit here is easy money. We've had twelve years now of ample funding for startups, and a whole generation of coders who have not seen lean

It seems like the culprit here is easy money. We've had twelve years now of ample funding for startups, and a whole generation of coders who have not seen lean times in their entire career. In such circumstances, you would expect people to get profligate.

nostrademons 10y ago
Has it really been 12 years of ample funding? My recollection is that the downturn in 08-09 was really steep, with Sequoia sending out warnings to all their portfolio companies, mass layoffs at most Bay Area tech companies (my roommate when I moved out here went through 4 rounds at EMC, and was doing the work of 3 people by the end of it), dramatic rent decreases, and the almost total extinction of the Web 2.0 startup craze (remember that?). It recovered in late 2010 with the mobile boom - that's when companies like Uber, Instagram, SnapChat, Parse, etc. were founded. And those companies that managed to survive the downturn (DropBox, AirBnB, KickStarter, Whatsapp, Evernote) emerged quite strong, and were ready to take on massive amounts of funding afterwards.
- idlewords 10y ago
  I was out of the US then, so I may well be wrong. My recollection (working remotely as a consultant) was that people panicked for a month or two, and after that working in tech was like a magical oasis from the chaos. What was other people's experience like?
  - Naritai 10y ago
    Experiences varied wildly. For employees, it was a terrible time. Large companies were laying off left and right, and Sequoia did indeed advise all CEOs to fire their devs if their product was already on the market. However, since the stock market was doing so badly, it was the beginning of the moment where a _lot_ of money started looking for somewhere else to go. So if you were of the wherewithal to go out and make a startup, it was a great time to be looking for funding. So it depends a lot on who you ask. I will say, though, that real estate started taking off in ~2011, so it was more than a month of panic, but I would guess that in 2011-2013 or so SF was far and away the strongest local economy in the US.
  - moyta 10y ago
    In Seattle there were mass layoffs, people lost homes, the economy spent a few years in a form of stasis. Relative to what I saw happen in other parts of the country though, we were minorly scathed.
  - tptacek 10y ago
    The weekend before Lehman collapsed, we closed the biggest deal in the history of our company --- with a giant NY investment bank. At the end of the weekend, the deal had vanished. Other than that, not even a hiccup. At that time, we were in Chicago and NYC, but not in the Bay Area. However, a pretty big chunk of our client base was in SFBA, and I don't remember that part of the business skipping a beat.
chiefalchemist 10y ago
Yup. Too much funding, not enough urgency.
losteverything 10y ago
Your "generation of coders " struck me. After a dozen years in a startup what will most of these Have $$$ wise. There were no startups in the '80s for an average comp sci grad like me. After a dozen years working at hugeo monopoly I got ~200k (by doing nothing except vest) once departure occurred. Is it more for the current batch of startup workers after 12 years or so?

nostrademons 10y ago

Has it really been 12 years of ample funding? My recollection is that the downturn in 08-09 was really steep, with Sequoia sending out warnings to all their portfolio companies, mass layoffs at most Bay Area tech companies (my roommate when I moved out here went through 4 rounds at EMC, and was doing the work of 3 people by the end of it), dramatic rent decreases, and the almost total extinction of the Web 2.0 startup craze (remember that?). It recovered in late 2010 with the mobile boom - that's when companies like Uber, Instagram, SnapChat, Parse, etc. were founded. And those companies that managed to survive the downturn (DropBox, AirBnB, KickStarter, Whatsapp, Evernote) emerged quite strong, and were ready to take on massive amounts of funding afterwards.

idlewords 10y ago
I was out of the US then, so I may well be wrong. My recollection (working remotely as a consultant) was that people panicked for a month or two, and after that working in tech was like a magical oasis from the chaos. What was other people's experience like?
- Naritai 10y ago
  Experiences varied wildly. For employees, it was a terrible time. Large companies were laying off left and right, and Sequoia did indeed advise all CEOs to fire their devs if their product was already on the market. However, since the stock market was doing so badly, it was the beginning of the moment where a _lot_ of money started looking for somewhere else to go. So if you were of the wherewithal to go out and make a startup, it was a great time to be looking for funding. So it depends a lot on who you ask. I will say, though, that real estate started taking off in ~2011, so it was more than a month of panic, but I would guess that in 2011-2013 or so SF was far and away the strongest local economy in the US.
- moyta 10y ago
  In Seattle there were mass layoffs, people lost homes, the economy spent a few years in a form of stasis. Relative to what I saw happen in other parts of the country though, we were minorly scathed.
- tptacek 10y ago
  The weekend before Lehman collapsed, we closed the biggest deal in the history of our company --- with a giant NY investment bank. At the end of the weekend, the deal had vanished. Other than that, not even a hiccup. At that time, we were in Chicago and NYC, but not in the Bay Area. However, a pretty big chunk of our client base was in SFBA, and I don't remember that part of the business skipping a beat.

chiefalchemist 10y ago

Yup. Too much funding, not enough urgency.

losteverything 10y ago

Your "generation of coders " struck me. After a dozen years in a startup what will most of these Have $$$ wise. There were no startups in the '80s for an average comp sci grad like me. After a dozen years working at hugeo monopoly I got ~200k (by doing nothing except vest) once departure occurred. Is it more for the current batch of startup workers after 12 years or so?