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> The standard "function keys can do anything" response is getting old. That "function keys can do anything" is, in my opinion, the exact reason they had to go

> The standard "function keys can do anything" response is getting old. That "function keys can do anything" is, in my opinion, the exact reason they had to go. They're scary for the typical user. What is F7? You may know, but it's not obvious in any way. That some of them cause destructive actions (e.g. Alt+F4 on Windows) makes it worse - they're scary to many users. And even when after figuring out what some of them do, one is stuck wondering "was that F8? Or F9? Oh! It was F10" (which, includes the worry that a wrong guess could cause problems). Though, I cannot believe they shipped it without the haptic feedback to make it clear that a button was actually clicked. ^ Also, none of that, to me, includes Esc. Esc seems clear enough in its intent, and I hold no ill-will toward the Esc key.

stephenr 10y ago
Exactly. Particularly once you jump between a few apps, and as I said elsewhere, I can't use media/volume/display controls and f-keys without the function key, so I don't use the f-keys on my existing MBP. Haptic feedback would be interesting..
- robinson7d 10y ago
  The way that for the last couple generations the touchpad hasn't actually "clicked", and been simulated by haptic feedback. That same feeling on the Esc/Cancel/etc. virtual button would alleviate most of my personal concerns. I'm surprised they didn't include it given how much they've been pushing it on iOS, as well as on the touchpad of Macs.
  - Nullabillity 10y ago
    Oh wow, I guess that's why Mac touchpads feel so impressively sluggish to click.
monkmartinez 10y ago
> That "function keys can do anything" is, in my opinion, the exact reason they had to go. They're scary for the typical user. Then make the whole screen touch enabled and bypass the silly, tiny screen gimmick.
- robinson7d 10y ago
  That seems entirely unrelated to what you quoted. Regardless of whether the whole screen becomes a touchscreen, or a bar is used, the F-keys in their form are bad UX.
- stephenr 10y ago
  Adding 'touch' to a UI designed for mouse/trackpad + keyboard interaction is inherently a terrible idea. Even my pinky finger is much bigger than the cursor. I would have zero chance of being accurate with it. Also, that still requires the actual controls to be on-screen somewhere. With the touch bar, you can opt to not have those controls (e.g. a toolbar in an IDE, or a palette in a visual tool like photoshop) shown on the main display if they're available when contextually relevant, on the touch bar.

stephenr 10y ago

Exactly. Particularly once you jump between a few apps, and as I said elsewhere, I can't use media/volume/display controls and f-keys without the function key, so I don't use the f-keys on my existing MBP. Haptic feedback would be interesting..

robinson7d 10y ago
The way that for the last couple generations the touchpad hasn't actually "clicked", and been simulated by haptic feedback. That same feeling on the Esc/Cancel/etc. virtual button would alleviate most of my personal concerns. I'm surprised they didn't include it given how much they've been pushing it on iOS, as well as on the touchpad of Macs.
- Nullabillity 10y ago
  Oh wow, I guess that's why Mac touchpads feel so impressively sluggish to click.

monkmartinez 10y ago

> That "function keys can do anything" is, in my opinion, the exact reason they had to go. They're scary for the typical user. Then make the whole screen touch enabled and bypass the silly, tiny screen gimmick.

robinson7d 10y ago
That seems entirely unrelated to what you quoted. Regardless of whether the whole screen becomes a touchscreen, or a bar is used, the F-keys in their form are bad UX.
stephenr 10y ago
Adding 'touch' to a UI designed for mouse/trackpad + keyboard interaction is inherently a terrible idea. Even my pinky finger is much bigger than the cursor. I would have zero chance of being accurate with it. Also, that still requires the actual controls to be on-screen somewhere. With the touch bar, you can opt to not have those controls (e.g. a toolbar in an IDE, or a palette in a visual tool like photoshop) shown on the main display if they're available when contextually relevant, on the touch bar.