8 ms·

Microsoft hikes U.K. prices by 22%

49 points by sghi 10y ago

baconizer 10y ago
2000s: It's expensive doing business in the UK: price hike 2007: Business needs to be protected from Pound fluctuation: we accepted the new norm that a $500 gadget cost £500 2016: Brexit hurt our company earnings : like I care, we are full stack OSS
- imdsm 10y ago
  These were my thoughts exactly. Companies can jump on Brexit and hike prices, that's fine, they will be selling less for more, which will bring them the same revenues. We use full stack OSS too, not a penny spent on licences. Have fun with your 22% M$.
hd4 10y ago
Preaching to the converted here, but this is yet another incentive to switch to a Linux distro, thanks Microsoft. Also worth remembering that Britain is still de facto in the EU for a few more years.
- mhroth 10y ago
  Yes but the pound is tanking _now_ ;)
  - hd4 10y ago
    Fluctuating rather than tanking.
    - joncrocks 10y ago
      Repeatedly fluctuating downwards :-)
  - DominikR 10y ago
    Britain has basically a Communist running the country right now so it's not really a surprise. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2016/10/05/no-prime-minister-the-government-doesnt-always-know-whats-best/ http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2016/10/05/no-prime-mini... Theresa May could have done all kinds of things to force favourable Brexit terms for the UK. For example she could continuously lower corporate taxes for foreign investment for while not activating Article 50 and simply wait until it really hurts the EU. If the EU doesn't give in the UK continues to wait and makes a lot of money in the process, if it does then the UK also wins. I suspect that the UK's prime minister actually wants to tank the economy to do another Brexit vote. (the EU loves this, just repeat until you get the desired result - that's one of the reasons why the EU will fail) She really wants to join her friends at the Soviet High Command in Brussels again.
    - slgeorge 10y ago
      Don't really think that's realistic. In all honesty, the easiest way to tank the Brexit vote would have been to allow MP's a vote in Parliament - which would have been perfectly constitutionally valid - since the majority of politicians "appear" to be against Brexit. If anything, I see a firmer commitment to Brexit over time - as demonstrated by allowing the banks to leave London by not closing down "hard" Brexit.
    - Xylakant 10y ago
      > For example she could continuously lower corporate taxes for foreign investment for while not activating Article 50 and simply wait until it really hurts the EU. If the EU doesn't give in the UK continues to wait and makes a lot of money in the process, if it does then the UK also wins. As the irish figured out, arbitrarily low corporate taxes are just not possible in the EU. This approach would also alienate all partners that she needs to work with later in the process, so that's probably a pretty bad idea. Additionally, it would put her under massive pressure from the brexit fraction that wants migration control yesterday, no matter the costs. Last but not least, the EU could just take the stance that the continued announcements of the legal government to invoke article 50 constitute sufficient grounds to start the proceedings. The UK could certainly fight this, but well, there's sufficient ways for the EU to make the UK sufficiently miserable in turn. All in all, negotiation tactics that alienate the people on the other side are not a good idea if you're an island and the economy right across the channel is bigger than yours.
  - karmacoda 10y ago
    Confidence underlies the economic outlook - the remainers being negative are now the UK's biggest problem.
    - jon-wood 10y ago
      Seriously? The people pointing out how the country is heading down a massively idiotic path because Rupert Murdoch would like us to are the UK's biggest problem? I'm going to list a few other candidates for the UK's biggest problem: * The pound plummeting like a rock. * Xenophobia, bordering on fascism, being advocated by the press. * The gradual, quiet, handing of the NHS to private companies. * Ever growing demand for food banks, most notably by people working jobs that don't pay enough to fulfil basic needs. * The only vaguely viable opposition to the government self-destructing right when they're needed most. But sure, its definitely people complaining that are the problem.
      - karmacoda 10y ago
        * The pound plummeting like a rock. - Expected period of adjustment. * Xenophobia, bordering on fascism, being advocated by the press. - BBC is nothing but a continuous charity appeal. * The gradual, quiet, handing of the NHS to private companies. - Precedes Brexit. * Ever growing demand for food banks, most notably by people working jobs that don't pay enough to fulfil basic needs. - Precedes Brexit. * The only vaguely viable opposition to the government self-destructing right when they're needed most. - Precedes Brexit. Completely off-topic.
