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> you need a dongle or an USB-C to Lightning cable. Those exist. And so do any USB-C to any other USB-Plug cables. Considering that Apple revises their hardwa

by pilif 10y ago

> you need a dongle or an USB-C to Lightning cable. Those exist. And so do any USB-C to any other USB-Plug cables. Considering that Apple revises their hardware builds about every four years, it makes sense to move to strictly USB-C now as two years from now, I'm quite sure no more peripheral will come out that has anything but USB-C. So within the next 2-3 years you'll have collected heaps of USB-C cables that will connect your devices directly to your MacBook Pro. No dongles what so ever. USB-C is so much better than anything other USB that came before to the point where it can (and will) easily replace not only all other existing USB plugs out there, including on the device end (where there's a mess between USB-B, USB Mini and USB Micro right now) but also has the potential to replace the various ways how we currently connect screens (DisplayPort, DVI, HDMI, or even VGA). Going purely USB-C means that they could optimise as much as possible for this new connector without thinking of wasting space for a useless connector three years down the road, especially as you can convert USB-C to any other USB, but if they added an USB-A port, that would not be useful for anything but USB-A plugs.

busterarm 10y ago
With the abysmally low margins typically made off of keyboards and mice along with the fact that the highend of the market is driven by desktop gamers, I think you're going to see plain USB Keyboards and Mice sticking around for a long, long, long, long time. Hell, I can still buy some of my favorite keyboards with a PS/2 connection or with an included adapter. I've been using external devices for these with my macbook for years. Edit: In fact, I think this applies to almost any low-cost, low-margin pluggable. Laptop coolers/fans are another. Either USB-C is going to kill the market for these or you're wrong.
- pilif 10y ago
  > I think you're going to see plain USB Keyboards and Mice sticking around for a long, long, long, long time I'm not saying the old USB A peripherals will stop to exist. I'm saying that two years from now every conceivable peripheral will be available with a USB-C plug or at least a USB-C to whatever they need cable.
  - busterarm 10y ago
    And in the case of the devices I mentioned, that will almost always be a dongle. No thanks.
slg 10y ago
Like I said in another post, is a new single purpose cable a solution for a missing dongle if I still have to carry the old cable with me too? Great, I don't need a USB-C to USB-A dongle, I just need both my USB-C to lightning and USB-A to lightning cables. It is the same problem, just shifting around the inconvenience. And if USB-C is so great and the future of all tech, why isn't Apple moving to it on their mobile devices? In my mind the problem isn't the specific technology used on any of these devices. The problem is that the devices aren't using the same technology between them.
- pilif 10y ago
  >And if USB-C is so great and the future of all tech, why isn't Apple moving to it on their mobile devices? because the proprietary Lightning plug allows them to control who is connecting to their phones and it allows them to charge for the privilege of doing so. What's happening on the other end of that USB-Cable that's the question. My guess: In the package of the next (or the one after) they will ship an USB-C to Lightning cable.
- melling 10y ago
  Google has moved to USB-C with the Pixel. https://madeby.google.com/phone/ https://madeby.google.com/phone/ Within 24 months, most Android phones will ship with USB-C. That's over a billion devices a year. http://www.theverge.com/2016/6/1/11836816/iphone-vs-android-history-charts http://www.theverge.com/2016/6/1/11836816/iphone-vs-android-... Chromebook are starting to ship with USB-C. http://venturebeat.com/2016/10/03/hp-chromebook-13-review-the-best-chrome-os-machine-available-today/ http://venturebeat.com/2016/10/03/hp-chromebook-13-review-th... USB-C is the future. I'm really not sure why PC vendors having put a couple of all of their desktops and laptops. Many will probably offer both A and C, for at least a few years. If you have buy a new computer with 0 USB-C ports, you're going to regret it in a few years.
  - Ph0X 10y ago
    They had actually moved even before that with 5X and 6P. They were some of the first phones to do it. I believe a few samsung and other phones have already switched too. In my opinion, that's courage that actually matters. USB-C is a huge step forward which everyone will benefit from once we all move. Removing the audio jack? meh.
