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Hopefully LinkedIn won't ask me for my salary in the future. Cause I definitely don't trust them with my salary info. They'll sell it to everyone - recruiters,

Hopefully LinkedIn won't ask me for my salary in the future. Cause I definitely don't trust them with my salary info. They'll sell it to everyone - recruiters, other companies...

twokul 10y ago
I'd suggest you to read https://engineering.linkedin.com/blog/2016/10/bringing-salary-transparency-to-the-world https://engineering.linkedin.com/blog/2016/10/bringing-salar..., the section about privacy.
- mavelikara 10y ago
  Here is what the _current_ content says: One of the interesting dichotomies with compensation data is that many users want this information, but don’t want to have their individual data exposed or connected back to them. Salary information is personal to each of our members. With this in mind, and consistent with our Members First organizational philosophy, one of the first goals we established when we set out to embark on this project was to provide powerful salary insights in aggregate without risking an individual’s private information. In the end, we built a salary collection system to provide the strongest protections for the anonymity of all of our members—no easy task. Parts of our approach are detailed later in this article. Because we proactively separate a member’s submission data from their Member ID when compensation data is submitted, it enables us to secure the system in such a way that we cannot even support the ability for a member to update their previously submitted salary information - they have to resubmit. Furthermore, our system provides protection not just from hackers out in the wild, but also provides access control against unauthorized use by internal users. If I am reading this correctly, what they seem to say is that as implemented currently, they don't have the ability to track a person's salary information to their profile and hence won't be able to sell that information.
  - Balgair 10y ago
    True, but that is not the issue. The clickwrap means nothing to me when they have this rider: "7. Right to Terminate or Modify Software LinkedIn may modify the Software and this EULA with notice to you either in email or by publishing notice on the Website, including but not limited to charging fees for the Software, or changing the functionality or appearance of the Software. In the event LinkedIn modifies the Software or the EULA, you may terminate this EULA and cease use of the Software. LinkedIn may terminate your use of the Software, the EULA or the LinkedIn Service at any time, *with or without notice.*" (emphasis mine)[0] Fundamentally, I cannot ever trust them. [0]https://www.linkedin.com/legal/mobile/eula https://www.linkedin.com/legal/mobile/eula
  - badloginagain 10y ago
    Until 7 months later they quietly update the ToS.
    - riffraff 10y ago
      7 months later they would still not have access to the submitted data that was never stored, only to future submissions.
  - saiya-jin 10y ago
    that's a mighty big hoping that nothing in this regard will change. ever. in for-profit company. that eagerly steals all my contacts from my cell phone (to which I probably unknowingly agreed, but it's amoral). NO.
  - sgw928 10y ago
    Then when someone resubmits new data, how do they know that a previously submitted data point is now stale and shouldn't be used any more?
    - mahyarm 10y ago
      What I think happens: 1. You submit a salary info struct, which includes time of submission. The struct does not contain a userId. 2. Your account's lastUpdatedSalaryDate gets updated, with only day/week/month level precision. Someone with access to the entire database may be able to connect the two if the salary set for your job is small enough. Then they weigh salary information based on how fresh the entry is. Stale entries don't get a good weight, and you updating your salary is just another info point, and it might go into another bucket if you got a title change (ex software eng -> sr. software eng.). If you got promoted, then the old salary info is probably still relevant for people in lower level positions.
    - hvidgaard 10y ago
      When you submit data, your current state and history will form some basis for the entry into the salery database. When you update your information, you have a different state and history, and thus will generate a new entry. Both should be in the data.
  - billmalarky 10y ago
