8 ms·

Speaking as a fairly frequent traveler here... In my mind, there are two sets of uniformed people at the airport. "Airline worker" (gate agent, skycap, pilots,

by Sukotto 17y ago

Speaking as a fairly frequent traveler here... In my mind, there are two sets of uniformed people at the airport. "Airline worker" (gate agent, skycap, pilots, etc) who are there to help me.... and "TSA" (Anyone with a badge, possibly a gun, and the ability to basically do whatever the hell they want) who are there to make life demeaning. It doesn't matter to me that the dark blue person is Homeland Security, the pale blue person is Customs, and the in-between blue one is Immigration. They are all equally "the man" and equally capable putting me on the "fuck that guy" list. Intellectually I understand that many of them perform a valuable service. Emotionally I fear (and by extension: hate) them and have grown to dread traveling.

potatolicious 17y ago
CBP is a different sort of dickheadedness than TSA. TSA: Undertrained goons hopped up on terrorism paranoia. Will make your life absolutely miserable if given the prompt to do so (e.g., a tiny contraband item in your carry-on). Can't do too much to make your life miserable outside of missing your flight. CBP: Will. Fuck. You. Up. As a non-American working in the US, I fear the CBP like the motherfucking gestapo. Each agent wields an insane amount of power to alter one's legal status in the USA, and they never hesitate to express this power to you. Unlike the TSA agents, who get no respect from even their employer, CBP goons are given a huge amount of unquestionable leeway in their jobs. I've seen TSA workers cite regulation after regulation to make a traveler's life hell - but they've always been professional at least on the surface. I've seen CBP agents be blatantly racist, insulting, and grossly unprofessional and conduct themselves in ways unbecoming of a human being, much less a government representative. And there's not a damn thing that can be done.
- nfnaaron 17y ago
  I used to drive from Seattle to Vancouver for the weekend a few times a year, in the eighties, back when terrorism was something that happened on page six. Driving in to Canada, their border guards were always pleasant, smiling and welcoming. They made me feel like they wanted me to visit. Driving back to the US, our border guards seemed to feel like I was a criminal. I felt unwelcome in my own country. I felt "wanted." I actually had to sit on the Group W bench once. The guard asked me a question, and I didn't hear him correctly. So I said "what?" I was polite (knowing who I was talking to). "Out of the car." And they searched my car. Because I said "what?"
- jrockway 17y ago
  I'm a US citizen, and my experience has been the opposite. Of course, US Immigration/Customs is not nearly as nice as immigration in other countries, but that's to be expected. (When I visit Norway and Denmark, the immigration people actually smile at you. When I visited Germany, the immigration officer actually laughed at something I said. It's like they are real people or something!)
  - ugh 17y ago
    Why is that to be expected?
    - dedward 17y ago
      Because when something happens over and over and over again, you tend to expect it to keep happening.
      - jrockway 17y ago
        Because the US takes immigration and police in general too seriously. Everyone is a criminal. Nobody is to be trusted. Compare this to Europe (minus the UK and France), where people in positions of authority treat you nicely until they have a solid reason to do otherwise. "Cultural difference" or whatever.
  - ojbyrne 17y ago
    Presumably because you're a citizen, they can't actually refuse you entry because they missed their morning coffee. Those of us who work legally in the US, but aren't citizens, have a different experience. Sometimes I feel like reminding them, that I too pay for their salary.
- dhimes 17y ago
  I've seen CBP agents be blatantly racist, insulting, and grossly unprofessional As with a sibling poster, I am also a US citizen. Hearing about this infuriates me, especially, perhaps, on the anniversary of the Christian White Boy's bombing of the OK City Murrah building. That was terrorism, plain and simple. There's just no excuse for that behavior. I'm not sure what I can do about it personally, but if you have an idea I'd like to hear it.
  - cpr 17y ago
    Calling him Christian as an epithet doesn't add to your case. You wouldn't do it if he were Muslim or Jewish. How about just "criminally insane"?
    - dhimes 17y ago
      It's exactly my point. When these "authorities" profile for terrorists, they are looking for middle eastern Muslims. The idea that they justify to themselves mistreating these people because of their ethnicity bothers me a lot. I point out that there are terrorist Christians, too.
      - cpr 17y ago
        Sure, 1 we know of at this kind of scale, perhaps there's another I'm forgetting. Compared to how many hundreds of thousands (millions?) of Muslim terrorists who are out there right now? I'm not trying to pick on Muslims (we know that about 90% of Muslims are not radicalized Wahhabis); just pointing out the reality of the situation.
        dhimes 17y ago
        reality of the situation I submit that's your perception. I'm not going to go deeply into this (because it's not the forum for it) but I'll simply say that if we don't enforce rigorous mental discipline on ourselves then what we perceive as a terrorist act vs "civil" conflict can be clouded by how we feel about its outcome rather than whom (and how) it targets. By that I mean, for example, someone who kills abortion doctors may consider his act not one of terrorism, the killing of innocent civilians, but one of justice because he is killing a killer. how many hundreds of thousands (millions?) of Muslim terrorists who are out there right now Doubtful. The entire Al Qaeda organization was estimated to be 5000 strong just after 9/11. Now, I know that Bush's policies brought a lot more into the fold but I would be surprised if there were hundreds of thousands of actual terrorists. That would be like me saying that all right to lifers were on a par with the killers among them. There are even some who may think the killing is partially justified (that is, understandable) but who wouldn't actually go so far as to carry it out. (You can swap PETA for right-to-lifers if you like.)

