5 ms·

"More recently Qandeel Baloch, who came from a village in Pakistan's Punjab region, used social media to gain celebrity by posting provocative selfies online. K

by docdeek 10y ago

"More recently Qandeel Baloch, who came from a village in Pakistan's Punjab region, used social media to gain celebrity by posting provocative selfies online. Known as the Kim Kardashian of Pakistan, she challenged Pakistani social norms by embracing the sexualised culture of the internet - until she was strangled by her brother in July this year for bringing shame on the family.” That paragraph got dark real fast.

dogma1138 10y ago
This is sadly not uncommon, it just was a fairly famous case because she had a lot of followers in the west. Honor killings are sadly the norm in many parts of the world, and are not even that rare anymore in the west at least as far as Europe goes.
- digi_owl 10y ago
  I don't think they ever was rare in the west, they just took on a different character. Anyone recall hearing on the news about a "family tragedy" where a family was found dead, apparently at the hands of the father killing his wife and children? While i am unsure if there is any real research done on those i suspect that said father has run into bad news of some kind, felt he can no longer perform his role as the man of the house, and decide to take everyone with him as he goes.
  - dogma1138 10y ago
    Well family killings yeah, but honor killings are a specific category since they are almost unilaterally target women who "dishonored" the family for expressing their agency. Not saying they are inherently worse than any other tragedy they are just well defined.
  - ConfuciusSay02 10y ago
    What you describe are not honor killings. In North America, statistically speaking, the mother is more likely to kill the children than the father.
pjc50 10y ago
And people wonder why feminism is important. It's not just a non-western phenomenon. The church in Ireland operated a system of forced labour detention for women considered "immoral" known as the Magdalene Laundries: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magdalene_Laundries_in_Ireland https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magdalene_Laundries_in_Ireland . The last one closed in 1996. There was eventually a state apology and compensation, but astonishingly as far as I can tell nobody has even been properly prosecuted for it. "Patriarchy" is a word that often seems over-used, but only because violent words and attitudes have so often been the prelude for violent actions with state and social complicity. You can find plenty of cases in the west where women speak up and face death threats. Such as for suggesting that a woman's face appear on some bank notes: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-25641941 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-25641941 The line between people sending death threats on twitter and the person who strangled his sister for posting selfies is very thin.
- EdiX 10y ago
  And people wonder why feminism is important. It's not just a non-western phenomenon. (...) The last one closed in 1996. That's 20 years ago.
  - pjc50 10y ago
    And 9/11 was fifteen years ago! Doesn't time fly?
    - EdiX 10y ago
      Yep, if 9/11 was the only example of islamic terrorism in the last twenty years I would definitely agree that worries about it are outdated.
- saiya-jin 10y ago
  feminism in the true meaning is very important, and it's mission might be +-over in the west, but a lot of work to be done elsewhere. i have an issue though with so called feminist women that don't care about gender equality, but they want just all the benefits for them, without other parts that naturally come with them (ie be always treated like a princess but as equal at the same time - come on, we're not schizophrenics, and so on - list could be endless). most of them don't care much about what is happening in truly oppressive places around the globe (yeah, it's horrible! can you name few cases? what???), they just found another way to yell at others and express life frustrations, and at this time most don't have balls to actually argue to not be labeled sexist and whatnot. you think I am talking about some imaginary caricatures - far from that, and those beings give feminism a very bad name and prohibit the whole movement to be taken seriously in some circles. too loud where it doesn't matter anymore, and too quiet where it should.

by docdeek 10y ago

dogma1138 10y ago

This is sadly not uncommon, it just was a fairly famous case because she had a lot of followers in the west. Honor killings are sadly the norm in many parts of the world, and are not even that rare anymore in the west at least as far as Europe goes.

digi_owl 10y ago
I don't think they ever was rare in the west, they just took on a different character. Anyone recall hearing on the news about a "family tragedy" where a family was found dead, apparently at the hands of the father killing his wife and children? While i am unsure if there is any real research done on those i suspect that said father has run into bad news of some kind, felt he can no longer perform his role as the man of the house, and decide to take everyone with him as he goes.
- dogma1138 10y ago
  Well family killings yeah, but honor killings are a specific category since they are almost unilaterally target women who "dishonored" the family for expressing their agency. Not saying they are inherently worse than any other tragedy they are just well defined.
- ConfuciusSay02 10y ago
  What you describe are not honor killings. In North America, statistically speaking, the mother is more likely to kill the children than the father.

pjc50 10y ago

And people wonder why feminism is important. It's not just a non-western phenomenon. The church in Ireland operated a system of forced labour detention for women considered "immoral" known as the Magdalene Laundries: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magdalene_Laundries_in_Ireland https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magdalene_Laundries_in_Ireland . The last one closed in 1996. There was eventually a state apology and compensation, but astonishingly as far as I can tell nobody has even been properly prosecuted for it. "Patriarchy" is a word that often seems over-used, but only because violent words and attitudes have so often been the prelude for violent actions with state and social complicity. You can find plenty of cases in the west where women speak up and face death threats. Such as for suggesting that a woman's face appear on some bank notes: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-25641941 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-25641941 The line between people sending death threats on twitter and the person who strangled his sister for posting selfies is very thin.

EdiX 10y ago
And people wonder why feminism is important. It's not just a non-western phenomenon. (...) The last one closed in 1996. That's 20 years ago.
- pjc50 10y ago
  And 9/11 was fifteen years ago! Doesn't time fly?
  - EdiX 10y ago
    Yep, if 9/11 was the only example of islamic terrorism in the last twenty years I would definitely agree that worries about it are outdated.
saiya-jin 10y ago
feminism in the true meaning is very important, and it's mission might be +-over in the west, but a lot of work to be done elsewhere. i have an issue though with so called feminist women that don't care about gender equality, but they want just all the benefits for them, without other parts that naturally come with them (ie be always treated like a princess but as equal at the same time - come on, we're not schizophrenics, and so on - list could be endless). most of them don't care much about what is happening in truly oppressive places around the globe (yeah, it's horrible! can you name few cases? what???), they just found another way to yell at others and express life frustrations, and at this time most don't have balls to actually argue to not be labeled sexist and whatnot. you think I am talking about some imaginary caricatures - far from that, and those beings give feminism a very bad name and prohibit the whole movement to be taken seriously in some circles. too loud where it doesn't matter anymore, and too quiet where it should.