    Because we proactively separate a member’s submission data from their Member ID when compensation data is submitted, it enables us to secure the system in such a way that we cannot even support the ability for a member to update their previously submitted salary information - they have to resubmit. How is this possible? If the salary data is not associated to the user in any way can't a user submit their salary over and over again drastically swaying the aggregate salaries?
    - apike 10y ago
      Presumably they're tracking when the user last submitted a salary, but not what they submitted.
- allengeorge 10y ago
  I have. I'm aware I have a strong bias against LinkedIn when it comes to their data-handling. The entire company is built around selling me to recruiters, so I'm very wary about their collection of my employment information. Edit. For example, I'm not sure if this current policy will continue into the future. It's easy for me to get used to handing them my salary information and for them to change the privacy policy under me.
  - rokhayakebe 10y ago
    The entire company is built around selling me to recruiters I think you may have fixed this data accuracy debate/issue. If they ask recruiters only they may get nearly-accurate data.
- rqebmm 10y ago
  Yeah, because I trust LinkedIn with privacy.
- YPCrumble 10y ago
  LinkedIn waited several years without letting me know that my account information had been hacked. For me at least they lost all credibility so reading their "privacy policy" would be a waste of time.
- SilasX 10y ago
  Sure, because the right combination of words somehow overrides LinkedIn's history of violating users' trust, of security breaches, and of sleazy practices.
Raphmedia 10y ago
That's why you should lie even to forms when asked for your salary.
- pcurve 10y ago
  Let's just all put down random number between $220,000 - $275,000 as base.
  - user5994461 10y ago
    What if the UI is made for "normal" people and the highest option is "$150,000k+" /s
  - omouse 10y ago
    for devs it would actually get our salaries up to the right level, the big tech companies held down wages for 4-5 years.
  - dclowd9901 10y ago
    This reminds me of a funny conversation I had once with a recruiter. He essentially demanded I provide him a salary number to give to a prospective company, as I had been flatly refusing to on the basis that it puts me at a disadvantage. Eventually I threw out the highest amount I'd ever earned, about $225k a year total comp (partly tongue-in-cheek, partly to make a point), and he got really angry with me, telling me I was wasting his time and that nobody got paid that much. Needless to say, I ended any dealings with him at that point forward.
    - iaw 10y ago
      I've capped out my income at the moment, when recruiters talk to me I always try to force them into the compensation discussion first. Including risk discounts, expected future growth rates, etc. they quickly stop wasting my time.
  - suyash 10y ago
    Serious all developers should actually do that. I would say go beyond the $500k ceiling as well. It is us to blame for the low salary we have accepted from employers and then blame it to the companies.
yalogin 10y ago
What do you mean you don't trust them? The need the salary information only to sell to recruiters and companies. Any other value proposition they might come up with is purely bogus.
- tajen 10y ago
  They'll find another way. It's Linked In. They regularly purchase and merge data from various sources. They'll phone your employer if need be. "Hey employers, tell us how much your employees earn, so we tell you where you could save!"
shostack 10y ago
This. If they give this salary to recruiters or do anything to hint at what a candidate's range might be, they will lose whatever trust they might still have. In fact, I'd love to know what they can offer in the way of assurances against this.
babuskov 10y ago
But that's the whole point and you can turn it to your advantage. Report the salary you want, possibly higher than the one you have and all the recruiters and potential employers will know not to contact you if they cannot pay that much.
- aq3cn 10y ago
  I read an article from Lifehacker about being transparent of your salary. Check out what are the benefits. http://lifehacker.com/this-video-explains-why-you-should-talk-salary-with-you-1744371572 http://lifehacker.com/this-video-explains-why-you-should-tal... Adam Ruins Everything - Why You Should Tell Coworkers Your Salary https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xH7eGFuSYI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xH7eGFuSYI