chimeracoder 10y ago
> Considering that Apple revises their hardware builds about every four years, it makes sense to move to strictly USB-C now This would make a lot more sense if Apple had switched the iPhone to USB-C as well. That way, you really could just use one cable for everything. Instead, you need three separate charger for your iPhone, Macbook Pro, and Apple Watch. Oh, and the iPhone comes with lightning-USB-A cables, which means you can't even connect a brand-new iPhone to a Macbook Pro out-of-the-box without getting a dongle. High-end Android phones like the Nexus 5x, 6P, and Pixel already use USB-C, as do some non-flagship Android phones. It's brilliant - it means I only need to carry one charger for both my phone and my computer, and that charger also can be dismantled if I want to connect my phone to my computer.
- pilif 10y ago
  >This would make a lot more sense if Apple had switched the iPhone to USB-C as well yes. it would have. And this is the actual problem there. Lightning is just another way of controlling their walled-garden around iOS and I really hate it for that reason. But that's beside the point of the port choice of the new Macs: The phones always have a lightning port, so the cable connecting to them will always have a lighting plug on one end. What they could have done is ship the iPhone with an USB-C to Lightning cable instead of a USB-A to Lightning cable, but then people would have been even more pissed as USB-C isn't that wide-spread yet and in-fact until yesterday was only supported by one single machine made by Apple.
  - MagnumOpus 10y ago
    > [USB-C] in-fact until yesterday was only supported by one single machine made by Apple Really, have a look at this [1] half-year-old list of 10 non-Apple laptops that have USB-C ports... Of course pretty much all of these have USB-A ports too, because their manufacturers don't have a blind following and actually have to compete with each other. [1] http://windowsreport.com/usb-c-laptops/ http://windowsreport.com/usb-c-laptops/
    - pilif 10y ago
easytiger 10y ago
> or an USB-C to Lightning cable. How is that different in any way?
- masklinn 10y ago
  Before: you were carrying a cable (type A - lightning) GP: you have to carry a cable (type A - lightning) and a dongle (type A - type C) rage rage eleventyone If you have a brain: you carry a cable (type C - lightning)
- Dru89 10y ago
  Instead of two things, you just need one. They're saying that instead of a USB-A-to-Lightning cable and a USB-A-to-USB-C adapter, you can just use the one cable.
dan1234 10y ago
I think Apple could’ve avoided a lot of the hate if they’d bundled a few of the more common adapters as standard, to ease people through the transition to using USB-C for everything. If I bought a new MBP today, I’d need: * a Thunderbolt 3 (USB-C) to Thunderbolt 2 Adapter at £49 * a USB-C Digital AV Multiport Adapter (giving HDMI and a USB port) at £69 * a USB-C to USB Adapter at £19 That’s £137 just to connect the things I have currently connected to my 2015 MBP (external monitor, Thunderbolt HD, my phone and a USB->FTDI programmer).
- ageektrapped 10y ago
  Couldn't agree more. I priced Macbook Pro 15" plus adapters in CDN $ and got sticker shock.
  - akramhussein 10y ago
    Did the same in UK. They also bumped the prices in the UK for all machines due to the fall in GBP. Double shock.
    - pulse7 10y ago
      Did you vote for brexit? ;-)
      - akramhussein 10y ago
        No
- sosborn 10y ago
  This would lessen the blow: http://www.monoprice.com/search/index?keyword=usb-c+adapter http://www.monoprice.com/search/index?keyword=usb-c+adapter
kentt 10y ago
> So within the next 2-3 years you'll have collected heaps of USB-C... I agree with you that in the future USB-C is better and makes more sense. However, I don't think that the logical conclusion is that we should get rid of USB-A prematurely. I liken this the the decision to remove the CD from computer when CD were still used daily. I agreed that CDs wouldn't be used in the future, but, that doesn't do much for me if I still use CD daily. In hindsight it just caused an unnecessary annoyance while the CDs were naturally phased out.
- vlozko 10y ago
  That's the price of progress and this dropping support of older technology sooner than everyone else has been part of Apple's MO forever. The day 3rd parties will stop making older parts/accessories is the day they're no longer viable to make. If Apple were to keep a USB A jack for legacy compatibility reasons, 3rd parties will certainly delay moving forward to the new USB-C standard.

