6 ms·

Well, I was also thinking about (but didn't write) that most mission-critical systems aren't written in javascript :) ... but rather something "ancient" like ad

by samuell 10y ago

Well, I was also thinking about (but didn't write) that most mission-critical systems aren't written in javascript :) ... but rather something "ancient" like ada or pascal.

dom0 10y ago
I kinda doubt that any satellite from this era ran a high level language.
- kuschku 10y ago
  Why? The first high level languages were already existing in 1942, so it’s not that far fetched. EDIT: As I can’t answer to comments due to the retarded "you are submitting too fast" rule, here is a source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plankalk%C3%BCl https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plankalk%C3%BCl
  - pjc50 10y ago
    .. on room-sized computers. VLSI hadn't been achieved yet, so Apollo flew with a suitcase-sized computer made from discrete gates and core memory programmed in assembler by Margaret Hamilton and others. https://github.com/chrislgarry/Apollo-11 https://github.com/chrislgarry/Apollo-11 I doubt the satellite bothered with a processor.
    - Rooster61 10y ago
      Not trying to be pedantic or a dick, but you should refer to that language as assembly, not assembler. It is a non trivial difference as assembly refers to the language and assembler refers to the software written to parse assembly commands into machine code (binary strings defined in the given machine's instruction set that are meaningful to the processor). Otherwise it's similar to referring to the language C as Compiler, which is just silly :) http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1176138/assembly-vs-assembler http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1176138/assembly-vs-assem... Also, to your point, agreed. It took several years before we could actually fly high level, compiled languages in space, the first being HAL/S on the Shuttle (completed in 1975). https://www.cs.toronto.edu/XPL/hal.html https://www.cs.toronto.edu/XPL/hal.html Cheers
      - pjc50 10y ago
        This is the most pedantic thing I have seen in 2016.
        dom0 10y ago
        I dunno how other !English languages handle it, but in German both are simply called Assembler. It would also seem that this distinction isn't generally made, due to the human ability to deduce meaning from context.
        pryelluw 10y ago
        You must be new to HN.
  - toomanybeersies 10y ago
    I'm gonna need a source on that. The first actual formalised and widely used programming language was FORTRAN in the 50's.
    - pklausler 10y ago
      Which just had its 60th birthday a couple weeks ago.
  - Tobold 10y ago
    From the article you linked: > the first compiler for it was implemented in 1975
  - aardvark 10y ago
    Although a few high-level languages existed at the time, compilers back then were not capable of code optimization. The only way to write code tight enough to operate a spacecraft would have been Assembly language.
    - pklausler 10y ago
      Nonsense. Fortran I (happy 60th birthday!) was an optimizing compiler, and would have failed had it not been.
- agumonkey 10y ago
  Who knows, IIRC planes are dedicated C++ frameworks that spit out tons of intermediate representations and then compiled.
- Slackwise 10y ago
  Not a satellite, but Deep Space 1 ran on "Remote Agent", which was entirely written in Lisp and even had a remote REPL, which was used to debug and fix a race condition bug while millions of miles away. That and more about Lisp at JPL are on this awesome little page written by a former JPL engineer: http://www.flownet.com/gat/jpl-lisp.html http://www.flownet.com/gat/jpl-lisp.html
  - dom0 10y ago
    While fascinating and true, DS1 was launched in the late nineties, over forty years later. Pretty sure that's a different era :)
    - Slackwise 10y ago
      Oh, did I misunderstand what he meant by "this era"? I would assume the proper way to phrase it would be "that era" if he meant the 60's, although he did use "ran" which is the past tense. He also mentioned JavaScript, which didn't even exist in that era, so I guess I'm confused by the entire statement. Edit: by 'he' I guess I meant 'you'. Which means you did mean to refer to the 60's.
      - inimino 10y ago
        "This era" here means the era in the context of the discussion, not the current era. "That era" would also be correct.
Grishnakh 10y ago
That's incorrect. Commercial avionics are written in C++ these days. Automotive systems are in C or C++. Ada never got any real use outside the US military, and even there it's dead.
- samuell 10y ago
  Not if you read something like this: https://www.seas.gwu.edu/~mfeldman/ada-project-summary.html https://www.seas.gwu.edu/~mfeldman/ada-project-summary.html Sure, the "military" list is the longest, but far from the only one. I also notice four Swedish military systems there (yay :) )
- user5994461 10y ago
  Ada ain't dead. It's still in use for some aircraft systems, not all of which are military.
  - Grishnakh 10y ago
    It's probably all legacy stuff. The avionics stuff I worked on was all C++. I got to see some Ada code, but it was all ancient legacy systems that hadn't been replaced yet. I seriously doubt anyone is starting any new projects in it.
kjs3 10y ago
Ada 2012 would like to have a work with you: http://www.ada2012.org/ http://www.ada2012.org/

by samuell 10y ago

Well, I was also thinking about (but didn't write) that most mission-critical systems aren't written in javascript :) ... but rather something "ancient" like ada or pascal.

