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> What's funny to me is that I have several neighbors who fervently describe themselves as pro-capitalist libertarians. Yet, when I'm out of coffee or I need my

> What's funny to me is that I have several neighbors who fervently describe themselves as pro-capitalist libertarians. Yet, when I'm out of coffee or I need my driveway plowed, they do it for free. Why is that? Probably because we are all friends and have common culture and mutual trust. Even if there is no money involved, you may repay such favors in the future when they ask you. So it's more like borrowing a favor. > why can't we all have a society where we all act as neighbors Why can't we have that within capitalism? What does "act as neighbor" even mean? Does it helping one another for free? That already occurs for small tasks.

ap22213 10y ago
With regard to neighbors, there is hard-wired reciprocity involved. And, if one doesn't reciprocate, they may eventually be cut off from future generosity. On the other hand, many people genuinely get pleasure out of helping others. And, there are certain classes of people to whom special treatment is given - like the elderly and children. Don't get me wrong. I'm not a communist, and I'm not completely against capitalism. Capitalism can be beneficial, especially in distributing resources. And, I understand and agree that capitalism is not a zero sum game (at least at the instant of the transaction). But, transactions are rarely equally beneficial. In fact, in the long run, transactions can actually harm one or more parties, especially those indirectly affected. And, based on my observations, it seems easiest to 'win at capitalism' via monopoly, deception, manipulation, trickery, and abusing intent. Furthermore, what do we with those who are just unable to produce anything of value? it's implied that they just die. So, generally, I'm not a fan of it (although I've also made a lot of money from it). But, what I dislike even more is the cop-out that it's somehow impossible for us to do better - that somehow 'natural laws' prevent it.
- witty_username 10y ago
  > Furthermore, what do we with those who are just unable to produce anything of value? it's implied that they just die. Capitalism doesn't stop a person from donating to those people. Indeed, that's what happens through the government.
  - humanrebar 10y ago
    It's not really a donation if it's not voluntary. Whether someone should be supported by the government is an interesting question but calling taxes and welfare donations is doublespeak.
    - witty_username 10y ago
      You're right.

ap22213 10y ago

With regard to neighbors, there is hard-wired reciprocity involved. And, if one doesn't reciprocate, they may eventually be cut off from future generosity. On the other hand, many people genuinely get pleasure out of helping others. And, there are certain classes of people to whom special treatment is given - like the elderly and children. Don't get me wrong. I'm not a communist, and I'm not completely against capitalism. Capitalism can be beneficial, especially in distributing resources. And, I understand and agree that capitalism is not a zero sum game (at least at the instant of the transaction). But, transactions are rarely equally beneficial. In fact, in the long run, transactions can actually harm one or more parties, especially those indirectly affected. And, based on my observations, it seems easiest to 'win at capitalism' via monopoly, deception, manipulation, trickery, and abusing intent. Furthermore, what do we with those who are just unable to produce anything of value? it's implied that they just die. So, generally, I'm not a fan of it (although I've also made a lot of money from it). But, what I dislike even more is the cop-out that it's somehow impossible for us to do better - that somehow 'natural laws' prevent it.

witty_username 10y ago
> Furthermore, what do we with those who are just unable to produce anything of value? it's implied that they just die. Capitalism doesn't stop a person from donating to those people. Indeed, that's what happens through the government.
- humanrebar 10y ago
  It's not really a donation if it's not voluntary. Whether someone should be supported by the government is an interesting question but calling taxes and welfare donations is doublespeak.
  - witty_username 10y ago
    You're right.