        crottypeter 10y ago
        Yes, the conservatives were in before Brexit. These things are still: >"candidates for the UK's biggest problem"
        imdsm 10y ago
        So much focus on all the potential problems, ignoring all the potential benefits. This is why the world is the way it is.
- xabi 10y ago
  It's dangerous to go alone!
- guitarbill 10y ago
  > Also worth remembering that Britain is still de facto in the EU for a few more years. I'd argue Britain is de facto out of the EU already. Anybody planning for the future is operating under this assumption. A few concrete examples: Scientific collaborations, corporate growth plans, and policy-making has all been impacted AFAIK.
wilhil 10y ago
Who knows the truth about Brexit just yet... Trade deals will come in and we will probably get back to where we were - in the long term. ... If/when we get there, any bets Microsoft will not lower pricing?
andygates 10y ago
As a huge healthcare org with solid MS lock-in: ouch. Brexy-fans can say it's "fluctuating not tanking"; we still have to pay more for software (and less for hospital beds, staff, and so on. In big orgs these costs are gibberring). (personally I'm betting on EUR-GBP parity by xmas, because my Cassandra gland is firing overtime)
- jstanley 10y ago
  What's a Cassandra gland?
  - wojcech 10y ago
    If I have to guess, the primary organ used in prediction of the future, especially catastrophes
  - kagamine 10y ago
    And how can costs be gibbering? Staggering via autocorrect?
    - andwur 10y ago
      I think they mean that viewing the costs induces gibbering in the viewer.
- dx034 10y ago
  Don't worry, it was promised that the NHS gets £350m more per week after Brexit. http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/brexit-vote-leave-wipes-nhs-350m-claim-and-rest-of-its-website-after-eu-referendum-a7105546.html http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/brexit-vote-l...
swang 10y ago
I really have no idea bout UK/British politics even though I worked/lived in Europe so... Can someone explain this part of Brexit. Nigel Farage resigns in July 2016 after he wins the vote. Why? Says he did "his job" and didn't want to be a career politician (according to Wiki) Then earlier this month he stepped back in as party leader of UKIP after his replacement was forced(?) out/unable to garner support? Did he just get bored and want his job back? Seems like he has ample time to fly over to the States to pump up Trump. What I'm trying to get at is this whole Brexit triggered a huge depression in the value of the Pound. Yet the Conservatives and UKIP are still in power? Or can no one do anything until the next general elections?
- gadders 10y ago
  UKIP aren't in power. They have one MP who is an ex-Conservative. Fluctuations in the value of the pound don't normally bring down governments.
- agd 10y ago
  UKIP are not in power and have never been. They have 1 MP out of 650. In answer to your wider point, I think you're reducing the problem to the value of the pound when there are many more factors at play ('sovereignty', border controls, democracy etc). Plus, many people viewed sterling as overvalued so a fall might not be too bad a thing. It might be that, in time, the negative economic consequences of Brexit affect the Conservatives in the polls but it's too early for that.
- dx034 10y ago
  Regarding your last point: A depreciation of the currency is generally positive for a country. Expensive imports give incentive to use local products (e.g. food), at the same time exports become more competitive. That is the reason why the US accused China of keeping it's currency weak for years. It's the volatility in the exchange rate which makes it harder for companies to plan reliably, but most will profit from the new level (except airlines). So while there will be some inflation (estimated at 3% at the moment), the economy profits from the exchange rate movements. The underlying problem is that the GBP lost value because of the uncertainty, and this uncertainty is not good for the economy. However, people voted for Brexit and a lot of them are happy with the result. So this uncertainty won't necessarily lead to less consumption. Current economic data looks better than what was anticipated before. So as long as people are happy with the current situation and the outlook, the economy could actually profit from the vote in the short term. The longer term is of course very dependent on the deal that the UK will get. Regarding