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Been trying to start a small ERP (freelance) business. Basically several years of work, then the partner goes nuts and starts : claiming intellectual property,

by wiz21c 10y ago

Been trying to start a small ERP (freelance) business. Basically several years of work, then the partner goes nuts and starts : claiming intellectual property, threatening with lawyer stuff, etc. All of that is super stressful (and I'm not even in the 25-employees-in-my-company league). Lessons learned : you must be tough to the point where you disgust yourself; humans are even worse than you thought; contracts are a must (like in "whatever you do, even if you're saving the world for free, selling your mother") Meta lesson : managing humans implies stopping being human. If you don't, then you expose yourself to a lot of disappointment and stress... It doesn't mean treating people like shit, it means you break all the bridges between you and them; bye bye empathy, love, etc. The question is : do you want to be that ? And in case you don't know, stress means : perpetually exhausted (that is, you don't have a life beside your job, that is 0 quality time with your wife or children and then you end up wondering "they've grown so much and I don't know them"); pain in every part of the body (that is, even when doing your super job, you aches; blood pressure go up, which means you'll be dead at 40; you get sick much quicker; bad sleep which implies bad health). So stress does hurt. But somehow, I still want to do it : the need for freedom is so big I can't give up :-)

estefan 10y ago
> the need for freedom is so big I can't give up If you really seek freedom, you're probably doing the wrong thing.
- murukesh_s 10y ago
  Not very simple. Especially when you cross into adult/middle age. The freedom we seek is not the actual freedom, but a mere mirage of financial freedom.
  - estefan 10y ago
    Well if it's financial freedom, OP probably has better chances of being rich by working for other people/companies. Let other people take the risk and collect the pay.
    - murukesh_s 10y ago
      Exactly but not many people realize that
murukesh_s 10y ago
I can relate to many things here.. You do feel like stressed out.
TheCowboy 10y ago
One key, if not the key, to being a good manager is empathy. There are different overall approaches, but lacking in empathy is giving up an important tool. If you treat every tool in the manager's toolbox as a hammer, then every problem looks like a nail. This attitude is usually a result of people finding what they expect. If you expect the worst in people, they won't let you down. One shouldn't let negative anecdotes cloud their perspective and hinder their ability to relate to other people. You start ignoring situations where you could have done better and don't accept your role in allowing problems to blow up.
- tsunamifury 10y ago
  He isn't a manager, he is a founder. The management layer is supposed to be the empathetic layer between the worker and the harsh realities of founding, growing and defending the company that pays them.
  - TheCowboy 10y ago
    Founders wear many hats, and having to manage people is usually going to be one of them. I still feel that empathy is important in any other role in life even where one is not a de facto manager in a company. You and the people around you will do better with it than without it.
    - j2bax 10y ago
      Right. Few early founders have a management layer between them and the general employees. That comes years later unless they've secured massive funding and are on an extremely fast growth path (which I'm sure describes a lot of startups as well).
doppel 10y ago
As with everything else, who you surround yourselves with matter a lot. Hindsigt is 20/20, but obviously your co-founder/partner was not the person you were hoping to start the company with, and if you feel you have to "stop being human" to interact with your employees then you should probably re-evaluate whether they are the right people.
Spooky23 10y ago
The partner issue is a big thing. One way to handle that is to require people to put up or shut up with buyout clauses, etc.
chrisdotcode 10y ago
> But somehow, I still want to do it : the need for freedom is so big I can't give up :-) Perhaps there is an alternative freedom? Instead of accumulating so much wealth you don't have to work (as per The American Dream), how about cutting consumption so low (and freeing ourselves from a lot of our first world "needs" like 24/7 entertainment) and trying something self-sustaining like subsistence farming? I feel as if true "freedom" is closer to not relying on "the man" at all, as opposed to attempting to make him your slave.
- UK-AL 10y ago
  subsistence farming is HARD. Much harder than sitting in a chair and writing code. It's not really freedom because all you time is spent simply surviving.
  - generj 10y ago
    Also, it is not freedom because you are subject to the tyranny of the universe ruining your plans. Your crops can fail because of any number of reasons. With true subsistence farming you could die through no fault of your own. You assume all risks for your own survival.
- prostoalex 10y ago
  That seems to work short- and medium-term, but any time people face a financially significant event (marriage, children, parents' disability, spouse's disability, personal disability) they wish they had a larger savings cushion to rely on. Most people's earnings peak between 25 and 45, one can always cut down their consumption and pick up subsistence farming at 50 with a fat corporate 401(k) and a paid-off house.
turar 10y ago
Sadly, this comment would be in good company over at https://www.reddit.com/r/LateStageCapitalism/top/ https://www.reddit.com/r/LateStageCapitalism/top/
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]

