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That is bad, but you can compensate an wrongfully jailed person afterwards. But I think it is a fair point, which is why I am also against harsh prison conditio

That is bad, but you can compensate an wrongfully jailed person afterwards. But I think it is a fair point, which is why I am also against harsh prison conditions. I think prison should mainly be about rehabilitation and shielding society from the danger of the person. If prison mainly means losing freedom, you aren't necessarily ruined mentally when you get out.

Taek 10y ago
That depends. If you spend long enough isolated from society you won't be able to function in it anymore. People coming out of jail after 10 years of imprisonment are used to the original iphone as the only smartphone. They don't know about Uber, Venmo, Bitcoin, Amazon and Google have both changed dramatically. Now you need an EZPass for most roads, healthcare laws are different, they missed the whole Snowden ordeal. Weed is borderline legal, gay marriage is legal, etc etc. Things have changed a lot in the past 10 years. If you weren't allowed to keep up with it, you probably don't know how to navigate society anymore.
- Jtsummers 10y ago
  They aren't buried under rocks or in darkened caves. Their failure to adapt is our failure as a society to prepare them. By imprisoning them we become their guardians and stewards, we are responsible.
- jacquesm 10y ago
  None of the things you mention would stop someone from re-entering society, in quite a few countries there are rehabilitation programmes in the jails with gradual re-introduction to 'normal' life after longer jail sentences. Yes, this costs money but it helps to reduce recidivism and in general is a good thing to do.
- lawpoop 10y ago
  Wow, this seems extremely naive. (Honestly I'm feeling like I got trolled.) You don't know of anybody who has never been imprisoned who is managing to live their life without interacting with any of the things you've mentioned? If not, I would recommend enlarging your circle of contact.
  - Taek 10y ago
    When you come back to society and try to make friends, everyone is going to be utilizing technology to shape their interactions. Uber makes new types of socializing reasonable. (bars and parties farther away). Phones change how people schedule events. Chips in credit cards change how you spend your money. This isn't trolling. If you don't know how to use modern tech, it's going to be harder to socialize, especially if you are in a city (as they tend to adopt tech faster). If even a person has successfully rejected some tech (maybe Facebook, maybe smartphones), it's doubtful that they've rejected all tech and if they have they've developed skills for living without it among people who otherwise expect them to have it. I might be overstating this on a timeline of one decade, but it gets much worse on a timeline of 20 years. 20 years means you were likely using Windows 95. Texting wasn't a thing. Phones didn't have "apps". Banks didn't have websites. The average person's job had a lot less tech in it. Can you survive? Sure, but your options are a lot more limited compared to someone who knows how to use the tech of the 21st century.
    - jacquesm 10y ago
      It wouldn't take more than a few weeks to learn how to use those newfangled bits of tech. In fact, a very large portion of the world gets along just fine without them. There are far worse consequences to being jailed for 10 years or more than not to be able to use a cell phone or the latest social media fad. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institutional_syndrome https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institutional_syndrome
xiaoma 10y ago
>That is bad, but you can compensate an wrongfully jailed person afterwards. How do you compensate someone for being imprisoned (and likely raped) from the age of 28 to 45? In many cases, the death penalty is more humane.
- jacquesm 10y ago
  Failure of the prison system to protect its inmates should not become a factor in deciding whether or not it is more 'humane' to kill them outright. The you might as well kill all prisoners because it is more humane, after all where would you draw the line, 5 years, 10 years, 15 or 20, it's all time that has passed. Compensation should be of such a magnitude that it incentivizes society to make sure it happens as little as possible.
- lawpoop 10y ago
  If that is really true, why do inmates try to get out, instead of killing themselves? Why not just kill themselves after release, since having lived through that is so much worse than death?
- maerF0x0 10y ago
  As well, its fairly clear that the compensation offered is better than nothing. Sure, it may not be a 1:1 ratio of bad to good (rape to cash) but its clearly a step in the right direction to offer someone a "plus" in recompense for the negatives wrongly imposed.
- labster 10y ago
  If rape is likely in prison, as you suggest, how is our current prison system not a form of torture?

Taek 10y ago

That depends. If you spend long enough isolated from society you won't be able to function in it anymore. People coming out of jail after 10 years of imprisonment are used to the original iphone as the only smartphone. They don't know about Uber, Venmo, Bitcoin, Amazon and Google have both changed dramatically. Now you need an EZPass for most roads, healthcare laws are different, they missed the whole Snowden ordeal. Weed is borderline legal, gay marriage is legal, etc etc. Things have changed a lot in the past 10 years. If you weren't allowed to keep up with it, you probably don't know how to navigate society anymore.

Jtsummers 10y ago
They aren't buried under rocks or in darkened caves. Their failure to adapt is our failure as a society to prepare them. By imprisoning them we become their guardians and stewards, we are responsible.
jacquesm 10y ago
None of the things you mention would stop someone from re-entering society, in quite a few countries there are rehabilitation programmes in the jails with gradual re-introduction to 'normal' life after longer jail sentences. Yes, this costs money but it helps to reduce recidivism and in general is a good thing to do.
lawpoop 10y ago
Wow, this seems extremely naive. (Honestly I'm feeling like I got trolled.) You don't know of anybody who has never been imprisoned who is managing to live their life without interacting with any of the things you've mentioned? If not, I would recommend enlarging your circle of contact.
- Taek 10y ago
  When you come back to society and try to make friends, everyone is going to be utilizing technology to shape their interactions. Uber makes new types of socializing reasonable. (bars and parties farther away). Phones change how people schedule events. Chips in credit cards change how you spend your money. This isn't trolling. If you don't know how to use modern tech, it's going to be harder to socialize, especially if you are in a city (as they tend to adopt tech faster). If even a person has successfully rejected some tech (maybe Facebook, maybe smartphones), it's doubtful that they've rejected all tech and if they have they've developed skills for living without it among people who otherwise expect them to have it. I might be overstating this on a timeline of one decade, but it gets much worse on a timeline of 20 years. 20 years means you were likely using Windows 95. Texting wasn't a thing. Phones didn't have "apps". Banks didn't have websites. The average person's job had a lot less tech in it. Can you survive? Sure, but your options are a lot more limited compared to someone who knows how to use the tech of the 21st century.
  - jacquesm 10y ago
    It wouldn't take more than a few weeks to learn how to use those newfangled bits of tech. In fact, a very large portion of the world gets along just fine without them. There are far worse consequences to being jailed for 10 years or more than not to be able to use a cell phone or the latest social media fad. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institutional_syndrome https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institutional_syndrome

xiaoma 10y ago

>That is bad, but you can compensate an wrongfully jailed person afterwards. How do you compensate someone for being imprisoned (and likely raped) from the age of 28 to 45? In many cases, the death penalty is more humane.

jacquesm 10y ago
Failure of the prison system to protect its inmates should not become a factor in deciding whether or not it is more 'humane' to kill them outright. The you might as well kill all prisoners because it is more humane, after all where would you draw the line, 5 years, 10 years, 15 or 20, it's all time that has passed. Compensation should be of such a magnitude that it incentivizes society to make sure it happens as little as possible.
lawpoop 10y ago
If that is really true, why do inmates try to get out, instead of killing themselves? Why not just kill themselves after release, since having lived through that is so much worse than death?
maerF0x0 10y ago
As well, its fairly clear that the compensation offered is better than nothing. Sure, it may not be a 1:1 ratio of bad to good (rape to cash) but its clearly a step in the right direction to offer someone a "plus" in recompense for the negatives wrongly imposed.
labster 10y ago
If rape is likely in prison, as you suggest, how is our current prison system not a form of torture?