your other points: A lot of promises were made in the campaign that are completely unrealistic (£200mln a week for the NHS). Not being part of the government makes it easier to ignore those promises. Boris is probably one of the only ones who could face questions at some point, in case the deal isn't as great as he believes. As Conservatives are already in favour of a hard Brexit, it's hard for UKIP to get many voters in that space and to gain more seats in the next election. Farage saw the chance to sell the vote as his win (although he wasn't even part of the official campaign) without having to implement any of the consequences. The party is an absolute mess. They don't seem to have a lot of competent people, so Farage basically had to take over again. I don't think he planned that. Especially as they'll have to find a motto now. Their purpose was to get the UK out of the EU. With that done, the question is why people should vote for them.
s_dev 10y ago
There will be a lot of price hikes coming to the UK so they can expect some high inflation. Pound is weaker so need more of them to achieve same revenue in dollars. I'm utterly fascinated by Brexit -- I'm here in Ireland and it's going to be part disaster part boom depending on how we handle it so it has very real consequences. I think the biggest damage will be that to young people in the UK who will likely be denied the ability to travel as freely to live and work across the EU and this sort of denial of opportunity won't manifest as obvious for many years. We put up the price of our software in the UK once we heard the referendum result and May indicating hard Brexit. On both occasions Sterling dropped.
- dx034 10y ago
  As I wrote in my other comment, inflation at current exchange rates is forecasted to go to ~3% over the next year. That's much higher than currently, but not dangerously high for the economy. At the same time, the volatility of exchange rates are worrying businesses, but the absolute value is probably rather positive for the economy. People will buy more local and exports are cheaper. The economy seems to hold up well and will probably continue to do so until Brexit actually happens. To be clear, I'm absolutely no fan of Brexit, but I don't think that it will have negative effects in the next 1-2 years. In the longer term this may look very different.
  - barrkel 10y ago
    So, Britain has a trade deficit - so a revaluation at a lower level should be a corrective. In many ways, it's been a long time coming. But I'm not so positive on the effects as you are. Britain's manufacturing output, the thing it's most likely able to export when it leaves the EU, has a large imported component in other materials, and the transaction costs there will be higher not just because of lower sterling. Since Britain hasn't been able to compete effectively in manufacturing with Germany while in the EU, I find it hard to believe they'll be able to compete with China when they're out in the same seas. So I don't see a resurgence in manufacturing. Honestly, when you buy something, is British a sign of quality? For me, not in food, not in durable goods, not in almost anything. And Britain's main export is services, which it doesn't have much in the way of trade agreements by default. So that gets screwed by Brexit too. Personally, if Brexit goes through, I'll be leaving the country. I'm Irish living in London, and while I'll probably have working rights grandfathered in (the same way I can vote in national elections, from the history of our two countries), my 3 year plan is geared towards leaving. I'm still only 60% sure Brexit means Brexit, though.
misja111 10y ago
Meanwhile, in Switzerland, businesses are suffering because the Swiss Franc is too strong. There are always two sides to a rising or falling currency. In the case of the weak Pound, it is good for exporting British companies and for tourism.
- paganel 10y ago
  I've been on a 10-day vacation this summer in Switzerland and while I was there I was always asking myself how do the Swiss export-oriented companies manage to stay afloat.
  - detaro 10y ago
    Exporting goods where price is less important once you have people convinced that they want your product: luxury goods, weapons, specialized high-tech devices, medicine (bunch pharma companies are swiss, I don't know how much they produce locally)
- oblio 10y ago
  I don't want to be too mean, but what exactly is Britain exporting? I imagine they're exporting services, especially financial ones. But what else? I honestly don't know.
elcct 10y ago
Every excuse is good to make some more money. Maybe this will make companies look for OSS alternatives. I doubt it will make any impact for government agencies, as they are not spending their own money ;)