by pilif 10y ago

busterarm 10y ago

With the abysmally low margins typically made off of keyboards and mice along with the fact that the highend of the market is driven by desktop gamers, I think you're going to see plain USB Keyboards and Mice sticking around for a long, long, long, long time. Hell, I can still buy some of my favorite keyboards with a PS/2 connection or with an included adapter. I've been using external devices for these with my macbook for years. Edit: In fact, I think this applies to almost any low-cost, low-margin pluggable. Laptop coolers/fans are another. Either USB-C is going to kill the market for these or you're wrong.

pilif 10y ago
> I think you're going to see plain USB Keyboards and Mice sticking around for a long, long, long, long time I'm not saying the old USB A peripherals will stop to exist. I'm saying that two years from now every conceivable peripheral will be available with a USB-C plug or at least a USB-C to whatever they need cable.
- busterarm 10y ago
  And in the case of the devices I mentioned, that will almost always be a dongle. No thanks.

slg 10y ago

Like I said in another post, is a new single purpose cable a solution for a missing dongle if I still have to carry the old cable with me too? Great, I don't need a USB-C to USB-A dongle, I just need both my USB-C to lightning and USB-A to lightning cables. It is the same problem, just shifting around the inconvenience. And if USB-C is so great and the future of all tech, why isn't Apple moving to it on their mobile devices? In my mind the problem isn't the specific technology used on any of these devices. The problem is that the devices aren't using the same technology between them.

pilif 10y ago
>And if USB-C is so great and the future of all tech, why isn't Apple moving to it on their mobile devices? because the proprietary Lightning plug allows them to control who is connecting to their phones and it allows them to charge for the privilege of doing so. What's happening on the other end of that USB-Cable that's the question. My guess: In the package of the next (or the one after) they will ship an USB-C to Lightning cable.
melling 10y ago
Google has moved to USB-C with the Pixel. https://madeby.google.com/phone/ https://madeby.google.com/phone/ Within 24 months, most Android phones will ship with USB-C. That's over a billion devices a year. http://www.theverge.com/2016/6/1/11836816/iphone-vs-android-history-charts http://www.theverge.com/2016/6/1/11836816/iphone-vs-android-... Chromebook are starting to ship with USB-C. http://venturebeat.com/2016/10/03/hp-chromebook-13-review-the-best-chrome-os-machine-available-today/ http://venturebeat.com/2016/10/03/hp-chromebook-13-review-th... USB-C is the future. I'm really not sure why PC vendors having put a couple of all of their desktops and laptops. Many will probably offer both A and C, for at least a few years. If you have buy a new computer with 0 USB-C ports, you're going to regret it in a few years.
- Ph0X 10y ago
  They had actually moved even before that with 5X and 6P. They were some of the first phones to do it. I believe a few samsung and other phones have already switched too. In my opinion, that's courage that actually matters. USB-C is a huge step forward which everyone will benefit from once we all move. Removing the audio jack? meh.