Hopefully LinkedIn won't ask me for my salary in the future. Cause I definitely don't trust them with my salary info. They'll sell it to everyone - recruiters, other companies...

twokul 10y ago

I'd suggest you to read https://engineering.linkedin.com/blog/2016/10/bringing-salary-transparency-to-the-world https://engineering.linkedin.com/blog/2016/10/bringing-salar..., the section about privacy.

mavelikara 10y ago
Here is what the _current_ content says: One of the interesting dichotomies with compensation data is that many users want this information, but don’t want to have their individual data exposed or connected back to them. Salary information is personal to each of our members. With this in mind, and consistent with our Members First organizational philosophy, one of the first goals we established when we set out to embark on this project was to provide powerful salary insights in aggregate without risking an individual’s private information. In the end, we built a salary collection system to provide the strongest protections for the anonymity of all of our members—no easy task. Parts of our approach are detailed later in this article. Because we proactively separate a member’s submission data from their Member ID when compensation data is submitted, it enables us to secure the system in such a way that we cannot even support the ability for a member to update their previously submitted salary information - they have to resubmit. Furthermore, our system provides protection not just from hackers out in the wild, but also provides access control against unauthorized use by internal users. If I am reading this correctly, what they seem to say is that as implemented currently, they don't have the ability to track a person's salary information to their profile and hence won't be able to sell that information.
- Balgair 10y ago
  True, but that is not the issue. The clickwrap means nothing to me when they have this rider: "7. Right to Terminate or Modify Software LinkedIn may modify the Software and this EULA with notice to you either in email or by publishing notice on the Website, including but not limited to charging fees for the Software, or changing the functionality or appearance of the Software. In the event LinkedIn modifies the Software or the EULA, you may terminate this EULA and cease use of the Software. LinkedIn may terminate your use of the Software, the EULA or the LinkedIn Service at any time, *with or without notice.*" (emphasis mine)[0] Fundamentally, I cannot ever trust them. [0]https://www.linkedin.com/legal/mobile/eula https://www.linkedin.com/legal/mobile/eula
- badloginagain 10y ago
  Until 7 months later they quietly update the ToS.
  - riffraff 10y ago
    7 months later they would still not have access to the submitted data that was never stored, only to future submissions.
- saiya-jin 10y ago
  that's a mighty big hoping that nothing in this regard will change. ever. in for-profit company. that eagerly steals all my contacts from my cell phone (to which I probably unknowingly agreed, but it's amoral). NO.
- sgw928 10y ago
  Then when someone resubmits new data, how do they know that a previously submitted data point is now stale and shouldn't be used any more?
  - mahyarm 10y ago
    What I think happens: 1. You submit a salary info struct, which includes time of submission. The struct does not contain a userId. 2. Your account's lastUpdatedSalaryDate gets updated, with only day/week/month level precision. Someone with access to the entire database may be able to connect the two if the salary set for your job is small enough. Then they weigh salary information based on how fresh the entry is. Stale entries don't get a good weight, and you updating your salary is just another info point, and it might go into another bucket if you got a title change (ex software eng -> sr. software eng.). If you got promoted, then the old salary info is probably still relevant for people in lower level positions.
  - hvidgaard 10y ago
    When you submit data, your current state and history will form some basis for the entry into the salery database. When you update your information, you have a different state and history, and thus will generate a new entry. Both should be in the data.
- billmalarky 10y ago
  Because we proactively separate a member’s submission data from their Member ID when compensation data is submitted, it enables us to secure the system in such a way that we cannot even support the ability for a member to update their previously submitted salary information - they have to resubmit. How is this possible? If the salary data is not associated to the user in any way can't a user submit their salary over and over again drastically swaying the aggregate salaries?
  - apike 10y ago
    Presumably they're tracking when the user last submitted a salary, but not what they submitted.
allengeorge 10y ago
I have. I'm aware I have a strong bias against LinkedIn when it comes to their data-handling. The entire company is built around selling me to recruiters, so I'm very wary about their collection of my employment information. Edit. For example, I'm not sure if this current policy will continue into the future. It's easy for me to get used to handing them my salary information and for them to change the privacy policy under me.
- rokhayakebe 10y ago
  The entire company is built around selling me to recruiters I think you may have fixed this data accuracy debate/issue. If they ask recruiters only they may get nearly-accurate data.
rqebmm 10y ago
Yeah, because I trust LinkedIn with privacy.
YPCrumble 10y ago
LinkedIn waited several years without letting me know that my account information had been hacked. For me at least they lost all credibility so reading their "privacy policy" would be a waste of time.
SilasX 10y ago
Sure, because the right combination of words somehow overrides LinkedIn's history of violating users' trust, of security breaches, and of sleazy practices.

Raphmedia 10y ago

That's why you should lie even to forms when asked for your salary.

pcurve 10y ago
Let's just all put down random number between $220,000 - $275,000 as base.
- user5994461 10y ago
  What if the UI is made for "normal" people and the highest option is "$150,000k+" /s
- omouse 10y ago
  for devs it would actually get our salaries up to the right level, the big tech companies held down wages for 4-5 years.
- dclowd9901 10y ago
  This reminds me of a funny conversation I had once with a recruiter. He essentially demanded I provide him a salary number to give to a prospective company, as I had been flatly refusing to on the basis that it puts me at a disadvantage. Eventually I threw out the highest amount I'd ever earned, about $225k a year total comp (partly tongue-in-cheek, partly to make a point), and he got really angry with me, telling me I was wasting his time and that nobody got paid that much. Needless to say, I ended any dealings with him at that point forward.
  - iaw 10y ago
    I've capped out my income at the moment, when recruiters talk to me I always try to force them into the compensation discussion first. Including risk discounts, expected future growth rates, etc. they quickly stop wasting my time.
- suyash 10y ago
  Serious all developers should actually do that. I would say go beyond the $500k ceiling as well. It is us to blame for the low salary we have accepted from employers and then blame it to the companies.

yalogin 10y ago

What do you mean you don't trust them? The need the salary information only to sell to recruiters and companies. Any other value proposition they might come up with is purely bogus.

tajen 10y ago
They'll find another way. It's Linked In. They regularly purchase and merge data from various sources. They'll phone your employer if need be. "Hey employers, tell us how much your employees earn, so we tell you where you could save!"

shostack 10y ago

This. If they give this salary to recruiters or do anything to hint at what a candidate's range might be, they will lose whatever trust they might still have. In fact, I'd love to know what they can offer in the way of assurances against this.

babuskov 10y ago

But that's the whole point and you can turn it to your advantage. Report the salary you want, possibly higher than the one you have and all the recruiters and potential employers will know not to contact you if they cannot pay that much.

aq3cn 10y ago
I read an article from Lifehacker about being transparent of your salary. Check out what are the benefits. http://lifehacker.com/this-video-explains-why-you-should-talk-salary-with-you-1744371572 http://lifehacker.com/this-video-explains-why-you-should-tal... Adam Ruins Everything - Why You Should Tell Coworkers Your Salary https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xH7eGFuSYI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xH7eGFuSYI