49 points by sghi 10y ago

2000s: It's expensive doing business in the UK: price hike 2007: Business needs to be protected from Pound fluctuation: we accepted the new norm that a $500 gadget cost £500 2016: Brexit hurt our company earnings : like I care, we are full stack OSS

imdsm 10y ago
These were my thoughts exactly. Companies can jump on Brexit and hike prices, that's fine, they will be selling less for more, which will bring them the same revenues. We use full stack OSS too, not a penny spent on licences. Have fun with your 22% M$.

hd4 10y ago

Preaching to the converted here, but this is yet another incentive to switch to a Linux distro, thanks Microsoft. Also worth remembering that Britain is still de facto in the EU for a few more years.

mhroth 10y ago
Yes but the pound is tanking _now_ ;)
- hd4 10y ago
  Fluctuating rather than tanking.
  - joncrocks 10y ago
    Repeatedly fluctuating downwards :-)
- DominikR 10y ago
  Britain has basically a Communist running the country right now so it's not really a surprise. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2016/10/05/no-prime-minister-the-government-doesnt-always-know-whats-best/ http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2016/10/05/no-prime-mini... Theresa May could have done all kinds of things to force favourable Brexit terms for the UK. For example she could continuously lower corporate taxes for foreign investment for while not activating Article 50 and simply wait until it really hurts the EU. If the EU doesn't give in the UK continues to wait and makes a lot of money in the process, if it does then the UK also wins. I suspect that the UK's prime minister actually wants to tank the economy to do another Brexit vote. (the EU loves this, just repeat until you get the desired result - that's one of the reasons why the EU will fail) She really wants to join her friends at the Soviet High Command in Brussels again.
  - slgeorge 10y ago
    Don't really think that's realistic. In all honesty, the easiest way to tank the Brexit vote would have been to allow MP's a vote in Parliament - which would have been perfectly constitutionally valid - since the majority of politicians "appear" to be against Brexit. If anything, I see a firmer commitment to Brexit over time - as demonstrated by allowing the banks to leave London by not closing down "hard" Brexit.
  - Xylakant 10y ago
    > For example she could continuously lower corporate taxes for foreign investment for while not activating Article 50 and simply wait until it really hurts the EU. If the EU doesn't give in the UK continues to wait and makes a lot of money in the process, if it does then the UK also wins. As the irish figured out, arbitrarily low corporate taxes are just not possible in the EU. This approach would also alienate all partners that she needs to work with later in the process, so that's probably a pretty bad idea. Additionally, it would put her under massive pressure from the brexit fraction that wants migration control yesterday, no matter the costs. Last but not least, the EU could just take the stance that the continued announcements of the legal government to invoke article 50 constitute sufficient grounds to start the proceedings. The UK could certainly fight this, but well, there's sufficient ways for the EU to make the UK sufficiently miserable in turn. All in all, negotiation tactics that alienate the people on the other side are not a good idea if you're an island and the economy right across the channel is bigger than yours.
- karmacoda 10y ago
  Confidence underlies the economic outlook - the remainers being negative are now the UK's biggest problem.
  - jon-wood 10y ago
    Seriously? The people pointing out how the country is heading down a massively idiotic path because Rupert Murdoch would like us to are the UK's biggest problem? I'm going to list a few other candidates for the UK's biggest problem: * The pound plummeting like a rock. * Xenophobia, bordering on fascism, being advocated by the press. * The gradual, quiet, handing of the NHS to private companies. * Ever growing demand for food banks, most notably by people working jobs that don't pay enough to fulfil basic needs. * The only vaguely viable opposition to the government self-destructing right when they're needed most. But sure, its definitely people complaining that are the problem.
    - karmacoda 10y ago
      * The pound plummeting like a rock. - Expected period of adjustment. * Xenophobia, bordering on fascism, being advocated by the press. - BBC is nothing but a continuous charity appeal. * The gradual, quiet, handing of the NHS to private companies. - Precedes Brexit. * Ever growing demand for food banks, most notably by people working jobs that don't pay enough to fulfil basic needs. - Precedes Brexit. * The only vaguely viable opposition to the government self-destructing right when they're needed most. - Precedes Brexit. Completely off-topic.
      - crottypeter 10y ago
        Yes, the conservatives were in before Brexit. These things are still: >"candidates for the UK's biggest problem"
        imdsm 10y ago
        So much focus on all the potential problems, ignoring all the potential benefits. This is why the world is the way it is.
xabi 10y ago
It's dangerous to go alone!
guitarbill 10y ago
> Also worth remembering that Britain is still de facto in the EU for a few more years. I'd argue Britain is de facto out of the EU already. Anybody planning for the future is operating under this assumption. A few concrete examples: Scientific collaborations, corporate growth plans, and policy-making has all been impacted AFAIK.