dom0 10y ago

I kinda doubt that any satellite from this era ran a high level language.

kuschku 10y ago
Why? The first high level languages were already existing in 1942, so it’s not that far fetched. EDIT: As I can’t answer to comments due to the retarded "you are submitting too fast" rule, here is a source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plankalk%C3%BCl https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plankalk%C3%BCl
- pjc50 10y ago
  .. on room-sized computers. VLSI hadn't been achieved yet, so Apollo flew with a suitcase-sized computer made from discrete gates and core memory programmed in assembler by Margaret Hamilton and others. https://github.com/chrislgarry/Apollo-11 https://github.com/chrislgarry/Apollo-11 I doubt the satellite bothered with a processor.
  - Rooster61 10y ago
    Not trying to be pedantic or a dick, but you should refer to that language as assembly, not assembler. It is a non trivial difference as assembly refers to the language and assembler refers to the software written to parse assembly commands into machine code (binary strings defined in the given machine's instruction set that are meaningful to the processor). Otherwise it's similar to referring to the language C as Compiler, which is just silly :) http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1176138/assembly-vs-assembler http://stackoverflow.com/questions/1176138/assembly-vs-assem... Also, to your point, agreed. It took several years before we could actually fly high level, compiled languages in space, the first being HAL/S on the Shuttle (completed in 1975). https://www.cs.toronto.edu/XPL/hal.html https://www.cs.toronto.edu/XPL/hal.html Cheers
    - pjc50 10y ago
      This is the most pedantic thing I have seen in 2016.
      - dom0 10y ago
        I dunno how other !English languages handle it, but in German both are simply called Assembler. It would also seem that this distinction isn't generally made, due to the human ability to deduce meaning from context.
      - pryelluw 10y ago
        You must be new to HN.
- toomanybeersies 10y ago
  I'm gonna need a source on that. The first actual formalised and widely used programming language was FORTRAN in the 50's.
  - pklausler 10y ago
    Which just had its 60th birthday a couple weeks ago.
- Tobold 10y ago
  From the article you linked: > the first compiler for it was implemented in 1975
- aardvark 10y ago
  Although a few high-level languages existed at the time, compilers back then were not capable of code optimization. The only way to write code tight enough to operate a spacecraft would have been Assembly language.
  - pklausler 10y ago
    Nonsense. Fortran I (happy 60th birthday!) was an optimizing compiler, and would have failed had it not been.
agumonkey 10y ago
Who knows, IIRC planes are dedicated C++ frameworks that spit out tons of intermediate representations and then compiled.
Slackwise 10y ago
Not a satellite, but Deep Space 1 ran on "Remote Agent", which was entirely written in Lisp and even had a remote REPL, which was used to debug and fix a race condition bug while millions of miles away. That and more about Lisp at JPL are on this awesome little page written by a former JPL engineer: http://www.flownet.com/gat/jpl-lisp.html http://www.flownet.com/gat/jpl-lisp.html
- dom0 10y ago
  While fascinating and true, DS1 was launched in the late nineties, over forty years later. Pretty sure that's a different era :)
  - Slackwise 10y ago
    Oh, did I misunderstand what he meant by "this era"? I would assume the proper way to phrase it would be "that era" if he meant the 60's, although he did use "ran" which is the past tense. He also mentioned JavaScript, which didn't even exist in that era, so I guess I'm confused by the entire statement. Edit: by 'he' I guess I meant 'you'. Which means you did mean to refer to the 60's.
    - inimino 10y ago
      "This era" here means the era in the context of the discussion, not the current era. "That era" would also be correct.

Grishnakh 10y ago

That's incorrect. Commercial avionics are written in C++ these days. Automotive systems are in C or C++. Ada never got any real use outside the US military, and even there it's dead.

samuell 10y ago
Not if you read something like this: https://www.seas.gwu.edu/~mfeldman/ada-project-summary.html https://www.seas.gwu.edu/~mfeldman/ada-project-summary.html Sure, the "military" list is the longest, but far from the only one. I also notice four Swedish military systems there (yay :) )
user5994461 10y ago
Ada ain't dead. It's still in use for some aircraft systems, not all of which are military.
- Grishnakh 10y ago
  It's probably all legacy stuff. The avionics stuff I worked on was all C++. I got to see some Ada code, but it was all ancient legacy systems that hadn't been replaced yet. I seriously doubt anyone is starting any new projects in it.

kjs3 10y ago

Ada 2012 would like to have a work with you: http://www.ada2012.org/ http://www.ada2012.org/