7 ms·

The reality is even if they pardon him, the guy will never be safe in his home country. Thousands of so called "patriots" believe this man is a traitor. Very sa

The reality is even if they pardon him, the guy will never be safe in his home country. Thousands of so called "patriots" believe this man is a traitor. Very sad especially considering what little has changed since the leak.

AdmiralAsshat 10y ago
Thousands believe that Dick Cheney is guilty of war crimes, but as far as I know, no one has tried to kill him yet. I wouldn't completely rule out the idea that someone might take a shot at Snowden were he to return, but at the same time I doubt that the vast majority of people who label him a "traitor" feel strongly enough about it to personally try to kill him.
- 0xFFC 10y ago
  You are wrong. Those two are completely different. People who believes Cheney is war criminal are mostly liberal, non violent side of country. But the other side is nothing like that.
  - theGimp 10y ago
    Liberals can and have been violent in the past. No group large enough is free of extremists.
  - optimuspaul 10y ago
    it's not fair to either side to generalize like that. Also, we're all Liberals in the US, just different flavors of it.
    - ionised 10y ago
      The problem with that statement is a lot of Americans would be foaming at the mouth if you labelled them a liberal due to a severe misundertanding of the meanings of words like 'liberal', 'progressive', 'communist', 'socialist'.
      - optimuspaul 10y ago
        so help me in fixing that or we'll end up with another literally here :)
        ionised 10y ago
        I'm not saying your understanding is wrong, but theirs.
- Terr_ 10y ago
  > but as far as I know, no one has tried to kill him yet. I'm not sure that's quite apples-to-apples, given: (1) US political asymmetries; (2) nobody accused him of conspiring with a clear "The Enemy"; (3) Cheney was already a multimillionaire with private security and moving in rarefied social circles. If Cheney was once hunted by the US government, widely accused of being a communist spy, and he shopped for groceries like a regular person, I imagine the odds of an attempted attack would increase.
  - WildUtah 10y ago
    The US political asymmetries include that gun advocates, peace officers, and ex-military types that probably dislike Snowden most are statistically the least likely Americans to commit violent crime and have not engaged in any kind of systemic political violence in the modern era. It's the left that plans and starts riots e.g. at Trump rallies as WikiLeaks has documented. Only crazies and communists and white supremacists have used assassination as a political tool in America in the modern era and that hasn't even happened in forty years. I expect Snowden would be perfectly safe under a pardon. Until then I'd advise him to avoid long sight lines; America's official enemies have a way of finding themselves exploded at a nice sterile distance.
    - codyb 10y ago
      Is forty years a long time?
- jamisteven 10y ago
  DC is an ex VP, the two are hardly comparable.
ahoy 10y ago
More likely than that is that he be arrested and prosecuted for some other crime, real or invented.
- linkregister 10y ago
  Is there a precedent for that sort of thing in the U.S.?
  - tedunangst 10y ago
    Well, Al Capone was arrested for tax evasion, though of course he was also guilty of tax evasion.
strictnein 10y ago
John Hinckley Jr. is currently living at his mother's home. Certainly the man who tried to kill Reagan would be a greater target than some techie, wouldn't you think?
- nercht12 10y ago
  Not really. Snowden now stands as an icon to the tech world. He's a face of resistance who, despite of being "out of the game" still stands as a sort of historic monument or banner of defiance of the three-letter-agency's dominance. They'd love to have that guy eliminated. Who cares about Hinckley Jr. i.e. His actions didn't merit enough historical relevance to be a continued target. (Not to the same degree, imo)
allworknoplay 10y ago
You sound as if you think this is reason not to pardon him. How about we do what's right and then let him make up his own mind about what the risks are?
mjevans 10y ago
If he's pardoned, presumably his passport and the ability to use it would be re-instated. That would allow Snowden to go mostly anywhere and do as he pleases... instead of being stuck in limbo at an airport or as it currently stands allowed some degree of freedom within Russia. I should point out that pardoning Snowden allows him to LEAVE RUSSIA; which is a thing that I believe anyone should like to allow him to do.