wilhil 10y ago

Who knows the truth about Brexit just yet... Trade deals will come in and we will probably get back to where we were - in the long term. ... If/when we get there, any bets Microsoft will not lower pricing?

andygates 10y ago

As a huge healthcare org with solid MS lock-in: ouch. Brexy-fans can say it's "fluctuating not tanking"; we still have to pay more for software (and less for hospital beds, staff, and so on. In big orgs these costs are gibberring). (personally I'm betting on EUR-GBP parity by xmas, because my Cassandra gland is firing overtime)

jstanley 10y ago
What's a Cassandra gland?
- wojcech 10y ago
  If I have to guess, the primary organ used in prediction of the future, especially catastrophes
- kagamine 10y ago
  And how can costs be gibbering? Staggering via autocorrect?
  - andwur 10y ago
    I think they mean that viewing the costs induces gibbering in the viewer.
dx034 10y ago
Don't worry, it was promised that the NHS gets £350m more per week after Brexit. http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/brexit-vote-leave-wipes-nhs-350m-claim-and-rest-of-its-website-after-eu-referendum-a7105546.html http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/brexit-vote-l...

swang 10y ago

I really have no idea bout UK/British politics even though I worked/lived in Europe so... Can someone explain this part of Brexit. Nigel Farage resigns in July 2016 after he wins the vote. Why? Says he did "his job" and didn't want to be a career politician (according to Wiki) Then earlier this month he stepped back in as party leader of UKIP after his replacement was forced(?) out/unable to garner support? Did he just get bored and want his job back? Seems like he has ample time to fly over to the States to pump up Trump. What I'm trying to get at is this whole Brexit triggered a huge depression in the value of the Pound. Yet the Conservatives and UKIP are still in power? Or can no one do anything until the next general elections?

gadders 10y ago
UKIP aren't in power. They have one MP who is an ex-Conservative. Fluctuations in the value of the pound don't normally bring down governments.
agd 10y ago
UKIP are not in power and have never been. They have 1 MP out of 650. In answer to your wider point, I think you're reducing the problem to the value of the pound when there are many more factors at play ('sovereignty', border controls, democracy etc). Plus, many people viewed sterling as overvalued so a fall might not be too bad a thing. It might be that, in time, the negative economic consequences of Brexit affect the Conservatives in the polls but it's too early for that.
dx034 10y ago
Regarding your last point: A depreciation of the currency is generally positive for a country. Expensive imports give incentive to use local products (e.g. food), at the same time exports become more competitive. That is the reason why the US accused China of keeping it's currency weak for years. It's the volatility in the exchange rate which makes it harder for companies to plan reliably, but most will profit from the new level (except airlines). So while there will be some inflation (estimated at 3% at the moment), the economy profits from the exchange rate movements. The underlying problem is that the GBP lost value because of the uncertainty, and this uncertainty is not good for the economy. However, people voted for Brexit and a lot of them are happy with the result. So this uncertainty won't necessarily lead to less consumption. Current economic data looks better than what was anticipated before. So as long as people are happy with the current situation and the outlook, the economy could actually profit from the vote in the short term. The longer term is of course very dependent on the deal that the UK will get. Regarding your other points: A lot of promises were made in the campaign that are completely unrealistic (£200mln a week for the NHS). Not being part of the government makes it easier to ignore those promises. Boris is probably one of the only ones who could face questions at some point, in case the deal isn't as great as he believes. As Conservatives are already in favour of a hard Brexit, it's hard for UKIP to get many voters in that space and to gain more seats in the next election. Farage saw the chance to sell the vote as his win (although he wasn't even part of the official campaign) without having to implement any of the consequences. The party is an absolute mess. They don't seem to have a lot of competent people, so Farage basically had to take over again. I don't think he planned that. Especially as they'll have to find a motto now. Their purpose was to get the UK out of the EU. With that done, the question is why people should vote for them.