chimeracoder 10y ago

> Considering that Apple revises their hardware builds about every four years, it makes sense to move to strictly USB-C now This would make a lot more sense if Apple had switched the iPhone to USB-C as well. That way, you really could just use one cable for everything. Instead, you need three separate charger for your iPhone, Macbook Pro, and Apple Watch. Oh, and the iPhone comes with lightning-USB-A cables, which means you can't even connect a brand-new iPhone to a Macbook Pro out-of-the-box without getting a dongle. High-end Android phones like the Nexus 5x, 6P, and Pixel already use USB-C, as do some non-flagship Android phones. It's brilliant - it means I only need to carry one charger for both my phone and my computer, and that charger also can be dismantled if I want to connect my phone to my computer.

pilif 10y ago
>This would make a lot more sense if Apple had switched the iPhone to USB-C as well yes. it would have. And this is the actual problem there. Lightning is just another way of controlling their walled-garden around iOS and I really hate it for that reason. But that's beside the point of the port choice of the new Macs: The phones always have a lightning port, so the cable connecting to them will always have a lighting plug on one end. What they could have done is ship the iPhone with an USB-C to Lightning cable instead of a USB-A to Lightning cable, but then people would have been even more pissed as USB-C isn't that wide-spread yet and in-fact until yesterday was only supported by one single machine made by Apple.
- MagnumOpus 10y ago
  > [USB-C] in-fact until yesterday was only supported by one single machine made by Apple Really, have a look at this [1] half-year-old list of 10 non-Apple laptops that have USB-C ports... Of course pretty much all of these have USB-A ports too, because their manufacturers don't have a blind following and actually have to compete with each other. [1] http://windowsreport.com/usb-c-laptops/ http://windowsreport.com/usb-c-laptops/
  - pilif 10y ago

easytiger 10y ago

> or an USB-C to Lightning cable. How is that different in any way?

masklinn 10y ago
Before: you were carrying a cable (type A - lightning) GP: you have to carry a cable (type A - lightning) and a dongle (type A - type C) rage rage eleventyone If you have a brain: you carry a cable (type C - lightning)
Dru89 10y ago
Instead of two things, you just need one. They're saying that instead of a USB-A-to-Lightning cable and a USB-A-to-USB-C adapter, you can just use the one cable.

dan1234 10y ago

I think Apple could’ve avoided a lot of the hate if they’d bundled a few of the more common adapters as standard, to ease people through the transition to using USB-C for everything. If I bought a new MBP today, I’d need: * a Thunderbolt 3 (USB-C) to Thunderbolt 2 Adapter at £49 * a USB-C Digital AV Multiport Adapter (giving HDMI and a USB port) at £69 * a USB-C to USB Adapter at £19 That’s £137 just to connect the things I have currently connected to my 2015 MBP (external monitor, Thunderbolt HD, my phone and a USB->FTDI programmer).

ageektrapped 10y ago
Couldn't agree more. I priced Macbook Pro 15" plus adapters in CDN $ and got sticker shock.
- akramhussein 10y ago
  Did the same in UK. They also bumped the prices in the UK for all machines due to the fall in GBP. Double shock.
  - pulse7 10y ago
    Did you vote for brexit? ;-)
    - akramhussein 10y ago
      No
sosborn 10y ago
This would lessen the blow: http://www.monoprice.com/search/index?keyword=usb-c+adapter http://www.monoprice.com/search/index?keyword=usb-c+adapter

kentt 10y ago

> So within the next 2-3 years you'll have collected heaps of USB-C... I agree with you that in the future USB-C is better and makes more sense. However, I don't think that the logical conclusion is that we should get rid of USB-A prematurely. I liken this the the decision to remove the CD from computer when CD were still used daily. I agreed that CDs wouldn't be used in the future, but, that doesn't do much for me if I still use CD daily. In hindsight it just caused an unnecessary annoyance while the CDs were naturally phased out.

vlozko 10y ago
That's the price of progress and this dropping support of older technology sooner than everyone else has been part of Apple's MO forever. The day 3rd parties will stop making older parts/accessories is the day they're no longer viable to make. If Apple were to keep a USB A jack for legacy compatibility reasons, 3rd parties will certainly delay moving forward to the new USB-C standard.