AdmiralAsshat 10y ago

Thousands believe that Dick Cheney is guilty of war crimes, but as far as I know, no one has tried to kill him yet. I wouldn't completely rule out the idea that someone might take a shot at Snowden were he to return, but at the same time I doubt that the vast majority of people who label him a "traitor" feel strongly enough about it to personally try to kill him.

0xFFC 10y ago
You are wrong. Those two are completely different. People who believes Cheney is war criminal are mostly liberal, non violent side of country. But the other side is nothing like that.
- theGimp 10y ago
  Liberals can and have been violent in the past. No group large enough is free of extremists.
- optimuspaul 10y ago
  it's not fair to either side to generalize like that. Also, we're all Liberals in the US, just different flavors of it.
  - ionised 10y ago
    The problem with that statement is a lot of Americans would be foaming at the mouth if you labelled them a liberal due to a severe misundertanding of the meanings of words like 'liberal', 'progressive', 'communist', 'socialist'.
    - optimuspaul 10y ago
      so help me in fixing that or we'll end up with another literally here :)
      - ionised 10y ago
        I'm not saying your understanding is wrong, but theirs.
Terr_ 10y ago
> but as far as I know, no one has tried to kill him yet. I'm not sure that's quite apples-to-apples, given: (1) US political asymmetries; (2) nobody accused him of conspiring with a clear "The Enemy"; (3) Cheney was already a multimillionaire with private security and moving in rarefied social circles. If Cheney was once hunted by the US government, widely accused of being a communist spy, and he shopped for groceries like a regular person, I imagine the odds of an attempted attack would increase.
- WildUtah 10y ago
  The US political asymmetries include that gun advocates, peace officers, and ex-military types that probably dislike Snowden most are statistically the least likely Americans to commit violent crime and have not engaged in any kind of systemic political violence in the modern era. It's the left that plans and starts riots e.g. at Trump rallies as WikiLeaks has documented. Only crazies and communists and white supremacists have used assassination as a political tool in America in the modern era and that hasn't even happened in forty years. I expect Snowden would be perfectly safe under a pardon. Until then I'd advise him to avoid long sight lines; America's official enemies have a way of finding themselves exploded at a nice sterile distance.
  - codyb 10y ago
    Is forty years a long time?
jamisteven 10y ago
DC is an ex VP, the two are hardly comparable.

ahoy 10y ago

More likely than that is that he be arrested and prosecuted for some other crime, real or invented.

linkregister 10y ago
Is there a precedent for that sort of thing in the U.S.?
- tedunangst 10y ago
  Well, Al Capone was arrested for tax evasion, though of course he was also guilty of tax evasion.

strictnein 10y ago

John Hinckley Jr. is currently living at his mother's home. Certainly the man who tried to kill Reagan would be a greater target than some techie, wouldn't you think?

nercht12 10y ago
Not really. Snowden now stands as an icon to the tech world. He's a face of resistance who, despite of being "out of the game" still stands as a sort of historic monument or banner of defiance of the three-letter-agency's dominance. They'd love to have that guy eliminated. Who cares about Hinckley Jr. i.e. His actions didn't merit enough historical relevance to be a continued target. (Not to the same degree, imo)

allworknoplay 10y ago

You sound as if you think this is reason not to pardon him. How about we do what's right and then let him make up his own mind about what the risks are?

mjevans 10y ago

If he's pardoned, presumably his passport and the ability to use it would be re-instated. That would allow Snowden to go mostly anywhere and do as he pleases... instead of being stuck in limbo at an airport or as it currently stands allowed some degree of freedom within Russia. I should point out that pardoning Snowden allows him to LEAVE RUSSIA; which is a thing that I believe anyone should like to allow him to do.