3 ms·

I hope they will look at Erlang/OTP instead of Java EE for inspiration.

tormeh 10y ago
I've seen people try to recreate Erlang/OTP in Java. See OpenCloud Rhino. They never really get there. It's kind of sad to watch. I mean, it's useful if you absolutely have to use Java, but it's expensive and a pale imitation of Erlang/OTP. I'm confident that it will remain so until it dies.
- qaq 10y ago
  Trying to emulate Erlang/OTP on JVM is just a form of a cargo cult :)
- deleted 10y ago
  [deleted]
qaq 10y ago
I seriously doubt they can it would break too many things.
hota_mazi 10y ago
Why? Java EE has a much stronger success track record than Erlang/OTP does.
- nodivbyzero 10y ago
  Could you provide examples?
  - hota_mazi 10y ago
    There are millions of lines of enterprise Java code running these days and a good chunk of these are using Java EE. The trend has started moving away from it these past years but it's pretty clear that even the worst and early versions of Java EE (looking at you, EJB 2) have been used to power massive web sites and applications that are still in use today. Erlang/OTP is nonexistent in comparison.
    - dschiptsov 10y ago
      Now, please, try to think about to what degree (how many orders of magnitude) the Whatsapp ecosystem, which has been build on top of OTP, are more efficient in terms of data throughput, resource usage (both memory and CPU cycles wasted on thread scheduling and looking and busy waiting) and reliability (think of Facebook Messanger too), how many times less lines of code it has, to what degree the code is less verbose, less repetitive and hence more readable and maintainable. I could give you a hint: the whole standard library of Erlang is (including optional type declarations for each function) schiptsov@Ideapad:~/Compile/otp/lib/stdlib/src$ du -sh . 2.6M . I do not have Java sources. Processed junk food is absolutely dominant form of human nutrition in the world. Does this fact makes junk food better than evolved (carefully selected) traditional dishes of rural communities, adapted to the local food sources and seasons?
      - hota_mazi 10y ago
        Yes, WhatsApp. Of course. The only successful platform using Erlang (although to what extent, not quite clear). What's also not clear is whether that platform would have been more successful or easier to design with another technology. We'll never know. What we know is that, like I said, the number of Java EE projects out there absolutely dwarfs the number of Erlang projects. That was my one and only point. I never compared the quality of these two platforms, I just offered a simple mind share fact.
Kexoth 10y ago
What is your opinion on Elixir as a next generation with the OTP approach? I'm a Swift developer, I'm learning Elixir & I love OTP's model. In my opinion Apple or anyone else won't go in that direction is because it's way different & it's learning curve will push most developers away.

I've seen people try to recreate Erlang/OTP in Java. See OpenCloud Rhino. They never really get there. It's kind of sad to watch. I mean, it's useful if you absolutely have to use Java, but it's expensive and a pale imitation of Erlang/OTP. I'm confident that it will remain so until it dies.

qaq 10y ago
Trying to emulate Erlang/OTP on JVM is just a form of a cargo cult :)
deleted 10y ago
[deleted]

qaq 10y ago

I seriously doubt they can it would break too many things.

hota_mazi 10y ago

Why? Java EE has a much stronger success track record than Erlang/OTP does.

nodivbyzero 10y ago
Could you provide examples?
- hota_mazi 10y ago
  There are millions of lines of enterprise Java code running these days and a good chunk of these are using Java EE. The trend has started moving away from it these past years but it's pretty clear that even the worst and early versions of Java EE (looking at you, EJB 2) have been used to power massive web sites and applications that are still in use today. Erlang/OTP is nonexistent in comparison.
  - dschiptsov 10y ago
    Now, please, try to think about to what degree (how many orders of magnitude) the Whatsapp ecosystem, which has been build on top of OTP, are more efficient in terms of data throughput, resource usage (both memory and CPU cycles wasted on thread scheduling and looking and busy waiting) and reliability (think of Facebook Messanger too), how many times less lines of code it has, to what degree the code is less verbose, less repetitive and hence more readable and maintainable. I could give you a hint: the whole standard library of Erlang is (including optional type declarations for each function) schiptsov@Ideapad:~/Compile/otp/lib/stdlib/src$ du -sh . 2.6M . I do not have Java sources. Processed junk food is absolutely dominant form of human nutrition in the world. Does this fact makes junk food better than evolved (carefully selected) traditional dishes of rural communities, adapted to the local food sources and seasons?
    - hota_mazi 10y ago
      Yes, WhatsApp. Of course. The only successful platform using Erlang (although to what extent, not quite clear). What's also not clear is whether that platform would have been more successful or easier to design with another technology. We'll never know. What we know is that, like I said, the number of Java EE projects out there absolutely dwarfs the number of Erlang projects. That was my one and only point. I never compared the quality of these two platforms, I just offered a simple mind share fact.

Kexoth 10y ago

What is your opinion on Elixir as a next generation with the OTP approach? I'm a Swift developer, I'm learning Elixir & I love OTP's model. In my opinion Apple or anyone else won't go in that direction is because it's way different & it's learning curve will push most developers away.