s_dev 10y ago

There will be a lot of price hikes coming to the UK so they can expect some high inflation. Pound is weaker so need more of them to achieve same revenue in dollars. I'm utterly fascinated by Brexit -- I'm here in Ireland and it's going to be part disaster part boom depending on how we handle it so it has very real consequences. I think the biggest damage will be that to young people in the UK who will likely be denied the ability to travel as freely to live and work across the EU and this sort of denial of opportunity won't manifest as obvious for many years. We put up the price of our software in the UK once we heard the referendum result and May indicating hard Brexit. On both occasions Sterling dropped.

dx034 10y ago
As I wrote in my other comment, inflation at current exchange rates is forecasted to go to ~3% over the next year. That's much higher than currently, but not dangerously high for the economy. At the same time, the volatility of exchange rates are worrying businesses, but the absolute value is probably rather positive for the economy. People will buy more local and exports are cheaper. The economy seems to hold up well and will probably continue to do so until Brexit actually happens. To be clear, I'm absolutely no fan of Brexit, but I don't think that it will have negative effects in the next 1-2 years. In the longer term this may look very different.
- barrkel 10y ago
  So, Britain has a trade deficit - so a revaluation at a lower level should be a corrective. In many ways, it's been a long time coming. But I'm not so positive on the effects as you are. Britain's manufacturing output, the thing it's most likely able to export when it leaves the EU, has a large imported component in other materials, and the transaction costs there will be higher not just because of lower sterling. Since Britain hasn't been able to compete effectively in manufacturing with Germany while in the EU, I find it hard to believe they'll be able to compete with China when they're out in the same seas. So I don't see a resurgence in manufacturing. Honestly, when you buy something, is British a sign of quality? For me, not in food, not in durable goods, not in almost anything. And Britain's main export is services, which it doesn't have much in the way of trade agreements by default. So that gets screwed by Brexit too. Personally, if Brexit goes through, I'll be leaving the country. I'm Irish living in London, and while I'll probably have working rights grandfathered in (the same way I can vote in national elections, from the history of our two countries), my 3 year plan is geared towards leaving. I'm still only 60% sure Brexit means Brexit, though.

misja111 10y ago

Meanwhile, in Switzerland, businesses are suffering because the Swiss Franc is too strong. There are always two sides to a rising or falling currency. In the case of the weak Pound, it is good for exporting British companies and for tourism.

paganel 10y ago
I've been on a 10-day vacation this summer in Switzerland and while I was there I was always asking myself how do the Swiss export-oriented companies manage to stay afloat.
- detaro 10y ago
  Exporting goods where price is less important once you have people convinced that they want your product: luxury goods, weapons, specialized high-tech devices, medicine (bunch pharma companies are swiss, I don't know how much they produce locally)
oblio 10y ago
I don't want to be too mean, but what exactly is Britain exporting? I imagine they're exporting services, especially financial ones. But what else? I honestly don't know.

elcct 10y ago

Every excuse is good to make some more money. Maybe this will make companies look for OSS alternatives. I doubt it will make any impact for government agencies, as they are not spending their own money ;)