by Sukotto 17y ago

potatolicious 17y ago

CBP is a different sort of dickheadedness than TSA. TSA: Undertrained goons hopped up on terrorism paranoia. Will make your life absolutely miserable if given the prompt to do so (e.g., a tiny contraband item in your carry-on). Can't do too much to make your life miserable outside of missing your flight. CBP: Will. Fuck. You. Up. As a non-American working in the US, I fear the CBP like the motherfucking gestapo. Each agent wields an insane amount of power to alter one's legal status in the USA, and they never hesitate to express this power to you. Unlike the TSA agents, who get no respect from even their employer, CBP goons are given a huge amount of unquestionable leeway in their jobs. I've seen TSA workers cite regulation after regulation to make a traveler's life hell - but they've always been professional at least on the surface. I've seen CBP agents be blatantly racist, insulting, and grossly unprofessional and conduct themselves in ways unbecoming of a human being, much less a government representative. And there's not a damn thing that can be done.

nfnaaron 17y ago
I used to drive from Seattle to Vancouver for the weekend a few times a year, in the eighties, back when terrorism was something that happened on page six. Driving in to Canada, their border guards were always pleasant, smiling and welcoming. They made me feel like they wanted me to visit. Driving back to the US, our border guards seemed to feel like I was a criminal. I felt unwelcome in my own country. I felt "wanted." I actually had to sit on the Group W bench once. The guard asked me a question, and I didn't hear him correctly. So I said "what?" I was polite (knowing who I was talking to). "Out of the car." And they searched my car. Because I said "what?"
jrockway 17y ago
I'm a US citizen, and my experience has been the opposite. Of course, US Immigration/Customs is not nearly as nice as immigration in other countries, but that's to be expected. (When I visit Norway and Denmark, the immigration people actually smile at you. When I visited Germany, the immigration officer actually laughed at something I said. It's like they are real people or something!)
- ugh 17y ago
  Why is that to be expected?
  - dedward 17y ago
    Because when something happens over and over and over again, you tend to expect it to keep happening.
    - jrockway 17y ago
      Because the US takes immigration and police in general too seriously. Everyone is a criminal. Nobody is to be trusted. Compare this to Europe (minus the UK and France), where people in positions of authority treat you nicely until they have a solid reason to do otherwise. "Cultural difference" or whatever.
- ojbyrne 17y ago
  Presumably because you're a citizen, they can't actually refuse you entry because they missed their morning coffee. Those of us who work legally in the US, but aren't citizens, have a different experience. Sometimes I feel like reminding them, that I too pay for their salary.
dhimes 17y ago
I've seen CBP agents be blatantly racist, insulting, and grossly unprofessional As with a sibling poster, I am also a US citizen. Hearing about this infuriates me, especially, perhaps, on the anniversary of the Christian White Boy's bombing of the OK City Murrah building. That was terrorism, plain and simple. There's just no excuse for that behavior. I'm not sure what I can do about it personally, but if you have an idea I'd like to hear it.
- cpr 17y ago
  Calling him Christian as an epithet doesn't add to your case. You wouldn't do it if he were Muslim or Jewish. How about just "criminally insane"?
  - dhimes 17y ago
    It's exactly my point. When these "authorities" profile for terrorists, they are looking for middle eastern Muslims. The idea that they justify to themselves mistreating these people because of their ethnicity bothers me a lot. I point out that there are terrorist Christians, too.
    - cpr 17y ago
      Sure, 1 we know of at this kind of scale, perhaps there's another I'm forgetting. Compared to how many hundreds of thousands (millions?) of Muslim terrorists who are out there right now? I'm not trying to pick on Muslims (we know that about 90% of Muslims are not radicalized Wahhabis); just pointing out the reality of the situation.
      - dhimes 17y ago
        reality of the situation I submit that's your perception. I'm not going to go deeply into this (because it's not the forum for it) but I'll simply say that if we don't enforce rigorous mental discipline on ourselves then what we perceive as a terrorist act vs "civil" conflict can be clouded by how we feel about its outcome rather than whom (and how) it targets. By that I mean, for example, someone who kills abortion doctors may consider his act not one of terrorism, the killing of innocent civilians, but one of justice because he is killing a killer. how many hundreds of thousands (millions?) of Muslim terrorists who are out there right now Doubtful. The entire Al Qaeda organization was estimated to be 5000 strong just after 9/11. Now, I know that Bush's policies brought a lot more into the fold but I would be surprised if there were hundreds of thousands of actual terrorists. That would be like me saying that all right to lifers were on a par with the killers among them. There are even some who may think the killing is partially justified (that is, understandable) but who wouldn't actually go so far as to carry it out. (You can swap PETA for right-to-lifers if you like.)