by wiz21c 10y ago

estefan 10y ago

> the need for freedom is so big I can't give up If you really seek freedom, you're probably doing the wrong thing.

murukesh_s 10y ago
Not very simple. Especially when you cross into adult/middle age. The freedom we seek is not the actual freedom, but a mere mirage of financial freedom.
- estefan 10y ago
  Well if it's financial freedom, OP probably has better chances of being rich by working for other people/companies. Let other people take the risk and collect the pay.
  - murukesh_s 10y ago
    Exactly but not many people realize that

murukesh_s 10y ago

I can relate to many things here.. You do feel like stressed out.

TheCowboy 10y ago

One key, if not the key, to being a good manager is empathy. There are different overall approaches, but lacking in empathy is giving up an important tool. If you treat every tool in the manager's toolbox as a hammer, then every problem looks like a nail. This attitude is usually a result of people finding what they expect. If you expect the worst in people, they won't let you down. One shouldn't let negative anecdotes cloud their perspective and hinder their ability to relate to other people. You start ignoring situations where you could have done better and don't accept your role in allowing problems to blow up.

tsunamifury 10y ago
He isn't a manager, he is a founder. The management layer is supposed to be the empathetic layer between the worker and the harsh realities of founding, growing and defending the company that pays them.
- TheCowboy 10y ago
  Founders wear many hats, and having to manage people is usually going to be one of them. I still feel that empathy is important in any other role in life even where one is not a de facto manager in a company. You and the people around you will do better with it than without it.
  - j2bax 10y ago
    Right. Few early founders have a management layer between them and the general employees. That comes years later unless they've secured massive funding and are on an extremely fast growth path (which I'm sure describes a lot of startups as well).

doppel 10y ago

As with everything else, who you surround yourselves with matter a lot. Hindsigt is 20/20, but obviously your co-founder/partner was not the person you were hoping to start the company with, and if you feel you have to "stop being human" to interact with your employees then you should probably re-evaluate whether they are the right people.

Spooky23 10y ago

The partner issue is a big thing. One way to handle that is to require people to put up or shut up with buyout clauses, etc.

chrisdotcode 10y ago

> But somehow, I still want to do it : the need for freedom is so big I can't give up :-) Perhaps there is an alternative freedom? Instead of accumulating so much wealth you don't have to work (as per The American Dream), how about cutting consumption so low (and freeing ourselves from a lot of our first world "needs" like 24/7 entertainment) and trying something self-sustaining like subsistence farming? I feel as if true "freedom" is closer to not relying on "the man" at all, as opposed to attempting to make him your slave.

UK-AL 10y ago
subsistence farming is HARD. Much harder than sitting in a chair and writing code. It's not really freedom because all you time is spent simply surviving.
- generj 10y ago
  Also, it is not freedom because you are subject to the tyranny of the universe ruining your plans. Your crops can fail because of any number of reasons. With true subsistence farming you could die through no fault of your own. You assume all risks for your own survival.
prostoalex 10y ago
That seems to work short- and medium-term, but any time people face a financially significant event (marriage, children, parents' disability, spouse's disability, personal disability) they wish they had a larger savings cushion to rely on. Most people's earnings peak between 25 and 45, one can always cut down their consumption and pick up subsistence farming at 50 with a fat corporate 401(k) and a paid-off house.

turar 10y ago

Sadly, this comment would be in good company over at https://www.reddit.com/r/LateStageCapitalism/top/ https://www.reddit.com/r/LateStageCapitalism/top/

deleted 10y ago

[deleted]